This lawyer thinks JoePa acted correctly both morally and ethically

[theboat]

He provided this information in 2002. That is nine years ago... How much time passes until you say, hmmmm wonder what is being done with the Sandusky investigation?

I had a guy at work think he was having a heart attack one day. I didn't know him at all other than just working in the same facility, but the first thing I did the next day was to ask to make sure he was OK. It doesn't take a whole lot to follow up on this, unless you don't want to know the answer.

 

[homes]

No need for personal attacks. He was not defending Paterno in any way, he was just stating that though we all think we would do the right thing, we just don't know. History provides a long and infamous list of people who looked the other way as atrocities occurred. We can all read the grand jury testimony and pound our chests about how we would have done the right thing, and we all believe that in our heart of hearts (I know I do). But the truth of the matter is that many people, including many of the chest-pounders on this thread, would do what Paterno did. It doesn't make it right, it is just what history has shown us over and over.

I swear I am not CP87, although I would have written the exact same words.

 

[blkngldFRO]

People aren't going out of their way to defend him, anymore than you or anyone else is going out of their way to persecute him.

The reality is there are many people that have culpability in this. At the top is Sandusky and at the bottom is the GA.

JoePa's culpability is probably somewhere between naivity in thinking those above him would do or were doing the right thing once he passed it up the chain of command, to complicity in the conspiracy to cover everything up.

I don't know anyone has enough info to determin where in that scale he is, but from everything I've seen I'm leaning to the former.

To be completely accurate the bottom is the group of Janitors that did nothing. If any of them are still there they should be gone as well. I am more outrage with those individuals. While Joe did not morally do the right thing, he at least did do something (he should have called the police). There is no way that you can defend what has occurred in this situation. I will say that all involved should no longer be employed with Penn State. No matter your level of employment.

 

[blkngldFRO]

Joe is the most powerful man at Penn State period. His assistant came to him. He should have stopped it right then and there. Gone to the police that night. Instead, as many have said, he and everyone else went into self preservation mode. Now all of the kids after that had to suffer because these DBs did the what was "legally required of them" It's all BS

I think it is impossible to say what they did that day with out being in the room. If the GA was the one that witnessed it why didn't he pick up the phone and called the police? Why didn't the GA's father have his son call the police. If I ready the report correctly they did not go to Joe till the next day.

I feel that if we are going to place blame, then it should start with that GA. His first call should not have been to his Dad, but to the police.

 

[tm3308]

I think it is impossible to say what they did that day with out being in the room. If the GA was the one that witnessed it why didn't he pick up the phone and called the police? Why didn't the GA's father have his son call the police. If I ready the report correctly they did not go to Joe till the next day.

I feel that if we are going to place blame, then it should start with that GA. His first call should not have been to his Dad, but to the police.

While that is true, JoePa is equally guilty of the exact same offense (calling someone other than the police).

You can't fry one and not the other.

 

[CP87]

To be completely accurate the bottom is the group of Janitors that did nothing. If any of them are still there they should be gone as well. I am more outrage with those individuals. While Joe did not morally do the right thing, he at least did do something (he should have called the police). There is no way that you can defend what has occurred in this situation. I will say that all involved should no longer be employed with Penn State. No matter your level of employment.

The janitor who witnessed it was so distressed that co-workers thought he would have a heart attack and die. This janitor's superior, to whom he relayed the incident, testified before the grand jury that the janitor was on the verge of a breakdown. He also testified that the janitor was a Korean War vet, yet he stated that we he saw in the shower was more disturbing than anything he ever saw in combat. The janitor, along with his colleagues to whom he also relayed the incident, were worried that their jobs may be at risk if they came forward. That janitor is currently in a nursing home suffering from severe dementia, and as such he could not testify to the grand jury.

 

[ThunderHawk]

This lawyer, i.e. me, thinks Joe Pa and every other adult who had knowledge of this sordid activity is culpable in the destruction of God knows how many young men.

I've sued the Catholic church. I've seen this rodeo before.

 

[DuffMan]

Joe is the most powerful man at Penn State period. His assistant came to him. He should have stopped it right then and there. Gone to the police that night. Instead, as many have said, he and everyone else went into self preservation mode. Now all of the kids after that had to suffer because these DBs did the what was "legally required of them" It's all BS

I think it is impossible to say what they did that day with out being in the room. If the GA was the one that witnessed it why didn't he pick up the phone and called the police? Why didn't the GA's father have his son call the police. If I ready the report correctly they did not go to Joe till the next day.I feel that if we are going to place blame, then it should start with that GA. His first call should not have been to his Dad, but to the police.

I don't any reasonable person can blame the GA or JoePA for what they did in the first 36 to 48 hours after the assault. If they are morally guilty of anything its not doing enough to make sure things were going forward.

 

[ThunderHawk]

I don't any reasonable person can blame the GA or JoePA for what they did in the first 36 to 48 hours after the assault. If they are morally guilty of anything its not doing enough to make sure things were going forward.

WHAT?

I guess I must be an unreasonable person, cuz I blame the hell out of the GA for leaving THE F@#$ING RAPING OF A YOUNG BOY and I can blame the hell out of Joe Fail for covering up for his pedophile buddy.

May they all rot in hell.

 

[DuffMan]

Again I don't think any of us can say with any certainty what wed do in that situation. I know what I'd like to do, but could I in a pinch? I don't know.

Again its not black and white here. Is what he did reasonable? I think so.

Any cover up started well after that initial 48 hours.

 

[tm3308]

I don't any reasonable person can blame the GA or JoePA for what they did in the first 36 to 48 hours after the assault. If they are morally guilty of anything its not doing enough to make sure things were going forward.

You answered your own question. The GA and JoePa fulfilled any legal obligations they had. But that was pretty much the minimum for what they could have done.

 

[DuffMan]

I understand this and had no question on that matter. I was responding to someone who said the GA was most guilty for not immediately going to the police.

 

[EddyP]

Am I the only one that can say with 100% certainty that I would have stopped the rape of a 10 year old boy?

 

[ThunderHawk]

Again I don't think any of us can say with any certainty what wed do in that situation. I know what I'd like to do, but could I in a pinch? I don't know.

Again its not black and white here. Is what he did reasonable? I think so.

Any cover up started well after that initial 48 hours.

I wouldn't leave a child to be raped by an old man.

I can say that with 100% certainty. 100 F'n Percent.

It couldn't be blacker and whiter if it was a goddamn zebra.

 

[DJL]

Again I don't think any of us can say with any certainty what wed do in that situation. I know what I'd like to do, but could I in a pinch? I don't know.

Again its not black and white here. Is what he did reasonable? I think so.

Any cover up started well after that initial 48 hours.

I can say with 100% certainty that I would at the very least call 911 if I were in either one of their positions. I would like to think that if I were in the GA's position I would have beaten the hell out of the rapest the second I saw what was going on. I can only say that with 99% certainty because I can see maybe being stunned and just yelling at the guy to stop instead of beating him down.

 

[blkngldFRO]

While that is true, JoePa is equally guilty of the exact same offense (calling someone other than the police).

You can't fry one and not the other.

I did not say that one is more guilty then the other. I just see that Joe is taking most the heat in this thread, and I am pointing out that everyone involved deserves an equal amount of finger pointing. No matter their position.

 

[CP87]

Am I the only one that can say with 100% certainty that I would have stopped the rape of a 10 year old boy?

I think the only people that can say this with 100% certainty are the people who have experienced such a traumatic incident and immediately stepped up and did the right thing. I hope there are very few people on this board who have experienced something this traumatic. Probably those who work in law enforcement/emergency services are the only ones who have encountered anything of a similar magnitude.

Edit: Think about it this way. Take 20 year old McQueary in 2000, before any of this happened. Show him the grand jury testimony that we have all read, except make it Florida State and name the GA Doug Peterson. If you had asked McQueary in that hypothetical situation what he would have done, what do you think his response would have been?

He would say the exact same thing that everyone on here is saying: he would absolutely step in and stop the abuse, or at the very least call 911 immediately. McQueary is not a devil. He is not some spineless coward. He is you and me. We all think we are better and will respond appropriately. Some of us are right. Some of us are wrong. Only circumstances can reveal the truth, and luckily most of us have never been in those circumstances.

 

[latrans]

Am I the only one that can say with 100% certainty that I would have stopped the rape of a 10 year old boy?

No Eddy you aren't the only one.

 

[storminspank]

Again I don't think any of us can say with any certainty what wed do in that situation. I know what I'd like to do, but could I in a pinch? I don't know.

Again its not black and white here. Is what he did reasonable? I think so.

Any cover up started well after that initial 48 hours.

It couldn't be more black and white.
Juvenile boy getting raped. Act and follow up on it.

Simple.

 

[ThunderHawk]

I can say with 100% certainty that I would at the very least call 911 if I were in either one of their positions. I would like to think that if I were in the GA's position I would have beaten the hell out of the rapest the second I saw what was going on. I can only say that with 99% certainty because I can see maybe being stunned and just yelling at the guy to stop instead of beating him down.

That's the rub (no pun intended.) You don't have to go accost the SOB. You HAVE TO CALL THE POLICE and at least confront the ba$tard verbally. You have to do whatever you can to STOP THE RAPING OF A CHILD.

Geezus H people, this is basic human decency and adult responsibility. This isn't some complex moral dilemma. You see a child being raped, you intervene. Always.