BHGP DJK story

[DexterMorgan]

I love this one:

“You don’t need thumbs,‘’ he said. “My best friend is my brother’s dog. He doesn’t have any thumbs and he’s doing fine.”

 

[cmhawks99]

Chad wont answer as he has allegedly asked you several questions you havent addressed,,

Nice try cuz......I have no issue with Dex, at least I don't think, right?!


As for Angerer I have read several times times…..Him and DJK had a go 2 years ago and its long been rumored about. Surely many of you have seen it suggested before & I know Homer has alluded to other prior Hawkeyes not being DJK fans….honestly in the grand scheme of things its silly and I wouldn’t have brought it up (though I believe its been said in this thread already) had not my friend here trotted out….Tyler Sash backing him like that means much…..I’ve got some friends that aren’t terribly likeable or super people. Doesn’t mean a lot in the grand scheme of things…..

Chad

 

[cmhawks99]

I dont blame you for not answering Chad as you have no defense.

Since you are playing a spin game I’ll indulge you…….

Of all the poor arguments out there and the logically depraved…..the inclusion on a “selected” all-conference team is one of the poorest. Especially in an exceptionally weak Snr class of Big 10 WR’s…..

Now to show I have a very good grasp on what YOU are thinking and what I have said…..yes I get you are giving more weight to the “coaches” opinions (of which grad assistants fill those out more often than not) than the media…therefore in your mind making it less of a “beauty contest” !

I also get I acknowledged above it was a weak WR class in the big 10 and I’ll readily admit my “not near” the best comment was a little strong……

With all that said……only ONE other receiver for the Big 10 got drafted and that was Tandon Doss, that’s it. Doss was a very long 6-2 and although I’d have loved to have him at Iowa he was only snagged in the late 4th round.

Tyler Sash was first team All-big 10 twice I think right, and he got drafted in the 6th round, showing All-conference teams don’t have much to do with anything really. They are good for fans and good for recruiting but they mean very little when it comes to true NFL talent. And frankly there are many a prior All conference player who never got much NFL play….Dane Sanzenbacher for example wasn’t drafted.

Ironically enuff……many of your cronies who were so high on DJK pooh-poohed Tyler Sash and yet those oh so smart coaches put him on their team right…..pick your tools wisely friend. The things you say are easy to corner. In fact of all the people I encounter…those that are in this DJK was super duper and done wrong camp are generally some of the easiest to dispel.

Chad

PS......this still doesn't change the fact that you completely skipped over all the other things I already refuted.

 

[homes]

A decent recap of DJK's life history. A complete speculative hack job as to his conclusion, based on no facts, just WHAT IFs. I think Ferentz deserves the benefit of the doubt, he's earned it.

 

[RLeahey14]

The guy has NFL talent. If Kevin Kasper played in the NFL, DJK has the talent.

Ferentz has made Hawkeye program NFL University. He gets guys like Brandon Meyers playing on Sundays. DJK has more talent than a lot of the former Hawks in the NFL.

Was he an elite NFL wr talent? No. Was he definitely good enough to be on a roster and contribute? Absolutely.

You do realize that Kevin Kasper was a whole lot faster than DKJ? At the time of his combine Kasper held three all time combine speed records. In fact I believe he still holds the fastest shuttle time. Speed kills.


Fastest Shuttle Times
3.73 - Kevin Kasper, (WR), Iowa - 2001
3.76 - Deion Branch, (WR), Louisville - 2002
3.78 - Dunta Robinson, (CB), South Carolina - 2004
3.79 - *Champ Bailey, (CB), Georgia - 1999

 

[cmhawks99]

You do realize that Kevin Kasper was a whole lot faster than DKJ? At the time of his combine Kasper held three all time combine speed records. In fact I believe he still holds the fastest shuttle time. Speed kills.


Fastest Shuttle Times
3.73 - Kevin Kasper, (WR), Iowa - 2001
3.76 - Deion Branch, (WR), Louisville - 2002
3.78 - Dunta Robinson, (CB), South Carolina - 2004
3.79 - *Champ Bailey, (CB), Georgia - 1999

Yeah the crazy thing about this DJK stuff is most of these cats are quick to disregard or out and out burry many of our past players yet DJK proves the coaches had reason to constantly monitor him and all it does is fuel his fame….

It really is quite a phenomenon.

Chad

 

[homerHAWKeye777]

Look numbnuts Homer made argument that Brodell would have been highly more productive than DJK if he had of stayed healthy. My rebuttal was simply do the math.

The problem was that your math was WRONG. There's no reason to believe that Iowa would have continued to pass so little through the rest of the season ... and the season itself provides EVIDENCE that we did pass more!

Your estimate of 48 would have been an absolute lower bound. Suggesting that he'd get 12 more receptions than a lower bound is no stretch of the imagination.

 

[dee27]

The guy has NFL talent. If Kevin Kasper played in the NFL, DJK has the talent.

Ferentz has made Hawkeye program NFL University. He gets guys like Brandon Meyers playing on Sundays. DJK has more talent than a lot of the former Hawks in the NFL.

Was he an elite NFL wr talent? No. Was he definitely good enough to be on a roster and contribute? Absolutely.

No offense, but you have no idea what you are talking about. This is a quote from Joe Defranco, probably the most respected strength and conditioning coach (and a good friend of Chris Doyle) in the US.

"I can talk forever on this subject, but I'll give you three of my favorites. First, three years ago I had the good fortune of training University of Iowa wide receiver, Kevin Kasper, for the NFL Combine. Kevin is still the most well-rounded athlete I’ve ever trained. He's strong, fast, flexible, and shredded!
One of the evaluation tests for our athletes was to analyze their squat form on a wobble board. This is a great test to determine muscular imbalances, flexibility issues, and weaknesses. Most athletes suck at this test. Kevin stood on the wobble board, squatted *** to the ground without the slightest movement of the board, stood up, and then did a back flip off the board and landed perfectly on his feet! It was amazing. He then went on to break three all-time Combine records and gets drafted by the Denver Broncos."

After dozens of his pupils are drafted and play in the NFL he is asked about the biggest freak of an athlete he ever worked with and the first guy he mentions is Kevin Kasper.

 

[herkyattack]

Thus, I'd assert that it's much more likely that Brodell would have gotten more in the neighborhood of 60 receptions. And that would have easily been enough to put him in the ballpark of 850-1000 yards. Certainly SUBSTANTIALLY BETTER than DJK.

Heck, in DJK's defense ... in '07 he was just a RS FR ... and to his credit he demonstrated pretty nice promise. However, he didn't advance his craft nearly as far as he could have!

Actually Homer, if you would go more in-depth with the stats, you would find that you are more wrong than you are right. If you take a look at DJK's stats throughout the season, he equated for %19.1 of the team's receptions, and %21.1 of the team's receiving yards. Through Brodell's three healthy games, he hauled in %25 of the team's catches, but just %17.4 of the yardage. Brodell's numbers equted out to a full 12 game season come out to be:

50 REC, 397 YDS

Now, admittedly, a lot of DJK's numbers had to do w/ the fact Brodell was in fact injured. But for you to assume Brodell's catches and yards would increase at such a high rate is a little egregious.

You are right, however, on the lack of development DJK showed throughout his four years here. His numbers did not change a whole lot in his four years.

FR- %19.1 REC (38), %21.1 YDS (482)
SO- %23.5 REC (44), %27.1 YDS (639)
JR- %21.1 REC (45), %26 YDS (750)
SR- %20.4 REC (46), %24.4 YDS (745)

In fact, it appears he peaked, at least statistically, his sophomore year, and slightly regressed each year thereafter. In fact, his senior year statistics are only slightly better than those he put forth as a freshman.

 

[homerHAWKeye777]

Actually Homer, if you would go more in-depth with the stats, you would find that you are more wrong than you are right. If you take a look at DJK's stats throughout the season, he equated for %19.1 of the team's receptions, and %21.1 of the team's receiving yards. Through Brodell's three healthy games, he hauled in %25 of the team's catches, but just %17.4 of the yardage. Brodell's numbers equted out to a full 12 game season come out to be:

50 REC, 397 YDS

Now, admittedly, a lot of DJK's numbers had to do w/ the fact Brodell was in fact injured. But for you to assume Brodell's catches and yards would increase at such a high rate is a little egregious.

Not egregious at all. I was accounting for factors that you likely didn't consider.

Specifically ....

- Moeaki went out due to injury too. Had Moeaki remained injured, but Brodell remained healthy ... Brodell would have averaged ABOVE 25% of the receptions! This is a factor that you hadn't considered. Thus, my estimate of 60 receptions could potentially have been an UNDERESTIMATE.

- Douglas and Chandler combined for 95 receptions altogether in '06 ... and the '07 receiving group didn't feature one guy who AS reliable as Brodell, other than Moeaki ... but he injured. Even with a more stagnant O ... a healthy Brodell would have still had to account for a substantial percentage of those 95 receptions.

- Brodell was averaging a ridiculously low 7.4 yard per reception. That was NOT on Brodell ... rather, it was due to the fact that Brodell actually understood a thing or two about hot routes ... and thus he was one of the few WRs providing Christensen with a respectable outlet. However, considering that Brodell's prior season averages were 11.5 yards per reception and 18.6 yards per reception ... it's not too much of a stretch to assert that Brodell could finish a season averaging in the ball-park of 14 to 15 yards per reception.

- You combine the above numbers and then you get .... 60 receptions x 14 yards per reception = 840 yards. That's precisely in the neighborhood of the estimate that I had provided.

Your analysis wasn't too bad. Your approach was sound, you just didn't account for the fact that Brodell (and the others) would account for more receptions in light of Moeaki's injury. Furthermore, you didn't account for the fact that Brodell's 7.4 yard per reception average was grossly not representative of what was typical for his career.

Frankly, if you want to be critical of my analysis, it would probably be fair to say that having Christensen as a QB would have limited Brodell's yardage per reception even more than what I had estimated. Given that both Cleveland and DJK averaged in the ball-park of 12 yards per reception ... one might assert that it would be better to estimate Brodell's average to be more around 12 or 13 yards per reception. That would then land him much closer to just 750 yards on the season.

If you had a more precise criticism ... the last thing I just pointed out would probably be the ONLY one. However, even then, it would be picking nits. After all ... it would still prove the original point ... Brodell would still have been a good bit more productive than DJK!

 

[homerHAWKeye777]

I don't hold a candle to you when it comes to breaking down Iowa Football, I can only call them as I see them.

Iowa averages right in the middle of the pack for passing offense in the Big Ten. So 750 yards on the season isn't half bad, IMO. Especially playing along-side McNutt, who's going to be an NFL draft pick.

DJK made big plays at big times.

Stross made big plays. McNutt has made plays. Sandeman was HUGE in Iowa's Orange Bowl ... yep, he made big plays too.

FYI ... my apologies if I ripped into you a bit too much/hard. I just respect you as a poster and expected a bit more.

As for calling them as you see them ... Bill O'Reilly and Rush Limbaugh also call 'em as they see 'em ... and often the facts have little to do with how they see 'em. Thus, I'd just point out that it is a slippery slope to rely on gut feeling alone ... especially when reality/logic doesn't always go along with our own biased perspectives.

 

[MJSCK]

No offense, but you have no idea what you are talking about. This is a quote from Joe Defranco, probably the most respected strength and conditioning coach (and a good friend of Chris Doyle) in the US.

"I can talk forever on this subject, but I'll give you three of my favorites. First, three years ago I had the good fortune of training University of Iowa wide receiver, Kevin Kasper, for the NFL Combine. Kevin is still the most well-rounded athlete I’ve ever trained. He's strong, fast, flexible, and shredded!
One of the evaluation tests for our athletes was to analyze their squat form on a wobble board. This is a great test to determine muscular imbalances, flexibility issues, and weaknesses. Most athletes suck at this test. Kevin stood on the wobble board, squatted *** to the ground without the slightest movement of the board, stood up, and then did a back flip off the board and landed perfectly on his feet! It was amazing. He then went on to break three all-time Combine records and gets drafted by the Denver Broncos."

After dozens of his pupils are drafted and play in the NFL he is asked about the biggest freak of an athlete he ever worked with and the first guy he mentions is Kevin Kasper.

I have no idea what I'm talking about?

I could give a rip about a freaking backflip off of a wobble board. Kasper was a great Hawk but he was not as good as DJK. Admittedly, he was good and, by all accounts, a gym rat. Great. Joe Montana couldn't squat a Dr. Pepper but he had immense talent. Talent is not defined by forty times and backflips, my friend. It's defined by making plays and winning games.

If the game is on the line, I'd rather line up DJK than Kasper. Are you forgetting who the all-time leading receiver in Iowa history is? The same guy that played second string for much of his career and still put up record numbers.

So I state that if Kasper has the talent to play in the NFL, then DJK does as well and you label me as having no idea. Yeah, you're right. I suppose I don't.

Carry on.

 

[tm3308]

I have no idea what I'm talking about?

I could give a rip about a freaking backflip off of a wobble board. Kasper was a great Hawk but he was not as good as DJK. Admittedly, he was good and, by all accounts, a gym rat. Great. Joe Montana couldn't squat a Dr. Pepper but he had immense talent. Talent is not defined by forty times and backflips, my friend. It's defined by making plays and winning games.

If the game is on the line, I'd rather line up DJK than Kasper. Are you forgetting who the all-time leading receiver in Iowa history is? The same guy that played second string for much of his career and still put up record numbers.

So I state that if Kasper has the talent to play in the NFL, then DJK does as well and you label me as having no idea. Yeah, you're right. I suppose I don't.

Carry on.

I do get tired of the "he was second string for most of his career". No, he wasn't. I'm as big of a DJK fan as you'll ever meet. I even provided photos for his autograph session last spring in Des Moines. But lets not exaggerate on things like this. He received just as much, if not more playing time than any receiver on the team. He played starter minutes, therefore he was a starter. The depth chart for our WR's has rarely meant anything.

 

[RocknRollface]

Will you people stop with your absurd evaluations. I can't take the ignorance.

The average hieght of a wide reciever in the NFL is 6' the average 40 time is around 4.5.

The man had plenty of talent to play in the NFL, he was graded by everyone as a fourth or fifth rounder. His workout numbers were on par with that evaluation as well, if not better.

He played at Iowa, not a team who throws the ball around, let alone to the wide outs. Also he was not a starter for four years, Colin Sandeman was the starter in 09. DJK maybe saw half the snaps at best that year.

Tell me any other player in the country who put up his numbers both on the field and in workouts who was not invited to at least try out for a team? Seriously give me one example.

Come to your own conclusions and believe what ever you want, but seriously, don't kid yourself, the reason he was not even invited to a camp had nothing to do with not being talented enough. Guys with half his talent get invited to camps.

 

[tm3308]

Will you people stop with your absurd evaluations. I can't take the ignorance.

The average hieght of a wide reciever in the NFL is 6' the average 40 time is around 4.5.

The man had plenty of talent to play in the NFL, he was graded by everyone as a fourth or fifth rounder. His workout numbers were on par with that evaluation as well, if not better.

He played at Iowa, not a team who throws the ball around, let alone to the wide outs. Also he was not a starter for four years, Colin Sandeman was the starter in 09. DJK maybe saw half the snaps at best that year.

Tell me any other player in the country who put up his numbers both on the field and in workouts who was not invited to at least try out for a team? Seriously give me one example.

Come to your own conclusions and believe what ever you want, but seriously, don't kid yourself, the reason he was not even invited to a camp had nothing to do with not being talented enough. Guys with half his talent get invited to camps.

I think it's quite clear that he isn't talented enough to overcome the off-field baggage, at least not at this point.

While I'm sure that Ferentz didn't give DJK a ringing endorsement, and that is likely a big reason that DJK is NOT in camp right now, he was well within his right to do so, and he's not "petty" for doing it. It's what DJK earned as a direct result of his own actions. In the end it comes back to him, and he's going to have to work past/live with that. I hope he makes it, but in a way it's a good thing that his path to the NFL is now tougher.

 

[homerHAWKeye777]

Will you people stop with your absurd evaluations. I can't take the ignorance.

The average hieght of a wide reciever in the NFL is 6' the average 40 time is around 4.5.

The man had plenty of talent to play in the NFL, he was graded by everyone as a fourth or fifth rounder. His workout numbers were on par with that evaluation as well, if not better.

He played at Iowa, not a team who throws the ball around, let alone to the wide outs. Also he was not a starter for four years, Colin Sandeman was the starter in 09. DJK maybe saw half the snaps at best that year.

Tell me any other player in the country who put up his numbers both on the field and in workouts who was not invited to at least try out for a team? Seriously give me one example.

Come to your own conclusions and believe what ever you want, but seriously, don't kid yourself, the reason he was not even invited to a camp had nothing to do with not being talented enough. Guys with half his talent get invited to camps.

Inaccurate. Here are DJK's number of starts per year ....

'07 - 8 starts
'08 - 10 starts
'09 - 7 starts
'10 - 10 starts

That tells me that he was a 4-year starter.

Furthermore, for a 4-year starter his production was disappointing compared to what it could have or should have been.

Also, I know for a FACT that he didn't put in the work he should have to prepare for the seasons. As a result ... his lack of production was glaringly obvious.

Any guy who really did put in the work would have done a better job of high-pointing the ball ... or actively going after the ball with his hands ... or any number of other VERY BASIC techniques that highly productive WRs take the time to get down.

You're mistaking the very basic fact that OBVIOUSLY DJK didn't lack the talent. The ISSUE here, as several folks have already pointed out ... there are TONS of "DJKs" out there. Tons of guys who are loaded to the brim with talent and potential. The ISSUE is that potential means JACK .... it's the sweat equity that folks put in that matters. It's the sweat equity that guy put in that transforms a 750 yard season into a 1000+ yard season.

Talent that doesn't work SIMPLY WON'T achieve ELITE status. And NFL folks know that!

Even questionable guys ... a lot of them still work. A lot of them have talent that is FAR MORE undeniable. And, even then, they're risks. JaMarcus Russell was an uber-talented guys who was lazy ... and just look what happened to his NFL career.

 

[MJSCK]

Inaccurate. Here are DJK's number of starts per year ....

'07 - 8 starts
'08 - 10 starts
'09 - 7 starts
'10 - 10 starts

That tells me that he was a 4-year starter.

Furthermore, for a 4-year starter his production was disappointing compared to what it could have or should have been.

Also, I know for a FACT that he didn't put in the work he should have to prepare for the seasons. As a result ... his lack of production was glaringly obvious.

Any guy who really did put in the work would have done a better job of high-pointing the ball ... or actively going after the ball with his hands ... or any number of other VERY BASIC techniques that highly productive WRs take the time to get down.

You're mistaking the very basic fact that OBVIOUSLY DJK didn't lack the talent. The ISSUE here, as several folks have already pointed out ... there are TONS of "DJKs" out there. Tons of guys who are loaded to the brim with talent and potential. The ISSUE is that potential means JACK .... it's the sweat equity that folks put in that matters. It's the sweat equity that guy put in that transforms a 750 yard season into a 1000+ yard season.

Talent that doesn't work SIMPLY WON'T achieve ELITE status. And NFL folks know that!

Even questionable guys ... a lot of them still work. A lot of them have talent that is FAR MORE undeniable. And, even then, they're risks. JaMarcus Russell was an uber-talented guys who was lazy ... and just look what happened to his NFL career.

That's a good post.

Regardless, Sandeman should have never started in front of DJK.

 

[trj]

Hmmm numbnuts eh…. I see we are digressing. Let me ask a couple hard & fast questions….what is it you want out of this DJK situation, why are you so bothered by it & who do you blame?

Simple questions…..what say you?!

Chad

Not bothered by it at all. You fall into one of two categories with this debate either you think DJK had the skill and enough production to warrant a camp invite or you do not.

Don't get it twisted I stated camp invite I am not saying become the next Jerry Rice.

I find it odd that no one would kick the tires and look under the hood, not even the Raiders. Teams like the Patriots and Colts who could roll anybody out at receiver wouldn't even take a sniff.

I am not a conspiracy nut I do not believe KF has a agenda to keep DJK out of the NFL I agree with Stormin the whole deal is just weird.

 

[trj]

The problem was that your math was WRONG. There's no reason to believe that Iowa would have continued to pass so little through the rest of the season ... and the season itself provides EVIDENCE that we did pass more!

Your estimate of 48 would have been an absolute lower bound. Suggesting that he'd get 12 more receptions than a lower bound is no stretch of the imagination.

JC completed 198 of 370 passes in '07 which would give him a completion pct. of 53.5. I will give JC a huge benefit of the doubt and say he completes 60% of his passes if Moeaki/Brodell were healthy that still does not get Brodell near 60.

Despite the 06 Alamo bowl Brodell did not have D-coordinators up at night figuring out ways to stop him. Before he got hurt what type coverages did Iowa get? Press coverage with the safeties down in the box. No help over the top, no rolling coverage to Brodell's side, absolutely no respect, a complete disregard for the Iowa passing game. All that when Moeaki/Brodell were healthy. And you think if Brodell had of stayed healthy ypc, yac, number of catches all would have went up significantly as the season progressed? No effin way.

 

[dee27]

You chose to compare DJK to Kasper, another great Hawkeye. If you take out the off the field issues and only look at film, 40 time, shuttle, and every other test they give, Kasper would win every time. IMO if DJK put up the kind of test numbers Kasper had he would be in a camp right now.

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