This is similar results to the Stanford study which suggested 50-85 times. Another positive note out of this data is the mortality rate is much, much less than we thought. More in line with the typical rates you would see for the flu, maybe even less.
Are you personally worried about getting the Coronavirus?
- Thread starter EstronHawkKing
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Oh yea if it was mid February and you tested negative for influenza, you probably did have it.
It's because the middle ground reads all the extreme sides on social media at it wears on them over time. I'm to the right of middle so reading hard left over the years has pushed me further right. Celebrities drive me bonkers. Vice versa for the other side reading far right crap all day.
EstronHawkKing
Well-Known Member
Tom Brady breaks the law and get's busted!
Ree4
Well-Known Member
Lmao I doubt you get paid more than me, I do just fine. I'm not complaining at all about my wages - I'm pointing out the insane inequity in this country. You mentioned other countries that are worse than the US, funny, are you just guessing or do you have some data that shows Saudi Arabia, North Korea and Venezuela are worse than the US? There's 8 countries that have more inequality than the US, and only one of yours is on the list. The one that is? China. See any similarities between our countries? Tons of corruption between politicians and corporations. Same thing here.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...e-widest-gaps-between-rich-and-poor/39510157/
I'm probably the least religious person on this forum, but why do people not listen to Jesus' words when he taught that we should use our financial resources to help the poor and needy through benevolence? Of all his teachings it seems the most convenient one to ignore, especially here in America. Or is it just that people don't want the government re-allocating money? Honest question. Obviously allowing people like Bezoz and others to donate as he wishes out of fear from eternal damnation hasn't worked so far. Yes I agree people should be rewarded for their hard work, their ideas and their ambition. I work with people like this every day. I also work with a family who spent their entire lives working incredibly hard and went bankrupt when their child got cancer. There should be more safety nets for people. Our country can afford it.
Don't tell me "well if you work hard and don't do drugs you can make it to the middle class." I'd love to watch you go to Flint Michigan, Forest Park in Detroit or Selma Alabama and try to spread that message. For 99% of these people there is no way out.
Here's a fun video that compares wealth using grains of rice. Keep in mind that 200 million people in this country have one grain of rice or less, likely including you:
RobHowe
Administrator
Completely agree. It's the downside of social media. And that train has left the station.
I actually lean left of the middle (I know. You're shocked
). I find myself pushing back more on my friends way to the left more these days because of how extreme I see them becoming. Fewer people want to listen and discuss topics anymore if they have opposing views. Minds are already made up based on partisan politics.I like hearing reasoned, opposing views. I like to learn and be open to all possibilities. Some posts in this thread made me think, even some by TK.
MelroseHawkins
Well-Known Member
Ree4
Well-Known Member
Nice you only bolded one line out of a paragraph explaining my thoughts. J/k
Hehe, you're right - it doesn't. I get angered because as a banker, I deal with people who work really hard who can barely afford their rent. I've taught financial literacy classes for the United Way and for many of the people in that class, what you said about working hard etc is just not true. I would be happy to see an increase in my taxes to know that my fellow Americans would have enough to eat, access to a good education and a place to live provided they "work hard". It's incredibly likely, however that a tax on myself or the bottom 250 million Americans would not be necessary.
MelroseHawkins
Well-Known Member
Completely agree. It's the downside of social media. And that train has left the station.
I actually lean left of the middle (I know. You're shocked
I like hearing reasoned, opposing views. I like to learn and be open to all possibilities. Some posts in this thread made me think, even some by TK.
Boy this is so true. Both what you and PC stated. Both sides are now extreme and obstructionists. But, I think the far left is just way out there now. Now its to the point they do the opposite of anything, just out of spite. Obstruction. Nothing gets done.
Sometimes I wonder if this COVID situation is a reality check because our society has put emphasis too much in the wrong areas or just on ourselves. Have we lost morality we should have in a society. Is this a reality check from God or the higher above.
I can say God on this site, right??
MelroseHawkins
Well-Known Member
Boy, you sure don't sound like the typical banker. That's refreshing. You make good points. Thank you for teaching financial literacy classes. This should be mandated or offered in junior high or high school coursework. Need to get to the young uns.
I guess my argument was more pointing out the opportunities that can be offered in the US. I agree, when pinpointing on just salary there are gaps. I was making the point in this country, every individual has an opportunity to start a business if they want to. Now, that isn't to say all are in a good position to do it, as you will point out, but, we allow all private business. If a guy works hard and is skilled, they could be self-employed.
MelroseHawkins
Well-Known Member
But, we could have two different things going on here. Is the guy working very hard but struggling to pay their rent really bad off, or are the spending $$ in areas that are not necessities. BEER, alcohol, smokes, lottery tickets, etc.. Is that guy paying for the latest and greatest I-phone?
We as a society now call certain luxuries necessities when they aren't. We take out lines of credit like we are in a grocery store. People didn't have two car loans when are Grandparents and parents grew up. Cable, cell phones, buy water, etc.. It's gotten downright ridiculous.
Ree4
Well-Known Member
RobHowe
Administrator
You just did.
I forget to mention, blaming just the far left or far right for most of the country's ills is part of the problem.
SteveGarvey1
Well-Known Member
If Trump and Pelosi would both be out of their respective offices come January, I don't believe I would shed a tear.
Ree4
Well-Known Member
Of course there are some who aren't budgeting their money at all and buying frivolous things. There are many others who are not.
Grandma and Grandpa didn't need loans because cars were a hell of a lot cheaper back then relative to wages.
In 1930 the average wage was $1,970 while the average new car was $600. In 2013 the average wage was $44,321 while the average new car was $31,352. In 1930 you could buy 3.28 cars per year compared to 1.41 in 2013 - a 132% decrease in the value the average worker hour. There are countless other examples you can find from the link below where the value of the average worker hour has gone down.
Is there any doubt that our industries are more productive and efficient than they were in 1930? Why is it that relative to wages, bread costs the same "now" as it did in 1930? Can we not make bread much more efficiently than we could in 1930? Of course we can. Who do you think is gaining in wealth from the benefits of increased productivity? You can see that it isn't the average American.
Do you think the average person is more "skilled" now and needs more technical training to operate more complex machinery than they did 90 years ago?
Prices vs Wages over last 90 years
HawkGold
Well-Known Member
The thing people don't pay attention to are the changes in cap gains and death taxes.
For example, farming. Legal changes have made it far more possible for families to grow family farms to huge sizes. Land used to be sold to pay taxes. Not anymore. Since less land comes up for sale. So fewer acres are for sale there is usually only 2 large asset buyers in the last bids
Younger people, those striving to get ahead can't put enough collateral up to finance a purchase.
Currently those primarily cash renting are getting smoked. Also since they have fewer assets on which to spread risk they can't be competitive on rent bids, the banks won't let them. I see this in every farm I rent. The skewed distribution of wealth is as bad as it's been in plus 100 years.
People assume that the now dual income is added wealth, but it's the opposite during analysis. We are also skewed by cheap interest which force every day Joe's into stocks where those with clout have far more information.
The divide between education and no degree is widening as unions die. Don't tell me anyone can scrape their way thru college. Ways around..yes, but the jobs go to prestigious schools as well as having a CC on your transcript does diminish your marketability.
It's a huge cycle.
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Ree4
Well-Known Member
Hehe I am a banker for the people
Yes, they should be mandated. I taught a few at City High over the years as well, but it was an elective there. They are moving toward mandating it across the state, last I heard. This is the town I grew up in and I care about the well being of the people that live here.I would say that yes, many have the opportunity to start their own business, but for many others the barriers are so great that it is damn near impossible. I have seen it personally, and Iowa City isn't exactly a poor area.
Yes, that is a big part about doing huge numbers of tests is also knowing much more accurately the death rate. Say it isnt 2% but ten times less at .2% and a lot more people would feel better.
But the news that doctors around the world are finding much higher rates of blood clotting problems in the ill patients it very bad/deadly unless you catch it in time. A young Broadway actor just had his leg amputated because if covid blood clotting issues.
It is crazy that Crichton's Andromeda Strain novel 50 years ago had the space "bug" killing people by clotting and coagulating their blood.
Ree4
Well-Known Member
This is well said, I've been saying (not here really) that while there is so much "bad" coming from this pandemic, there will be some good that comes out of it. It could have been much worse. Imagine a virus that kills 10% of the infected instead of 1-3%. That isn't impossible in the future. It will hopefully open people's eyes about the medical industry and how we weren't set up to help large amounts of people. When rural hospitals are floundering, hopefully it shows that they might be a necessity. It showed that moving production overseas of goods like PPE, while more effective at creating a profit, creates shortages for Americans.
Most importantly it shows that we are all in this together, any action we take will have an effect on others. While it's especially true during this pandemic, it will also be true after the virus subsides.
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