Actually, Ferentz has a losing record against Iowa State, not a 3 to 1 win ratio.
We have to think bigger than ISU, UNI, and Drake
- Thread starter HaydenHawk56
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Actually, Ferentz has a losing record against Iowa State, not a 3 to 1 win ratio.
HaydenHawk56
Well-Known Member
I love how some people are coming out hurling insults and instead of explaining their reasoning for keeping the instate schools.
"Did your parents have any children." "You are a moron." Seriously people.
And Cyber overall he has a losing record, but I'm looking at recent trends. And, it is probably a safe bet that Ferentz will win 2 games against ISU for every three games he plays them.
If 10 games were played the way things are going I would be willing to bet Iowa wins about 6 of those games. Iowa is still the better program in football overall.
"Did your parents have any children." "You are a moron." Seriously people.
And Cyber overall he has a losing record, but I'm looking at recent trends. And, it is probably a safe bet that Ferentz will win 2 games against ISU for every three games he plays them.
If 10 games were played the way things are going I would be willing to bet Iowa wins about 6 of those games. Iowa is still the better program in football overall.
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1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
I don't see the point in getting pounded by Duke, UNC, UK by 30+ at this point in time.. Yeah, it might be more "exciting" to see those games on the schedule, but have fun actually WATCHING those games. It's not much fun watching games where we're down by 20 at halftime.
I tend to agree with the folks that say we should be able to handle teams like Creighton, Campbell, UNI, etc. before we even consider trying to schedule games like this.
That said, I wouldn't mind more games against lower to mid-tier major conference schools. Teams like Boston College, Texas Tech, DePaul, Arkansas, etc. Teams that we have a shot at beating, but don't make me yawn when I see them on the schedule.
There definitely needs to be some creampuffs on the schedule, but 12 games against directional state mid-majors = boring.
I tend to agree with the folks that say we should be able to handle teams like Creighton, Campbell, UNI, etc. before we even consider trying to schedule games like this.
That said, I wouldn't mind more games against lower to mid-tier major conference schools. Teams like Boston College, Texas Tech, DePaul, Arkansas, etc. Teams that we have a shot at beating, but don't make me yawn when I see them on the schedule.
There definitely needs to be some creampuffs on the schedule, but 12 games against directional state mid-majors = boring.
Cyclones17
Well-Known Member
You can play Iowa, ISU, Drake, UNI in the non conference and still schedule a couple tough games. ISU did it two years ago when they played Duke.
Every year Duke plays Davidson and UNC Greensboro. How is that any different than ISU and Iowa playing UNI and Drake? Now if you want to argue that ISU and Iowa shouldn't play at their place, I'll listen. I'd disagree but I'd listen. Not playing them at all is cowardly.
Wouldn't you rather lose to a good team like UNI that people have heard of nationally than lose to Cambpell? Or hell get beat by 35 to Duke? Getting killed by those teams doesn't do any good for you
Every year Duke plays Davidson and UNC Greensboro. How is that any different than ISU and Iowa playing UNI and Drake? Now if you want to argue that ISU and Iowa shouldn't play at their place, I'll listen. I'd disagree but I'd listen. Not playing them at all is cowardly.
Wouldn't you rather lose to a good team like UNI that people have heard of nationally than lose to Cambpell? Or hell get beat by 35 to Duke? Getting killed by those teams doesn't do any good for you
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
I agree with this. I think Iowa & ISU should continue the series as it is right now. It's Big 10 vs. Big XII and I don't see any reason not to play it.
+1 to the fact that we can still play the in-state schools and schedule a couple more tougher games. There's plenty of room in the non-conference schedule to do this, and still have some cupcake games.
Cyclones17
Well-Known Member
I'm not trolling when I say that Iowa has a pathetic non conference slate this year. ISU had one last year. I think Iowa's SOS is in the 300's right now. So my point is that Iowa can schedule a couple tough games and still have a manageable non conference
hawkforlife9
Well-Known Member
The fact is, we wouldn't be having this discussion if we didn't SUCK so bad. If we were kicking their ***** like the good ole days, they would be perfect tune up wins for the BIG10 season. It is so sad that the program has sunk to the point where we need to schedule teams (Campbell) worse than Drake, UNI and ISU to buy three wins. Pathetic.
HaydenHawk56
Well-Known Member
Why should we I think is the point. Because it is the nice thing to do to play the other schools in the state? I think Hawkeye Nation should not be held to playing anyone because it is the nice thing to do. If you want Big Ten vs Big 12, why not have Iowa play Kansas, or Texas, or Missouri for example. It gets us out of the state territory and gets more exposure out of state.
It has nothing to do with us being down in basketball, nothing to do with us being scared, but has everything to do with looking at the future and where we want to take this program.
We have to look out what is best for us.....not what is best for the other state schools I'm sure that is what ISU and the other schools are doing as well and they don't want to lose us because that is a highlight game for them.
If Fran can get these directional schools off of our schedule, upgrade the schedule, while rebuilding the program, I'm all for it.
It has nothing to do with us being down in basketball, nothing to do with us being scared, but has everything to do with looking at the future and where we want to take this program.
We have to look out what is best for us.....not what is best for the other state schools I'm sure that is what ISU and the other schools are doing as well and they don't want to lose us because that is a highlight game for them.
If Fran can get these directional schools off of our schedule, upgrade the schedule, while rebuilding the program, I'm all for it.
Cover3
Well-Known Member
Everybody's right who is saying that we don't need to exchange the in-state teams to get a tougher schedule. I'm not going to link to some of their past schedules, but Michigan State almost annually runs a gauntlet in the non-conference schedule, and as a result, they've gotten into the tournament some years with only 17-18 wins.
If Iowa gets back to being a tournament contender (I think they will), they'll have a fine schedule if they drop Chicago St, N Illinois, and IPFW for three top-25-level teams. Dropping the in-state schools to keep those patsies on the schedule won't endear us to the selection committee, even if we add a couple top teams.
If revenue and number of home games are the problem, though, I do agree with the crowd that says most major teams play their in-state mid-majors only at home. That's a development that might not be too unreasonable for Iowa to seek (home & home w/ ISU, Drake and UNI in Carver most years).
hawkforlife9
Well-Known Member
If we replaced the Drakes of the world with lower RPI schools, what would we have left? Every major does it???? North Carolina has Michigan State, Wisconsin, Kentucky, Texas and others in their Nov & Dec schedule. They want to be ready for both the conference, and the NCAA tourney by playing tough schools. If we dilute our schedule even further, we won't ever be able to compete. We are chicken *****.
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
And the depressing part is that Iowa is 5-4 against that.
Looks like it's in the 330's according to kenpom:
http://kenpom.com/
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Cyclones17
Well-Known Member
What you so badly fail to see is that Fran isn't going to schedule 13 non conference games against power teams. No way. He will schedule 3 tops. So you have 10 games left. Why not play in state teams?
and to think we had to give up playing UNC and Arizona under Mr. Davis just to make room for mighty UNI and Drake
UNI is so important the Nation wide broadcasting station channel 7 carried it
oh wait the only people that got to see the game were in NE Iowa
ISU is a game i'd like to see continue
UNI is so important the Nation wide broadcasting station channel 7 carried it
oh wait the only people that got to see the game were in NE Iowa
ISU is a game i'd like to see continue
clicheusername3
Banned
Well said Shane. UNI is probably going to be the institution to announce that they are the ones dumping the Hawks. UNI can get a bigger fish because they will go on the road, and know that win or lose, it will help them in the POSTSEASON both in terms of play and their RPI.
The same delusional fans spewing the same delusional garbage around here. Let's get to over .500 for a season before we even talk about moving on to bigger and better things.
Hawkeye11en1
Well-Known Member
What you fail to realize, is that we are not "better" than any of our in-state rivals at basketball. It is in the same interest for ISU to play Iowa as it is for Iowa to play ISU. It's not like it's better for them and it only hurts us.
HaydenHawk56
Well-Known Member
http://www.hawkeyenation.com/forum/members/hawkeye11en1.htmlHawkeye11en1 I don't fail to realize the point you are arguing. If you can read, if you can read, I said are program is down. We can play someone other than ISU and do just fine. And, hopefully Fran will get that accomplished.
http://www.hawkeyenation.com/forum/members/hawkeye11en1.html
http://www.hawkeyenation.com/forum/members/hawkeye11en1.html
We should continue to play all these schools in basketball. college basketball is getting less relevant every year; at least the regular season is. Do I want to watch a game against Brown or Drake? Give me a break. Many of us went to college and have friends, neighbors, siblings, cousins , etc. who have went to uni,drake, and iowa st. Personally, i have had 6 relatives go the 4 schools. This is one thing that makes iowa good in my opinion, from a sports perspective. I would not want to see that change.
HaydenHawk56,
I think your reasons for dropping ISU, UNI, Drake are as follows:
1. UofI is the better program in the state and shouldn't play teams that can use them to justify their existance. UNI (recently) and ISU (since about 1985) are on par with UofI (if you don't believe this, then prove me wrong). Those schools don't need UofI to justify their existance.
2. UofI draws a national audience for their games. Um, as many of your bretheren here have said: No, they don't.
3. Playing Duke, UNC, etc. would enhance UofI's reputation.
A. I don't think those schools are willing to play a home and home with UofI.
B. Getting blown out by those schools would only solidify UofI's current reputation as an also ran school currently in the bottom 1/3 of DI BCS basketball programs.
4. If UofiI didn't play ISU, UNI, and Drake, they could schedule better teams. Why do they need to drop these three to get those? When (IF) UofI re-establishes themselves as the best team in the state, you get three automatic wins AND you can add a few national programs to the slate. You don't have to trade one for the other.
5. The ISU/UNI/Drake games only garner attention in Iowa. How wide was the coverage of the other UofI basketball games?
Have I missed anything?
Is that really your logic? If so, it is flawed. Without a logical arguement, your reasoning is emotional and sounds like you just can't accept losing to other (equally talented) teams in the state. You want to eliminate those games so that you can hold onto the outdated opinion that UofI is the best and only program in the state.
I think your reasons for dropping ISU, UNI, Drake are as follows:
1. UofI is the better program in the state and shouldn't play teams that can use them to justify their existance. UNI (recently) and ISU (since about 1985) are on par with UofI (if you don't believe this, then prove me wrong). Those schools don't need UofI to justify their existance.
2. UofI draws a national audience for their games. Um, as many of your bretheren here have said: No, they don't.
3. Playing Duke, UNC, etc. would enhance UofI's reputation.
A. I don't think those schools are willing to play a home and home with UofI.
B. Getting blown out by those schools would only solidify UofI's current reputation as an also ran school currently in the bottom 1/3 of DI BCS basketball programs.
4. If UofiI didn't play ISU, UNI, and Drake, they could schedule better teams. Why do they need to drop these three to get those? When (IF) UofI re-establishes themselves as the best team in the state, you get three automatic wins AND you can add a few national programs to the slate. You don't have to trade one for the other.
5. The ISU/UNI/Drake games only garner attention in Iowa. How wide was the coverage of the other UofI basketball games?
Have I missed anything?
Is that really your logic? If so, it is flawed. Without a logical arguement, your reasoning is emotional and sounds like you just can't accept losing to other (equally talented) teams in the state. You want to eliminate those games so that you can hold onto the outdated opinion that UofI is the best and only program in the state.
The average high school junior in this state is 17 years old. They have little, of any memory of Iowa having a quality basketball program. In their lifetime, the best basketball program is and has been UNI. Yes, Iowa is bigger and in the Big Ten, but they suck. Kids don't want to play for a school that gets their @ss kicked every night. When I was a kid, Iowa sucked at football and basketball. I didn't even know they had a team. Then, when I was in high school, out of the blue, the basketball team made the final 4. The next year, the football team made it to the Rose Bowl, and a brand name was born. Iowa has NOT always been the best program in Iowa. In the 70s it was Iowa State in football. In the 60s and 70s in basketball, it was Drake. My point is that this stuff goes in cycles. UNI should be the ones dropping Iowa and scheduling the big boys, even if it has to be away. It would make them even better and help with recruiting even more. UNI has outgrown Iowa, and the 20 year cycle that was marked by Iowa's dominance in basketball is long over. The OP is pining for the days when that wasn't the case. Welcome to the new normal.
HaydenHawk56
Well-Known Member
In response to agcy68:
HaydenHawk56,
I think your reasons for dropping ISU, UNI, Drake are as follows:
1. UofI is the better program in the state and shouldn't play teams that can use them to justify their existance. UNI (recently) and ISU (since about 1985) are on par with UofI (if you don't believe this, then prove me wrong). Those schools don't need UofI to justify their existance.
Answer I don't want to give them any extra help on our way re-establishing ourselves as the top dog. We can do better scheduling national opponents. Sure you do, or you would not care if we were playing or not.
2. UofI draws a national audience for their games. Um, as many of your bretheren here have said: No, they don't.
Sure they do....when they play on ESPN at least regional with the Big Ten Network. I want to play more on ESPN.....not the Cyclone Network. We can do better.
3. Playing Duke, UNC, etc. would enhance UofI's reputation.
A. I don't think those schools are willing to play a home and home with UofI.
Why not....we are a Big Ten school......and it does not necessarily have to be Duke or North Carolina. Like someone mentioned it could be UCLA, UNLV, Florida, etc. We can do better than ISU, UNI, and Drake in future scheduling.
B. Getting blown out by those schools would only solidify UofI's current reputation as an also ran school currently in the bottom 1/3 of DI BCS basketball programs.
Right now we would lose big, but I don't think 2 years from now. We can do better.
4. If UofiI didn't play ISU, UNI, and Drake, they could schedule better teams. Why do they need to drop these three to get those? When (IF) UofI re-establishes themselves as the best team in the state, you get three automatic wins AND you can add a few national programs to the slate. You don't have to trade one for the other.
Who cares about playing ISU, UNI, and Drake (only people stuck on tradition and the other schools needing us for their Superbowl). Boring, we can do better for future scheduling.
5. The ISU/UNI/Drake games only garner attention in Iowa. How wide was the coverage of the other UofI basketball games?
Exactly.....the ISU/UNI/Drake games only garner attention in Iowa. We can do better.
Have I missed anything?
Yes. Who cares about ISU, UNI and Drake? I care about the University of Iowa and rebuilding this program and upgrading scheduling. Let those schools play each other. We have to take the high road and do what is best for us on a national scale and stop being stuck in micro traditions. We can do better.
Is that really your logic? If so, it is flawed. Without a logical arguement, your reasoning is emotional and sounds like you just can't accept losing to other (equally talented) teams in the state. You want to eliminate those games so that you can hold onto the outdated opinion that UofI is the best and only program in the state.
No. I want to play better teams and get national exposure for the program. We can do better. And I know the other state schools are scared to death of losing us off of the schedule because we give you exposure a few nights out of the year (both in football and basketball). We don't need you, but you need us. Sorry, we can do better. And hopefully, Fran will be able to upgrade the schedule without the other state schools on it.
I share the vision that I only care what is best for our program. And I agree with Fran, you play the best teams you can nationally. And when you schedule cream-puffs make them come to your place. That requires not being held to playing MVC teams and a typically lower to middle of the road Big 12 team. Now, maybe if we have an open date in our home schedule, we could consider fitting you in every once and awhile. But, we will not be dictated to in the future about who we play and that certainly includes by little brother and
little cousins. It should be a privilege to play us, not a right.
HaydenHawk56,
I think your reasons for dropping ISU, UNI, Drake are as follows:
1. UofI is the better program in the state and shouldn't play teams that can use them to justify their existance. UNI (recently) and ISU (since about 1985) are on par with UofI (if you don't believe this, then prove me wrong). Those schools don't need UofI to justify their existance.
Answer I don't want to give them any extra help on our way re-establishing ourselves as the top dog. We can do better scheduling national opponents. Sure you do, or you would not care if we were playing or not.
2. UofI draws a national audience for their games. Um, as many of your bretheren here have said: No, they don't.
Sure they do....when they play on ESPN at least regional with the Big Ten Network. I want to play more on ESPN.....not the Cyclone Network. We can do better.
3. Playing Duke, UNC, etc. would enhance UofI's reputation.
A. I don't think those schools are willing to play a home and home with UofI.
Why not....we are a Big Ten school......and it does not necessarily have to be Duke or North Carolina. Like someone mentioned it could be UCLA, UNLV, Florida, etc. We can do better than ISU, UNI, and Drake in future scheduling.
B. Getting blown out by those schools would only solidify UofI's current reputation as an also ran school currently in the bottom 1/3 of DI BCS basketball programs.
Right now we would lose big, but I don't think 2 years from now. We can do better.
4. If UofiI didn't play ISU, UNI, and Drake, they could schedule better teams. Why do they need to drop these three to get those? When (IF) UofI re-establishes themselves as the best team in the state, you get three automatic wins AND you can add a few national programs to the slate. You don't have to trade one for the other.
Who cares about playing ISU, UNI, and Drake (only people stuck on tradition and the other schools needing us for their Superbowl). Boring, we can do better for future scheduling.
5. The ISU/UNI/Drake games only garner attention in Iowa. How wide was the coverage of the other UofI basketball games?
Exactly.....the ISU/UNI/Drake games only garner attention in Iowa. We can do better.
Have I missed anything?
Yes. Who cares about ISU, UNI and Drake? I care about the University of Iowa and rebuilding this program and upgrading scheduling. Let those schools play each other. We have to take the high road and do what is best for us on a national scale and stop being stuck in micro traditions. We can do better.
Is that really your logic? If so, it is flawed. Without a logical arguement, your reasoning is emotional and sounds like you just can't accept losing to other (equally talented) teams in the state. You want to eliminate those games so that you can hold onto the outdated opinion that UofI is the best and only program in the state.
No. I want to play better teams and get national exposure for the program. We can do better. And I know the other state schools are scared to death of losing us off of the schedule because we give you exposure a few nights out of the year (both in football and basketball). We don't need you, but you need us. Sorry, we can do better. And hopefully, Fran will be able to upgrade the schedule without the other state schools on it.
I share the vision that I only care what is best for our program. And I agree with Fran, you play the best teams you can nationally. And when you schedule cream-puffs make them come to your place. That requires not being held to playing MVC teams and a typically lower to middle of the road Big 12 team. Now, maybe if we have an open date in our home schedule, we could consider fitting you in every once and awhile. But, we will not be dictated to in the future about who we play and that certainly includes by little brother and
little cousins. It should be a privilege to play us, not a right.
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