3 Questions for Mr. Howe

[HawkeyeWalker]

If you really believe that, here is their statement. Too long to read. You should try and be reasonable. :https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-we-believe/
KKK 1920:
THIS IS A WHITE MAN'S ORGANIZATION, exalting the Caucasian Race and teaching the doctrine of White Supremacy. This does not mean that we are enemies of the colored and mongrel races. But it does mean that we are organized to establish the solidarity and to realize the mission of the White Race. All of Christian Civilization depends upon the preservation and upbuilding of the White Race, and it is the mission of the Ku Klux Klan to proclaim this doctrine until the White Race shall come into its own.

WE STAND FOR WHITE SUPREMACY. Distinction among the races is not accidental but designed. This is clearly brought out in the one book that tells authoritatively of the origin of the races. This distinction is not incidental, but is of the vastest import and indicates the wisdom of the divine mind. It is not temporary but is as abiding as the ages that have not yet ceased to roll. The supremacy of the White Race must be maintained, or be overwhelmed by the rising tide of color.

Terrorist organization. Full stop.

 

[HawkGold]

I guess I have the same response here as I did the other thread. White people have been trying to improve towards racism for decades now. We need to continue to work at it and the black community needs to work on cleaning up their culture a bit. That's very fair to say.

Why do you think that?

 

[hawkeyebob62]

Really, I have..... On this site, on this post etc... I've seen a lot of rationalizing as to why it was ok (it's like soldiers being trained for war ya know, just like that), why it didn't happen, why the players didn't say something earlier and since they didn't it likely didn't even happen, why it shouldn't mean the end of these guys jobs etc. I've seen a lot of that. I am ok if you're of that opinion. It's your opinion, you go right on and have it....

but I've seen Noah Fant not see the field. I've seen our biggest weapon only see 4 snaps in the 2nd half of a game for whatever reason (no explanations given). I've seen DJK not see the field. I've seen Desmond King get suspended in the midst of a championship season. He's in the dog house ya see? I've seen Wadley under utilized. Not be featured. Was it racist? I dunno, but I at least am curious after hearing these stories from 50+ players of mistreatment. At the very least it was "ME BIG, YOU SMALL" syndrome from the coaches.... all while being shut off from the media, not being allowed to talk, being told not to..... that's not a great culture guys and I don't know how else I can explain it to ya.

Desmond King got suspended for one quarter for being late for a team meeting. It was against Nebraska. Be real, man.

DJK--in one of his wild swings between narcissism, contriteness, lucidity, and insanity,--admitted he was a quote "cancer" at times.

True, Noah Fant did not see the field at times. If you have a problem with Hockenson getting more reps, LTG.

 

[Hawkeyes5]

You more than anyone else in the country have driven this narrative. You have published every Twitter, interviewed countless people, and offered numerous opinions. Based on your detailed knowledge of this situation, I have 3 simple questions for you, which you really should answer:

1. If you had the power to shape Iowa football going forward, I’m assuming you would now fire Coach Doyle. Is that correct?

2. Same assumption. Would you fire Brian Ferentz?

3. Again, assume you have the power. Would you fire Kirk Ferentz?

These are yes or no questions. Please answer them. You have enough data to do so.

Just for the record, here are my answers:

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. No. He is a powerful potential agent for change. Leave him as head coach and see if he can create a better environment for these players. Assistant coaches are fired all the time when they lose too many games. These two coaches “lost” by failing in their ultimate duty to teach and mold young men in the right way. Give Kirk a chance to right the ship.

WHY NOT TALK ABOUT BLACKS KILLING BLACKS??? This is fricken ridiculous

 

[HawkGold]

Desmond King got suspended for one quarter for being late for a team meeting. It was against Nebraska. Be real, man.

DJK--in one of his wild swings between narcissism, contriteness, lucidity, and insanity,--admitted he was a quote "cancer" at times.

True, Noah Fant did not see the field at times. If you have a problem with Hockenson getting more reps, LTG.

I'll never understand why they couldn't figure ways to get both on the field.

 

[HawkeyeWalker]

WHY NOT TALK ABOUT BLACKS KILLING BLACKS??? This is fricken ridiculous

I don't disagree. But in a discussion with a very good black friend who grew up in inner city, gang and drug and violent prevalent area of Miami....he agreed its a huge problem that needs to be part if the narrative and discussion.... however, he asked me why I thought black on black crime, gangs, drugs,xetc was so bad in inner cities of Detroit, Chicago, Baltimore, STL, LA, NYC, etc?

Caught me a little off guard but I said I would guess it's likely combination socioeconomic hardship, single parent dynamics, lack of education, lack if options etc.

He agreed, then he asked why those things have come to be so prevalent? How'd it get to that point?

We kept going...

He is awesome(crazy educated, successful, and ine of the hardest working humans I've ever known, he 100% believes in individual responsibility). With all of that he emphatically states luck and fortune also played a role in him getting where he is, and that with miniscule changes, it could have been wildly different outcome. He's been shot, in a gang, arrested. Ironically, he credits an old, retiring, racist Irish police officer as his saving grace, who he became great friend with. Its a story for Hollywood its so surreal

He helped me understand, well...as much as a white, middle aged, straight, upper middle income, male, who grew up in rural Iowa with both parents, in a lower income family, and has only lived in small towns or the suburbs of a mid sized city...can possibly understand....

In the end, unless you subscribe to the idea that black folks are simply somehow genetically predisposed to violence, crime, laziness, etc.... (which would be the definition of racist)..... You ultimately will come to the conclusion that the plight of inner city black communities was not solely their own doing.

 

[InGoodCo]

Desmond King got suspended for one quarter for being late for a team meeting. It was against Nebraska. Be real, man.

DJK--in one of his wild swings between narcissism, contriteness, lucidity, and insanity,--admitted he was a quote "cancer" at times.

True, Noah Fant did not see the field at times. If you have a problem with Hockenson getting more reps, LTG.

Other players have said white players where late all the time and didn’t get suspended, same week, same season. Hock and Fant played together all the time and we’re a deadly combo. DJK, is not credible, I agree, but is James Daniels? Mike? Jaleel? Desmond? I’ve never claimed Iowa had overt racism, but it was not a healthy culture, the players have said so , I’m not the one who needs to “be real”.

 

[karras]

a discussion with a very good black friend who grew up in inner city, gang and drug and violent prevalent area of Miami..... however, he asked me why I thought black on black crime, gangs, drugs,xetc was so bad in inner cities of Detroit, Chicago, Baltimore, STL, LA, NYC, etc?

....

Hmmmmmmm, something is poppin into my mind (hamster is picking up speed to 5,000 rpms). Those cities you mentioned . . . aren't those the same cities that have been run by the same party that has been promising solutions for the black community for 60+ years . . . and when things don't improve, who do they blame . . . not themselves . . . not the party they keep putting into the Mayor's office and city council . . . they blame the repussicans
That's good old fashion irrational Murican reasoning.

Btw, I also have a friend from Miami (which makes sense since I live not far from there). My friend grew up in Cuba. The other day we were talking and he fell into a thousand-yard stare.
Me: "What's going on ?"
Alejandro: "Something just sent shivers down my spine."
Me: "I'm listening."
Alejandro: "When I was growing up in Cuba, there was always a little spark of hope because I knew there was some place to run to when I finally got the chance to escape."
Me: "Uh huh."
Alejandro: "Well . . . if this country turns into a bigger version of the country I fled . . . there's no place to escape to."

 

[Hawkeyes5]

I don't disagree. But in a discussion with a very good black friend who grew up in inner city, gang and drug and violent prevalent area of Miami....he agreed its a huge problem that needs to be part if the narrative and discussion.... however, he asked me why I thought black on black crime, gangs, drugs,xetc was so bad in inner cities of Detroit, Chicago, Baltimore, STL, LA, NYC, etc?

Caught me a little off guard but I said I would guess it's likely combination socioeconomic hardship, single parent dynamics, lack of education, lack if options etc.

He agreed, then he asked why those things have come to be so prevalent? How'd it get to that point?

We kept going...

He is awesome(crazy educated, successful, and ine of the hardest working humans I've ever known, he 100% believes in individual responsibility). With all of that he emphatically states luck and fortune also played a role in him getting where he is, and that with miniscule changes, it could have been wildly different outcome. He's been shot, in a gang, arrested. Ironically, he credits an old, retiring, racist Irish police officer as his saving grace, who he became great friend with. Its a story for Hollywood its so surreal

He helped me understand, well...as much as a white, middle aged, straight, upper middle income, male, who grew up in rural Iowa with both parents, in a lower income family, and has only lived in small towns or the suburbs of a mid sized city...can possibly understand....

In the end, unless you subscribe to the idea that black folks are simply somehow genetically predisposed to violence, crime, laziness, etc.... (which would be the definition of racist)..... You ultimately will come to the conclusion that the plight of inner city black communities was not solely their own doing.

Good stuff but point still remains. . What aren't BLM peeps talking about blacks killing blacks? Also whites killing whites. Merriweather can kiss my white ass. I wont join the movement until he is seriously ready to talk about blacks killing blacks

 

[Hawkeyes5]

Other players have said white players where late all the time and didn’t get suspended, same week, same season. Hock and Fant played together all the time and we’re a deadly combo. DJK, is not credible, I agree, but is James Daniels? Mike? Jaleel? Desmond? I’ve never claimed Iowa had overt racism, but it was not a healthy culture, the players have said so , I’m not the one who needs to “be real”.

So why now ??? If you dont see this as political then you are as dumb as the day is long. Look up "movement " if iowa fails to seek a resolve and black players want special treatment......I say let it burn. I dont need some smartass 19 year old giving me demands when my tax dollars give his ass a free ride. Will he earn a degree?? Doubtful....Shut down all college sports and focus on education and then LETS SEE WHO RISES FROM THE ASHES

 

[HawkeyeWalker]

Hmmmmmmm, something is poppin into my mind (hamster is picking up speed to 5,000 rpms). Those cities you mentioned . . . aren't those the same cities that have been run by the same party that has been promising solutions for the black community for 60+ years . . . and when things don't improve, who do they blame . . . not themselves . . . not the party they keep putting into the Mayor's office and city council . . . they blame the repussicans
That's good old fashion irrational Murican reasoning.

Btw, I also have a friend from Miami (which makes sense since I live not far from there). My friend is from Cuba. The other day we were talking and he fell into a thousand-yard stare.
Me: "What's going on ?"
Alejandro: "Something just sent shivers down my spine."
Me: "I'm listening."
Alejandro: "When I was growing up in Cuba, there was always a little spark of hope because I knew there was some place to run to when I finally got the chance to escape."
Me: "Uh huh."
Alejandro: "Well . . . if this country turns into a bigger version of the country I fled . . . there's no place to escape to."

Oh, politics.

I'm a Centrist independent, I don't much care to get into which party wants to keep things just as they are. Neither is the party they claim to be and neither gives a damn about middle income or lower communities, regardless of race.

DNC, RNC. Meh. Neither socialism Nor the almight Trickle Down economics bullshit has any history of success.

Irrelevant to my point. I'll simplify, white America history, both political parties, had hands in getting things where they are.

 

[Hawkeyes5]

Btw Rob... thanks for being a pawn. Be a man and see this for what it is. I will never believe in prejudice or mistreatment of people but why now? You guys had ample time to speak but now that the can is open now you speak?? Cowards! Real men speak when they are wronged at the time...pussies jump on bandwagon s

 

[HawkeyeWalker]

Good stuff but point still remains. . What aren't BLM peeps talking about blacks killing blacks? Also whites killing whites. Merriweather can kiss my white ass. I wont join the movement until he is seriously ready to talk about blacks killing blacks

Fair enough. Personally, I understand where Merriweather is coming from. But I understand why folks are put off by it.

We gotta keep the discussion going across the board. It'll be ugly, uncomfortable, and emotionally charged at times with folks maybe overdoing it. I'm really trying to be empathetic and rational...in an admittedly hyper sensitive environment.

There's just gotta be some serious olive branch extending. And likely some fights...hopefully with a handshake at the end.

 

[ModebaSan]

And now for something completely different. Or is it?

 

[HawkGold]

Good stuff but point still remains. . What aren't BLM peeps talking about blacks killing blacks? Also whites killing whites. Merriweather can kiss my white ass. I wont join the movement until he is seriously ready to talk about blacks killing blacks

You didn't read what he said.

 

[hawkeyebob62]

Other players have said white players where late all the time and didn’t get suspended, same week, same season. Hock and Fant played together all the time and we’re a deadly combo. DJK, is not credible, I agree, but is James Daniels? Mike? Jaleel? Desmond? I’ve never claimed Iowa had overt racism, but it was not a healthy culture, the players have said so , I’m not the one who needs to “be real”.[/QUO

TE]

King never claimed over racism, either.

Why is James Danels getting a pass, but Doyle isn't after his statement? Even worse, read the whole Doyle statement. Then, go read other outlets that covered it. Several of them, including ESPN and USA Today, edited it to omit the part where Doyle said he is sorry the players saw it that way, AND he is all on board with them being able to voice grievances, but he didn't do any thing racial or biased.

I think the number of current players--3 or 4--being the only current players responding on Twitter to Dillon Doyle's announcement shows just how organized this is. Rob supposedly said on his podcast that some of the players DID "organize" it.

It doesn't really matter, at this point, whether KF stays or goes, or what happens to Doyle. This season is toast, and my guess is that, failing a miracle hire, this program is toast.

It will either lead to dismal hires of bad or soft coaches, or will lead to the dismantling of the "fascist" game of football at the U of Iowa.

I really don't think people understand what is being done behind the scenes. Unfortunately, I don't think KF will have any desire to stay around by the time "investigations" are done.

 

[dahlhawk]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but initially didn't these stories come to light because general posts were made by a few players indicating that the staff may not have wanted to address the racial issues with the team. At that point, some no it all fans, people from outside the program, or Iowa City residents began calling them out which led to the stories coming out.

I may be off base, but I think the straw that may have broke the camels back was the fans that accused them of not knowing what they were talking about. They refused to accept their general statements that everything was as harmonious inside the Iowa program, or Iowa City (for that matter) as everyone wanted to believe and came forward because their credibility was being attacked. Maybe, just maybe, this could have been avoided if those individuals would have simply shut their mouths and actually listened. As stated in a number of other threads the players and former players aren't and weren't head hunting or going after jobs, but rather trying to raise awareness of what was going on to promote change within the culture of the program.

Now lets be honest, some are headhunting with an ax to grind, some love Iowa and want to make it better for future players, there is two camps in my opinion.

 

[dahlhawk]

I 100% agree with you. I just think there are better ways to go above instituting change. Not making it a sneak attack. That’s what has got me so upset. And I think some of these guys are gonna regret ever doing it this way.

Not attacking anyone but does anyone get the feeling this started by a reporter with a good ideal of getting former and current players their views on race relations in the Iowa program and how they could improve, and then it got hi-jacked by former players who want to burn it down. I have a feeling some of the players were actually thinking they were involved with creating dialog and change and probable would have steered clear if they knew how this has turned into a grievance committee. Getting tired of players who didn't make it in the pros blaming Kirk. He doesn't have that kind of power. I don't tweet or follow people on twitter, barely understand it, it's fast news but people can say anything on it with no consequences. I'm glad I heard some of the serious comments by players who I admire, but I can't say I care too much about the family members and former players who are not concerned about BLM but instead petty personal issues.

 

[dahlhawk]

Other players have said white players where late all the time and didn’t get suspended, same week, same season. Hock and Fant played together all the time and we’re a deadly combo. DJK, is not credible, I agree, but is James Daniels? Mike? Jaleel? Desmond? I’ve never claimed Iowa had overt racism, but it was not a healthy culture, the players have said so , I’m not the one who needs to “be real”.

I work at a place where people are late or don't show up for work all the time. BUT I don't know why sometimes and it's none of my business. The person might have a class, called ahead and got the late approved by a manager. The person might have a valid reason for missing the workout. That is what the lawyers call heresay.

 

[InGoodCo]

So why now ??? If you dont see this as political then you are as dumb as the day is long. Look up "movement " if iowa fails to seek a resolve and black players want special treatment......I say let it burn. I dont need some smartass 19 year old giving me demands when my tax dollars give his ass a free ride. Will he earn a degree?? Doubtful....Shut down all college sports and focus on education and then LETS SEE WHO RISES FROM THE ASHES

So 50+ players are lying - including a few all time Hawkeye greats. They don't want special treatment, they want equal treatment. Of course it's political. It's coming out right now because of what's happening in our country with the BLM movement. Did you seriously say that these kids are sucking your tax dollars and won't earn degrees and to burn it down? Seriously, who are you people? Go cheer for another team please - we ALL want that. For you to not be here.