NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
You completing contradict yourself. If your argument is that Fran is not a successful coach at Iowa, then he should not be the coach here, simple as that.
Fran's got a great gig...
- Thread starter phdsvp
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InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
I knew Jok was majorly important last season, he led the league in scoring, how could he not be? I knew they wouldn't miss his defense but he was a go to in the crunch time or when they needed a basket to stop a run. They really don't have that yet. That doesn't mean that player isn't on the team, it just means that player hasn't stepped into that roll yet. IMO, Jordan can't be that guy unless he has the supporting cast around him. He can't be the leading scorer, assist guy and also the guy who runs the offense. Very few players in the country are that. Teams recognized that early in the year and challenged him the second he crossed half court and said - we know that guy can beat us, and until the rest of the team proves they can, we're gonna key him. That made it open season on Jordan with the "See I told you he wasn't a PG" .... which was laughable putting it all on him. He hasn't played well, but he hasn't had a lot of help either.
What I minimized was the transition they would need in order to play without Jok. I think that only comes with experience. Moss is good, he's just not at that level yet. I still think he'll get there, but sometimes it takes time to develop. It's hard to remember this but Marble Jr, White, Jok and Uthoff all took multiple seasons to become what they became. They didn't come out of the box like that. Very few do. IMO, Tyler Cook looks to be ahead of the game, and that's encouraging to me. He's having some eye opening moments as of late and is getting more and more confident with the ball.
I nearly gave up on the team. I'll admit it. I was discouraged. I was bummed we were gonna miss the NCAA. I still sorta am, but at least I feel more confident in the team working things out down the stretch then I did a month ago, which is all I can ask.
That's the point. I think Mike's class won a lot of high pressure games but @PCHawk said they didn't. I don't understand how he can say Fran has been a good coach here when his best teams didn't win high pressure games.
After the whole lawsuit thing I was 99% sure he wasn't going to be either. Now that that's died down to nothing already and he seems as firmly entrenched as he's ever been my feelings on it are a lot less certain.... The guy is fighting cancer now though right? Maybe he'll step down and retire with that health scare..
InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
That win at NC felt like a high pressure win.... or the 2 NCAA games.
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
Again contradicting yourself. You were the one who brought Fran’s record under pressure into this debate.
At the time (MG era) someone had the record in games decided by 5 points or less under Fran and it wasn’t good. You weren’t around then because you had been banned under a different name.
You can still be successful with a poor record in close games, however it is much more difficult. Fran has been successful IMO in his time here, even with a poor record in close games, however now our hope is he takes it to the next level which remains to be seen. As a true hawk fan I hope he does. You are just here to derail the thread.
Exactly!
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
I don’t think the point is that he has never won a close game, I think the point is that he has a very very poor record in close games, which is true. All @PCHawk Is saying is that he believes it was a product of that class of players, particularly MG who was probably the most unclutch player of all time. We will see if that is more of a product of those players or Fran going forward.
Last year for instance we were 4-4 in OT games/ games decided by 5 points or less. I can tell you MG’s class was well below 50% in those contests.
We're 0-1 this year in games decided by 5 points or less.
seepig
Well-Known Member
How about just convince me that they can challenge once in awhile.
seepig
Well-Known Member
Really you have insight into the 300 programs in D1 and how they view success. WOW
seepig
Well-Known Member
Really so why do we pay all this money and time to search for a coach? So our standard is to finish in the bottom half of the conference and we're ok with that?! Ok then I think we should just pay coaches less.
He doesn't know what he's talking about. Rick Barnes had success at Texas Fran could only dream of having and he got fired and Texas isn't anywhere near a top 5 job. Alford was on the hot seat at UCLA after 3 seasons where he had two Sweet 16 appearances in that time frame.
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
Texas the largest athletic program in the country and UCLA the college basketball program with the richest history??!? You are an absolute idiot.
seepig
Well-Known Member
UMass had one of the smallest budgets at the time Cal was there and he took them to a final 4 sooooo your point is? Phil Martelli has a SMALL small budget at ST. Joe's he's made a handful of deep runs. So there are plenty of examples so the big budget theory is crap too.
He said only 5 programs in the country would fire Fran with those results. Indiana fired Crean when he performed much better than Fran too. So you include Indiana, UCLA and Texas in that then go ahead and pick 2 from Kansas, Kentucky, Duke, North Carolina and Michigan State to round out your top 5 programs.
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
FAIL.
How do small budget teams having occasional success have anything to do with someone saying that Fran’s success at Iowa in recent years wouldn’t be a fireable offense at the majority of schools. FWIW I think the number is much higher than 5 but the point remains.
Keep buddying up with the cyclone troll, it’s really a good look.
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
I agree the number is much higher than 5 but I think the point still remains. Now we need Fran to take the success to the next level, we will see if he’s the man to do it.
Weird I thought I've already answered that multiple times. Players are the ones who have to handle pressure. We had a few important players in Gesell's classes that couldn't handle pressure. They are all gone now. It's the coaches job to get them into position to win conference titles. Fran has already done that twice.
So how do you think Fran chokes under pressure? We already know that he lets his players play through bad stretches. That can definitely be debated on whether it's a good idea or not. Other than that, does he get nervous in the practices leading up to big games and chokes while implementing the game plan? Does he choke by calling out wrong set plays during games because he gets too nervous? I think it's funny that anyone thinks a coach can choke under pressure. Other than calling a timeout when they don't have one, or some other brain fast like that.
This is a very unique strategy you are going with here. It's the former players fault for not winning high pressure games but it's not Fran's fault for recruiting those players. I think all the successes and failures fall on the head coach. They are responsibile for recruiting the players and getting them mentally and physically ready to play.
