JeremyUsborne
Banned
I wouldn't call it drastic, no. And don't forget that he played almost twice as much in his sophomore year. He also arguably regressed from SO to JR.
Brady Ellingson Commits to Iowa
- Thread starter HawkeyeBA
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I wouldn't call it drastic, no. And don't forget that he played almost twice as much in his sophomore year. He also arguably regressed from SO to JR.
His KenPom offensive rating went from 88.7 to 107.8, his assist rate from 13.8% to 24.0% while decreasing his TO rate from 17% to 15.6%. So he played over 10 minutes more per game, played much more efficiently in a larger role and went from a line of 5.7/2.4/1.3 to 11.5/3.8/3.6 and his true shooting percentage went from 43.3 to 52.1. If that's not significant improvement, I have no idea what you classify as drastic improvement.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
Two years ago we were awful at D, last year we were good. Last year we couldn't hit a 3, this year we will be improved (that alone will lead to more wins). Combine that with natural player progression, plus adding 2 new players and this team is gonna be better once again this year (as Fran's teams have improved every year)
While Hoiberg has taken teams that haven't played together to the Dance the last 2 years, don't confuse those teams with this one. The players he rode to the Dance the previous 2 years were all legit high level D1 players (White, Christopherson, Allen, Babb, Lucious, McGee, Clyburn). That is NOT what he has coming in to his program now. He has Kane, who is legit, but the others are JUCO players who were not highly sought after, or FR.
I think ISU would be wise to take notes from the football program this year. ISU is a 50/50 shot to make the Dance this year, so they shouldn't act like they are world beaters.
JeremyUsborne
Banned
Be honest, were you heaping this much praise on ISU's transfers before the last two seasons?
I doubt it. Most of us (self included) thought it was a desperate attempt at jump-starting their program after McDermott ran it into the ground. White, Allen, and Lucious were all written off as head-cases. Babb was an underutilized player from Penn State, one of the worst basketball programs in the country. People said Clyburn's numbers were due to him playing in a soft leauge (like what some are saying about Kane). Christopherson hadn't played a game for Marquette, and was ho-hum under McDermott before Hoiberg got him to flourish. And McGee was a JUCO player!
If there's one lesson I've learned about criticizing Hoiberg, it's not to question his ability to identify talent and get the most out of it. But my whole point is that's not our situation. It's an apples-to-oranges comparison.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
I was highly critical of the transfer strategy, not because of the talent, but because I felt one of them would flake out (White) and ruin the whole strategy. I have also praised Hoiberg with the results he has gotten the last two year, he took a chance and it paid off.
All of that is irrelevant, as I am strictly looking at the talent of the players on the team from 2 years ago, last year, and now. The talent level of Scotty, White, Allen, Lucious, Babb, Clyburn, and McGee is much greater than Kane, 2 JUCO's and 3 FR.
White was a risk that turned into a home run for ISU. The other four transfers (Clyburn, Allen, Luscious, and Babb) were pretty much exactly the same player they were at the previous school.
Clyburn's offensive rating his last year at Utah was 107.6, it was 107.5 at ISU. Chris Babb's offensive rating his last year at Penn St was 112.5 it was 111.4 his first year at ISU. Allen's offensive rating his last two years at MSU was 101.4 and 109.8, it was 101.8 his yeat at ISU.
Hoiberg has done a great job of picking up talent, but none of these players have shown much improvement under Hoiberg. They were already solid players before they came to ISU.
Let me know when preseason rankings mean something, we were picked 8th the Big 12 the last two years and we all saw how that turned out.
Home team won 9 of last 10, home court is huge in basketball.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
You are right, preseason rankings mean nothing on where the teams will finish. I am pointing out that most people expect good things for Iowa, and see the team much much differently than what Clown fans see.
No denying that. But judging the relative quality of each team according to the outcomes of games against common opponents played in different environments at different times of the year certainly isn't a better measure.
Iowa, Detroit, Washington St and Texas Tech, so yeah I would say he was not highly sought after at all.
You forgot Mizzou
So a Mizzou offer means he's highly sought after?
Well in that case I would like to introduce you to our highly sought after SG recruit we just landed:
Brady Ellingson - Yahoo! Sports
Mizzou is never a bad offer to have for basketball
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
Hogue is not even in the same league as other ISU transfers. Like 33 said, Ellingson says hi with the Mizzou offer as well.
Those FR are FR, they are not kids who have all played starter minutes for D1 schools, there is a learning curve. You have a few nice recruits, but lets not confuse them with the Vaughn's or the world, or even top 50 kids. They are all like 80-125 kids.
I think ISU is much better next year than this year. Fred has pushed the time line back with all the transfer instead of going with HS recruits right away. This is the year he is starting to switch it over, and the future will be bright for them with Thomas, Morris, SDG, Custer coming in next year along with Cunningham?? and maybe a big fish in Vaughn?? I'm telling you right now, this year is the transition year, and they aren't going to be as good as many Clown fans think it will, I think it is 50/50 at best they make the NCAA.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
70-80% The only reason they don't would be injuries, which can happen to anyone (Kentucky...cough, cough). If they stay healthy, there is ZERO reason they shouldn't make the NCAA's with a good seed at that.
I felt Iowa was about a 50/50 shot last year, and they missed out.
Thomas' offer list is much more unimpressive than I expected.
