***OFFICIAL CUBS OFF-SEASON THREAD***

woodyk1 said:
The Cubs are not ready to spend that much for that long on a pitcher. Let them get a little better, build up the farm system, and then try to sign free agents. Sanchez is 28 and probably at his peak. He doesn't blow me away as a pitcher (say like David Price does) so I am glad the Cubs didn't get him. If the Cubs don't contend in the 1st half this year, expect Garza, Baker, and Feldman to get shopped for youngsters.

And, no thanks on Porcello. 1.417 career WHIP with 5.0 K's per 9 innings is not someone to invest in either. He's young, but I don't see it. Smyly, maybe. More potential there.
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I think Porcello will get better and his numbers definitely will if he has a decent defense behind him. Also I really didn't think it would take all that much to get him. However, since the Tigers signed Sanchez it has been reported that every team under the sun is in on Porcello. I originally thought it wouldn't take more than a top 15-20 prospect and another fringe guy, but he'll apparently bring more than that. I like Smyly a lot more, but it won't happen.

I agree the cubs aren't there yet, but if Sanchez is available right now, you can't get a guy like that next year. I don't really think $15/year is that bad for his skill set. If you want to wait on the Greinke's of the world, I don't think he's worth it either. FYI Sanchez had a 4.0 and 3.8 WAR the last 2 years I believe, so he makes his teams better.

I'm ok they missed on Sanchez, I just hope they don't mortgage too much away for "prospects" because you never know what they can be. I have been on the trade Garza train for a while, but I'm now on the, if he turns it around extend him. I like Garza and I don't think it will be cheap to sign a guy like him but I think he could be reasonable for the cubs, and I like his fire. Now, if they could get a return like the mets are going to get for Dickey you trade him immediately. d'Arnaund and Syndergaard is a haul of great proportions.
 
hawkfarmer said:
I'm ok they missed on Sanchez, I just hope they don't mortgage too much away for "prospects" because you never know what they can be. I have been on the trade Garza train for a while, but I'm now on the, if he turns it around extend him. I like Garza and I don't think it will be cheap to sign a guy like him but I think he could be reasonable for the cubs, and I like his fire. Now, if they could get a return like the mets are going to get for Dickey you trade him immediately. d'Arnaund and Syndergaard is a haul of great proportions.
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Totally agree. If Garza proves to be back and healthy, and they can get very good prospects like this, then do it. Let's see if this can happen.
 
woody, here's an article on the Sanchez deal, and what it means next year.

After Anibal: The Pitching Market and the 2014 Chicago Cubs | Bleacher Nation | Chicago Cubs News, Rumors, and Commentary

My points are that next year there isn't much for FA pitchers. Any vast improvement is going to have to get done via trade. I would love to get Hernandez or Price. Either is an Ace. Hopefully you could sign either to an extension. Now, to get those guys you need great prospects and we know the cubs hate to give those guys up. The biggest reason I wanted Sanchez is that I think it made Garza more expendable. Perhaps you get that big prospect you can flip in trade next year. Now I think the cubs will need to extend Garza. You need 3 or 4 very good pitchers to be competitive. I think that has been proven. However, getting them is not cheap, unless you can do some trades.
So a rotation in 2013 of Sanchez, Garza, Samardzija, Wood, Baker/Feldman doesn't look great, but then if you trade for Price or Hernandez you have:
Price/Hernandez
Sanchez
Samardzija
Wood
Baker/Feldman/ a pitcher from the farm or a lower FA signing

I think you would have to trade Garza to get enough pieces to make a trade for Price or Hernandez.

Right now, if the cubs trade Garza to get those pieces they lose a big part of the rotation.

However, the cubs could trade for Price still, and not be as competitive in 2014, and then sign Hernandez after his contract expires, but that is 2 years away.

And what does it take to get either of those two. Surely Baez or Almora would go? what else would it take?

I know Sanchez isn't an ace, but he was only going to be available once, and now he's gone. To me he made the cubs future better and gave them more flexibility to make some moves. Just my opinion.
 
hawkfarmer said:
woody, here's an article on the Sanchez deal, and what it means next year.

After Anibal: The Pitching Market and the 2014 Chicago Cubs | Bleacher Nation | Chicago Cubs News, Rumors, and Commentary

My points are that next year there isn't much for FA pitchers. Any vast improvement is going to have to get done via trade. I would love to get Hernandez or Price. Either is an Ace. Hopefully you could sign either to an extension. Now, to get those guys you need great prospects and we know the cubs hate to give those guys up. The biggest reason I wanted Sanchez is that I think it made Garza more expendable. Perhaps you get that big prospect you can flip in trade next year. Now I think the cubs will need to extend Garza. You need 3 or 4 very good pitchers to be competitive. I think that has been proven. However, getting them is not cheap, unless you can do some trades.
So a rotation in 2013 of Sanchez, Garza, Samardzija, Wood, Baker/Feldman doesn't look great, but then if you trade for Price or Hernandez you have:
Price/Hernandez
Sanchez
Samardzija
Wood
Baker/Feldman/ a pitcher from the farm or a lower FA signing

I think you would have to trade Garza to get enough pieces to make a trade for Price or Hernandez.

Right now, if the cubs trade Garza to get those pieces they lose a big part of the rotation.

However, the cubs could trade for Price still, and not be as competitive in 2014, and then sign Hernandez after his contract expires, but that is 2 years away.

And what does it take to get either of those two. Surely Baez or Almora would go? what else would it take?

I know Sanchez isn't an ace, but he was only going to be available once, and now he's gone. To me he made the cubs future better and gave them more flexibility to make some moves. Just my opinion.
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Your take is fair and I see all of the benefits you mentioned. My personal take was that Sanchez is not a guy to build a rotation around. Detroit has Velander and a lot of young guys like Scherzer where Sanchez can be the #3 guy and be a solid middle of the rotation guy. That's where I see his role and I didn't want to pay $15 million for that.

I am also not a big Travis Wood fan, but maybe he can show more consistency this year. I love the potential of Jeff S.

Building the Cubs to being competitive will take time. At some point, the minor league system will need to develop players (both hitters and pitchers) and then the Cubs can use free agency and/or trades to fill the holes. I am willing to wait a bit (been waiting my whole life :) ) to see what happens. The young hitters the Cubs have drafted will be fun to watch develop (I hope). Let's hope they add value to Castro and Rizzo in the lineup and go from there.
 
I agree Sanchez is a number 3, but so is Garza. I honestly think that is just the market for these guys. I never thought Sanchez would be a number 1 for the cubs, but a #1 will cost you 25-30 a year. If I had my choice of guys to trade for it would be:
Hernandez
Kershaw
Price
Verlander
Cain

Any of those guys would be high cost in trade or FA. However you can't have a staff of #1 pitchers. Just can't happen unless you develop them all. You have to have a number 3. I think Sanchez is better than Dempster or Zambrano were when the cubs signed them to big deals. It's just what you pay for pitching and you have to have pitching.

The biggest issue and reason I wanted Sanchez is that I don't see any relief for starters from the farm for at least 3 more years. They just don't have to prospects right now. Garza could probably net you 1, but now it's tough to trade him.

Do I love Sanchez or think he's an amazing pitcher? NO way! But the cubs need good to better than average arms which are going to cost money no matter what, and that's why I wanted Sanchez.
 
hawkfarmer said:
I agree Sanchez is a number 3, but so is Garza. I honestly think that is just the market for these guys. I never thought Sanchez would be a number 1 for the cubs, but a #1 will cost you 25-30 a year. If I had my choice of guys to trade for it would be:
Hernandez
Kershaw
Price
Verlander
Cain

Any of those guys would be high cost in trade or FA. However you can't have a staff of #1 pitchers. Just can't happen unless you develop them all. You have to have a number 3. I think Sanchez is better than Dempster or Zambrano were when the cubs signed them to big deals. It's just what you pay for pitching and you have to have pitching.

The biggest issue and reason I wanted Sanchez is that I don't see any relief for starters from the farm for at least 3 more years. They just don't have to prospects right now. Garza could probably net you 1, but now it's tough to trade him.

Do I love Sanchez or think he's an amazing pitcher? NO way! But the cubs need good to better than average arms which are going to cost money no matter what, and that's why I wanted Sanchez.
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And Cubs management must have felt similarly about Sanchez. That's why they offered him what they did. I am just glad it didn't happen. :)

Plus, this probably means the Cubs go after another pitcher in free agency soon. I realize that the choices may not be quite as good as Sanchez, but they may have to take some chances going forward. I hope they can start drafting like Tampa does and end up with a lot of good young arms that all come up and contribute at the MLB level. That will take some time.
 
woodyk1 said:
And Cubs management must have felt similarly about Sanchez. That's why they offered him what they did. I am just glad it didn't happen. :)

Plus, this probably means the Cubs go after another pitcher in free agency soon. I realize that the choices may not be quite as good as Sanchez, but they may have to take some chances going forward. I hope they can start drafting like Tampa does and end up with a lot of good young arms that all come up and contribute at the MLB level. That will take some time.
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agree 100%. just takes so much longer with young arms.
 
This question was posed on cubs.com. I literally LOL'd

Why isn't Alfonso Soriano being considered as a potential third-base option? With his middle-infield experience and power numbers at the plate, I think a Soriano at third experiment this spring could offer the Cubs flexibility and more run production out of the lineup. The worst that happens is Soriano goes back to left field.
-- Raker D., Huntington Beach, Calif.The Cubs are not considering this. Soriano turns 37 on Monday. He has not played the infield since 2005, when he made 21 errors as the Rangers' second baseman. Think about how Soriano throws (sort of side-arm) and imagine that at third base. It's not going to happen.
 
hawkfarmer said:
This question was posed on cubs.com. I literally LOL'd

Why isn't Alfonso Soriano being considered as a potential third-base option? With his middle-infield experience and power numbers at the plate, I think a Soriano at third experiment this spring could offer the Cubs flexibility and more run production out of the lineup. The worst that happens is Soriano goes back to left field.
-- Raker D., Huntington Beach, Calif.The Cubs are not considering this. Soriano turns 37 on Monday. He has not played the infield since 2005, when he made 21 errors as the Rangers' second baseman. Think about how Soriano throws (sort of side-arm) and imagine that at third base. It's not going to happen.
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Oh my! :)
 
Yeah, could you imagine him playing 3rd base? Heck maybe they should try Soriano out at Catcher. :D

In other news the Cubs signed Dontrelle Willis to a minor league deal.
 
Cubs also signed former Algona Bishop Garrigan standout Brad Nelson to a minor league deal with an invite to spring training.
 
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