Blow up the Cubs

MisterLucky said:
Jon, I think (I hope!) you're wrong. I think Cub fans have just about seen enough. Yeah, there will be the usual crowd making their yearly pilgrimage to Wrigley, but the long sufering Cub fan, like myself is getting fed up. I already hate the Ricketts. Giving Hendry a vote of confidence was idiotic considering the damage he has inflicted on the franchise. And Quade was just another mistep in a long line of blunders by Hendry. Just yesterday, they picked a SHORTSTOP with their first pick in the draft. If there is any position they have covered, I would say it is shortstop. They do have a lot of money coming off the books in the next year, but I get the feeling that the Ricketts will pocket it and try to win with minor league players under the guise of "rebuilding with youth." They talk about going after Pujols (never happen), but the player they should have opened the cashbox for was Adrian Gonzalez. Instead they sign Pena for $10 mill. I have given up on this franchise on more than one occasion, but curse my father, he got me hooked at an early age and I keep returning. Unfortunately for him, he recently died at age 98 without ever seeing them win a World Series and I figure I am doomed to the same fate. Luckily being a Cub's fan means you have a lot of spare time in the summer that other fans spend following their team, because like most years, the Cubs are already out of it by June.
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There has actually been talk of Castro moving to second base and developing there if he continues to struggle defensively at short, so its not a terrible move. And you can always use prospects as trade bait later on.
Also, I really dont want Pujols to be signed by the Cubs. Call me crazy but I would rather have the Cubs push the bid higher to ensure the Cardinals use up more money on one player. Id rather have the Cubs go after a guy like Fielder who wont take up half of the payroll himself. Sure Albert is an amazing player, and probably the best I have ever seen, since Im younger, but he is a Cardinal at heart and will always be. Its either STL or NYY for him.
 
MisterLucky said:
Jon, I think (I hope!) you're wrong. I think Cub fans have just about seen enough. Yeah, there will be the usual crowd making their yearly pilgrimage to Wrigley, but the long sufering Cub fan, like myself is getting fed up.
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Man, their 'before school lets out' attendance average to capacity is nearly 85%! Sorry, but yours is not a commonly held sentiment to where it hits the Cub$ where it hurts.
 
I think they've already figured that out ... problem is nobody is going to give anything for any of the has-beens

the worst move of the off-season? ... wasting $10M on Pena, or giving up prospects for Garza? ... both so they could win 70 games instead of 60 ... ridiculous
 
Wrigley will have a ton of empty seats the rest of the year. Sure the Yankee series will pack them in, but speaking for myself, I'm not spending a dime watching this train wreck and I usually go in every season. No thank you.
 
Oh, I'm sorry. I was under the misconception that the job of the GM was to find and sign players that would get the team to the World Series and, dare I say it, actually win one. Hendry has had ten years and one of the highest payrolls in baseball. Did he accomplish this goal? Heck, has the team under his leadership even won a postseason playoff game in the last seven years? This is the man who signed Milton Bradley. I would like a show of hands from all the Cub fans who thought that was a good idea. As far as hiring Quade...all you have to do is watch the Cubs daily to understand why this guy spent so many years in the minors riding buses. The Ricketts, if they do want to win and not just maximize profits (does everyone love the Toyota sign in center as much as I do?) should have fired Hendry the day they bought the team under the guise of wanting their own man. Instead, they gave a vote of confidence for a man who now presides over the worst team in the National League, with the added benefits of paying through the nose for unproductive players that he signed to some ludicrous contracts. Giving him another chance to rebuild the team seems to me to be sentencing the Cub fans to another decade of misery. More misery is the last thing Cub fans need now.
 
MisterLucky said:
Jon, I think (I hope!) you're wrong. I think Cub fans have just about seen enough. Yeah, there will be the usual crowd making their yearly pilgrimage to Wrigley, but the long sufering Cub fan, like myself is getting fed up. I already hate the Ricketts. Giving Hendry a vote of confidence was idiotic considering the damage he has inflicted on the franchise. And Quade was just another mistep in a long line of blunders by Hendry. Just yesterday, they picked a SHORTSTOP with their first pick in the draft. If there is any position they have covered, I would say it is shortstop. They do have a lot of money coming off the books in the next year, but I get the feeling that the Ricketts will pocket it and try to win with minor league players under the guise of "rebuilding with youth." They talk about going after Pujols (never happen), but the player they should have opened the cashbox for was Adrian Gonzalez. Instead they sign Pena for $10 mill. I have given up on this franchise on more than one occasion, but curse my father, he got me hooked at an early age and I keep returning. Unfortunately for him, he recently died at age 98 without ever seeing them win a World Series and I figure I am doomed to the same fate. Luckily being a Cub's fan means you have a lot of spare time in the summer that other fans spend following their team, because like most years, the Cubs are already out of it by June.
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Here's the scouting report on their top draft pick from CNN/SI:
A well-constructed 6-1 185-pounder, Baez does not possess the tools to stay at SS. His arm, speed and fielding tools project to big league average, fine for 2B, LF or 3B but not SS. Some scouts have floated the idea of turning Baez into a catcher. Wherever he winds up, Baez' primary feature will always be his bat. A right-handed hitter, Baez combines terrific bat speed with hitting fundamentals that are exceptionally advanced for a high schooler. His stance and swing are reminiscent of Manny Ramirez. Baez loads well, has a short stride and gets into an ideal pre swing position. He then keeps his swing on plane, achieves full extension and employs a high, powerful finish
 
bwsmoney said:
I think they've already figured that out ... problem is nobody is going to give anything for any of the has-beens

the worst move of the off-season? ... wasting $10M on Pena, or giving up prospects for Garza? ... both so they could win 70 games instead of 60 ... ridiculous
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You do realize the Garza deal wasn't just for this year right?

As for Pena, it's not like he's blocking some elite prospect. They needed a first baseman, and he's absolutely tradeable.
 
HawkeyeMike23 said:
Here's the scouting report on their top draft pick from CNN/SI:
A well-constructed 6-1 185-pounder, Baez does not possess the tools to stay at SS. His arm, speed and fielding tools project to big league average, fine for 2B, LF or 3B but not SS. Some scouts have floated the idea of turning Baez into a catcher. Wherever he winds up, Baez' primary feature will always be his bat. A right-handed hitter, Baez combines terrific bat speed with hitting fundamentals that are exceptionally advanced for a high schooler. His stance and swing are reminiscent of Manny Ramirez. Baez loads well, has a short stride and gets into an ideal pre swing position. He then keeps his swing on plane, achieves full extension and employs a high, powerful finish
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Even if he was projected to be a gold glove shortstop, it still wouldn't matter. You don't pick based on need in the top 10. You worry about position when he gets closer to the show. Lots of things can change in the 3-4 years it will likely take for him to get there.
 
Without going into great detail virtually all of the analysis the OP provides is dead *** wrong, specifically that surroudning the pen.

1) Wood will not retire. He's having another very solid year. If he decides he want's to chase a ring he might accept a trade in August, but even if that happens don't be suprised to see him resign with the Cubs the next year.

2) Russel can't get anyone out. He's medeocre against lefties and down right awful against righties. If we didn't have a bunch of guys on the DL he'd be in AAA Iowa right now.

3) Samardzija very valuable peice to the staff. He's got plus stuff across the board. He's pitching very well this year in long relief and he's got the potential to either start or be a future set up guy. In addition I think he's going to make less than 4 million next year making him very inexpensive.

4) Grabow might not be a Cub next year but it won't be because of his contract. He's a lefty on lefty specialist and is a candidate to be traded to someone looking post season bullpen help.

5) Tyler Colvin is nowhere near ready for the big leages. He's hitting .268 and he's got 14 errors in like 52 games. The AA guy closest to being on the roster next year is his teamate Matt Spencer. He's hit at every level and we might have some room in the OF next year.

6) Don't be suprised to see Soriano get traded. Yes his contract is somewhat of a barrier but he's hitting well this year, and there are a few AL teams that desparately need another bat (Yankees). If the Cubs offered to pick up half of his contract for the remaining time on the contract they would probably be able to move him and get a handfull of prospects in return.

EDIT #5 shoudl be Josh Vitters but in retrospect it probably applies to Colvin as well.
 
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Clark said:
Even if he was projected to be a gold glove shortstop, it still wouldn't matter. You don't pick based on need in the top 10. You worry about position when he gets closer to the show. Lots of things can change in the 3-4 years it will likely take for him to get there.
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I agree, I was just pointing out how dumb it is to be ******** about taking a SS in the first round just because the Cubs' have Castro.
 
WGN had a relationship with the Cubs way back to the 40's

thats my only comment as the other posts in this thread are too ignorant to address
 
The Cubs have been a lost cause from the start, that being said I don't have a problem with Pena or Garza. As someone pointed out, they have no one to play 1B, and Garza is a good young pitcher under team control for the next few years. If they had signed Pena to a 3 or 4 year deal it would be a different story.

I think one of the biggest (hard to pick just one thing with this awful team) problems is lack of young position talent. Who is the last star position player who has come up from the Cubs system? Sandberg? Technically he was with the Phillies to start, but close enough.

Year after year the Cubs spend money on long term contracts for older guys who fall apart. I really hope they don't pay a > 30 year old Pujols his 300 million this offseason, and instead focus on finding some young talent. Bring on Brett Jackson, Vitters, or whoever else can inject some life into this team.

As far as 'The cubs only want to make money' stuff, that may have been true in the past. I really like the Ricketts family and think they can turn things around. The payroll this year went down as more money was put into the minor league system. That is a step in the right direction, and moving away from the stupid free agent 'attraction' signings.
 
Time will tell on how the Ricketts ownership does but I have to say so far my impression is he's just a big clueless doofus. I hope I'm wrong.
 
Meanwhile, the Cardinals are a half game up on Philly for the best record in the majors.
 
DuffMan said:
Without going into great detail virtually all of the analysis the OP provides is dead *** wrong, specifically that surroudning the pen.

1) Wood will not retire. He's having another very solid year. If he decides he want's to chase a ring he might accept a trade in August, but even if that happens don't be suprised to see him resign with the Cubs the next year.

2) Russel can't get anyone out. He's medeocre against lefties and down right awful against righties. If we didn't have a bunch of guys on the DL he'd be in AAA Iowa right now.

3) Samardzija very valuable peice to the staff. He's got plus stuff across the board. He's pitching very well this year in long relief and he's got the potential to either start or be a future set up guy. In addition I think he's going to make less than 4 million next year making him very inexpensive.

4) Grabow might not be a Cub next year but it won't be because of his contract. He's a lefty on lefty specialist and is a candidate to be traded to someone looking post season bullpen help.

5) Tyler Colvin is nowhere near ready for the big leages. He's hitting .268 and he's got 14 errors in like 52 games. The AA guy closest to being on the roster next year is his teamate Matt Spencer. He's hit at every level and we might have some room in the OF next year.

6) Don't be suprised to see Soriano get traded. Yes his contract is somewhat of a barrier but he's hitting well this year, and there are a few AL teams that desparately need another bat (Yankees). If the Cubs offered to pick up half of his contract for the remaining time on the contract they would probably be able to move him and get a handfull of prospects in return.

EDIT #5 shoudl be Josh Vitters but in retrospect it probably applies to Colvin as well.
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1. I just said I don't see Woody with the Cubs.
2. Russel is ok in relief, horrible starter. He's not as bad as you think he is.
3. You think 4 million for a reliever that is not a set up man (Marshall) or a closer (Marmol) is inexpensive. Geez. I think he is ok, but I don't think he's as great as you believe. He is so inconsistent.
4. The guy is not very good. Way overpaid
5. I don't think Vitters or Colvin are big league material yet either. I think Vitters needs another year. Colvin, who knows. I was basing lineups on what was on the team and in the system (I never said Vitters would be up but he was an option)
6. Great so instead of paying 19 million for a player that can produce, we pay 9 or 10 for nothing. What a waste. I don't see it happening, but you never know with hendry.
 
It is being rumored in Chicago that the Ricketts are seriously contemplating removing team president Crane Kenney (who is not truly a "baseball man") and GM Jim Hendry from their positions. If that is truly the case, I will back off my current opinion of the Ricketts until I see who they hire in their place.
 
hawkfarmer said:
1. I just said I don't see Woody with the Cubs.
2. Russel is ok in relief, horrible starter. He's not as bad as you think he is.
3. You think 4 million for a reliever that is not a set up man (Marshall) or a closer (Marmol) is inexpensive. Geez. I think he is ok, but I don't think he's as great as you believe. He is so inconsistent.
4. The guy is not very good. Way overpaid
5. I don't think Vitters or Colvin are big league material yet either. I think Vitters needs another year. Colvin, who knows. I was basing lineups on what was on the team and in the system (I never said Vitters would be up but he was an option)
6. Great so instead of paying 19 million for a player that can produce, we pay 9 or 10 for nothing. What a waste. I don't see it happening, but you never know with hendry.
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You said you think Woody might retire, barring an injury or something else completely unforseen there is zero chance he retires next year.

You are the only one I've ever talked to that thinks Russell is good. The NL is hitting .310 off him, he's not even very good against lefties (.250)

Again Grabow is a left handed specialist and lefties are hitting under .200 against him. He's very good at what he does and he is very well compensated for that. He will be traded prior to the deadline as I guarantee you someone will need left handed help in the pen.

Absolutely it would be great to pay 9million a year for Soriano to play somewhere else. Marlon Byrd maked 5 million a year, he plays great defense, hits .300 with 10-20 HR and 30-40 doubles per year. I would gladly pay 14-15 million for another Marlon Byrd type OF than I would pay 19 million for a year older Soriano. You get a much better all around player and save 5 million in the process.

BTW one thing that is getting overlooked here, especially with Jon's argument. Yes the Cubs draw well, but they are also one of the dozen or so teams in MLB that are operating at debt levels above what MLB considers ideal. There are a few other large market teams in that group, the Mets and the Dodgers, both of whom have had troulble meeting payroll and are essentially broke.

A large part of that is the huge price tag the new ownership group paid to purchase the club, and a large part of that is due to the large payroll. The Cubs may not be able to keep spending like this even while drawing 3 million fans per year. I wouldn't be suprised at all to see the Cubs reduce the payroll to around 80million once the big contracts of Soriano and Rami come off the books.
 
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