MSU problems might be just starting

[Hawkfnntn]

Assuming that Aidren Payne is actually guilty of the accusations. The saddest thing would be that, that innocent little girl spent her only years on this earth worshiping someone capable of such vile behavior.

They showed video of his interrogation with police. He was fairly forthcoming with the goings on with the gal him and Appling raped. He said he could see how she didn't think she could leave after he was done with her and it was Applings turn. It sickens me that he said what he did while being interviewed and that it went nowhere after that. Blows my mind. There's a connection between the DA/police department there and the school. For it to get shut down like that is sick. He all but admitted to what went on for crying out loud in what little bit they showed. Pretty much all they did was move them all to different housing from what I can tell.
Much like what went on over at Louisville and how nobody believes Petino when he says he knew nothing of the goings on there I can't believe Izzo not knowing either. Not of something like that. The coaches know where the kids live. If they are being moved abruptly they'll want to know why. It's not like the football team where they have 100 kids or so to keep track of. These power hungry and want to know it all coaches keep up with them because it's their job to. Just as much as calling an out of bounds play is.
Imagine at the time the story this would have been if it'd have seen the light of day. What a taint on Izzo and setback to their program it'd have been. You can bet your ass he would have done everything he could to bury it and it looks like he did. Till now..

 

[HawkGold]

Saying that I'm in my kids medical exam rooms = I don't understand abuse or abusers? That's a curious take. Are you suggesting that I wouldn't know that the doctor was molesting my children right in front of me?

In front of you? It hapoened in Mich. Specifically I was talking about your teenagers and being alone.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

This is a tough watch. One of the MSU players involved in the MSU controversy. I challenge anyone to watch these and make sense of it and have the right answers.

Heck if I know either. One can only hope that that one night his freshman year was the only time he was apart of anything like that. Maybe once he was in the interview with police it scared him strait and then he turned into that person with Lacie later in his career. I want to think of the best in folks. But how naïve would I be to assume it without allowing some time to go by and see if anyone else comes forward.
Now I don't want to come off as callus and have people think I'm comparing rape to drunk driving or stealing a candy bar because it's most certainly not. There shouldn't be any slap on the wrist lack of punishment for it. Because you can steal from me. Hurt me and my car by wrecking into me by drinking and driving and I wouldn't want to get out and necessarily kill you by ripping all of your lips off one by one like I would if you were to sexually assault any woman I know or am related to. I just hope he only had the one victim and not more for sake of the other women there at the time is all I mean by that.

 

[DDThompson]

I'm surprised there isn't a policy or standard that requires a third person or some kind of safeguard.

Sadly, I've come to realize that there are people capable of some pretty vile stuff. But the one I can never wrap my brain around is children...you have to be really messed up to do something horrible to a helpless child and not feel guilt or remorse.

Forcing a women against her will is never...acceptable. Make no mistake. But I do shake my head when I hear stories of a girl going back to a room with multiple men and then things going badly. I have a daughter and we talked with her early and often about being in charge of herself and not accepting any treatment from a boy (or anyone) that she does not want. The second part of that discussion was being smart about the situations she puts herself in, as that is something she is responsible for and can control. I have no doubt she's been in uncomfortable situations...it happens to virtually all women at some point. Fortunately she's avoided the really bad ones. I'd likely be one of those guys who snaps and goes after the perp.

I’m sure there is a policy for a third person in more personal procedures. It was ignored by all the people —even and especially other medical professionals— these girls trusted.

 

[Adam]

I’m sure there is a policy for a third person in more personal procedures. It was ignored by all the people —even and especially other medical professionals— these girls trusted.

I would be curious to know if there is such a policy, because if there is and medical staff knowingly broke that policy that means they are all as good as in on it and they should all go to prison.

 

[lightning1]

Lol. I'm guessing here but I assumed he meant the part about your boys being big young men. While it might be true that it wouldn't be an issue for your boys doesn't necessarily mean that all boys are capable of dealing with something like that on their own.

My sons are 6'1/180 and 6'4/250. They aren't really boys but I get what you're saying.

 

[lightning1]

In front of you? It hapoened in Mich. Specifically I was talking about your teenagers and being alone.

I'm a mandatory reporter that used to work with victims of child molestation. FYI. As well as PMIC.

 

[skinnykilmer17]

Another interesting article from today.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/27/...odayspaper/index.html?nytmobile=0&nytmobile=0

 

[hawkeyebob62]

This is a tough watch. One of the MSU players involved in the MSU controversy. I challenge anyone to watch these and make sense of it and have the right answers.

That was what dismayed me so much about seeing his name in the reports. That story, seen often during a Final Four run by MSU, was a really touching one. Now you just wonder if the whole thing was a "CYA" on his part. And how do that girl's parents feel?!

 

[Hawkfnntn]

That was what dismayed me so much about seeing his name in the reports. That story, seen often during a Final Four run by MSU, was a really touching one. Now you just wonder if the whole thing was a "CYA" on his part. And how do that girl's parents feel?!

I'm sure some attention chasing reporter is going to try asking. I wish they wouldn't because why? Their daughter is now gone and we all have an idea of how they'd be feeling. I don't see them reaching out so don't make them feel obligated to answer. Just leave them alone.

 

[hawkeyebob62]

I'm sure some attention chasing reporter is going to try asking. I wish they wouldn't because why? Their daughter is now gone and we all have an idea of how they'd be feeling. I don't see them reaching out so don't make them feel obligated to answer. Just leave them alone.

It was more a rhetorical question, really. But, I'm sure ESPN or TMZ--and there isn't much difference, really--will chase them down.

 

[HawkGold]

I'm sure some attention chasing reporter is going to try asking. I wish they wouldn't because why? Their daughter is now gone and we all have an idea of how they'd be feeling. I don't see them reaching out so don't make them feel obligated to answer. Just leave them alone.

By asking the question here, there aren't any of us "not leaving them alone". All of us have to ask some hard questions to ourselves as we are all a part of the problem. Specifically I am talking about "worshiping" college athletics. We make players and coaches out to be some sort of god. We base our own emotional being on outcomes of games involving "our team". Living near a Big University other than Iowa, it's amusing to me to watch people wearing black and gold when Iowa is in town. It's very noticeable when Iowa is doing well. It's sort of ridiculous actually.

Anything involving humans is messy. There is no way around it.

I do kind of know how the parents are feeling to some degree. A number of years ago, I'd been laid off due to budget cuts and had time to help out. A friend had a dying 17 yo and they were exhausted so I volunteered to stay with the kid at night. The kid was a huge fan of the local big university teams. All night long he'd want the Big Ten Network on. It drove me nuts. I would turn it off or down when I thought he was asleep, but he'd notice and I'd turn it back on. I was becoming exhausted. His breathing and heart alarms would go off, I'd think it was it and then he'd want to talk about the team not long after the vitals went back up.

I knew the family of one of the players. I asked about setting up a visit from some team members. The family thought it was a great idea. Several players who were starters agreed to come and visit to grant a dying kid's wish. The director of operations for the team contacted me and said that since the Big Tourney was approaching the coach didn't want any distractions and would have to wait until after the tourney. The director said he'd as again. Still no. The coach was under fire and didn't want distractions. I had to get permission from the family, but the kid was never informed about the possibility.

The team lost in the first round I think, don't remember for sure. I got an email from the director and said they could do it now. My reply, "he died this morning". The coach was maybe fired that very day.

 

[Adam]

It was more a rhetorical question, really. But, I'm sure ESPN or TMZ--and there isn't much difference, really--will chase them down.

I sincerely hope that the media will respect the tragic loss of a child. The pain those parents must have felt. It would be absolutely cruel to make them face the pain again only to impugn the memory of a sweet innocent girl. I hope that noone chooses that pulpit to grandstand from.

Now if the parents have anger (would be justifiable) about being lied to and being sold a predator that Michigan State camouflaged as decent person, then let them reach out to be heard.

Again I say all of this based on a presumption that Payne is indeed guilty of this. A presumption that I actually know very little details about.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

[QUOTE="HawkGold, post: 1690007, member: 81486"]By asking the question here, there aren't any of us "not leaving them alone". All of us have to ask some hard questions to ourselves as we are all a part of the problem. Specifically I am talking about "worshiping" college athletics. We make players and coaches out to be some sort of god. We base our own emotional being on outcomes of games involving "our team". Living near a Big University other than Iowa, it's amusing to me to watch people wearing black and gold when Iowa is in town. It's very noticeable when Iowa is doing well. It's sort of ridiculous actually.

Anything involving humans is messy. There is no way around it.

I do kind of know how the parents are feeling to some degree. A number of years ago, I'd been laid off due to budget cuts and had time to help out. A friend had a dying 17 yo and they were exhausted so I volunteered to stay with the kid at night. The kid was a huge fan of the local big university teams. All night long he'd want the Big Ten Network on. It drove me nuts. I would turn it off or down when I thought he was asleep, but he'd notice and I'd turn it back on. I was becoming exhausted. His breathing and heart alarms would go off, I'd think it was it and then he'd want to talk about the team not long after the vitals went back up.

I knew the family of one of the players. I asked about setting up a visit from some team members. The family thought it was a great idea. Several players who were starters agreed to come and visit to grant a dying kid's wish. The director of operations for the team contacted me and said that since the Big Tourney was approaching the coach didn't want any distractions and would have to wait until after the tourney. The director said he'd as again. Still no. The coach was under fire and didn't want distractions. I had to get permission from the family, but the kid was never informed about the possibility.

The team lost in the first round I think, don't remember for sure. I got an email from the director and said they could do it now. My reply, "he died this morning". The coach was maybe fired that very day.[/QUOTE]


I respectfully disagree with you on that. I get what your saying. But I just hope that most of us don't care enough to have it asked of them. They'd have to see it in some way to even know what others are saying. But they'd know regardless with just what's been in the news recently. I bet they've already been reached out to. I just hope their wishes either way are granted.

 

[SpiderRico]

By asking the question here, there aren't any of us "not leaving them alone". All of us have to ask some hard questions to ourselves as we are all a part of the problem. Specifically I am talking about "worshiping" college athletics. We make players and coaches out to be some sort of god. We base our own emotional being on outcomes of games involving "our team". Living near a Big University other than Iowa, it's amusing to me to watch people wearing black and gold when Iowa is in town. It's very noticeable when Iowa is doing well. It's sort of ridiculous actually.

Anything involving humans is messy. There is no way around it.

I do kind of know how the parents are feeling to some degree. A number of years ago, I'd been laid off due to budget cuts and had time to help out. A friend had a dying 17 yo and they were exhausted so I volunteered to stay with the kid at night. The kid was a huge fan of the local big university teams. All night long he'd want the Big Ten Network on. It drove me nuts. I would turn it off or down when I thought he was asleep, but he'd notice and I'd turn it back on. I was becoming exhausted. His breathing and heart alarms would go off, I'd think it was it and then he'd want to talk about the team not long after the vitals went back up.

I knew the family of one of the players. I asked about setting up a visit from some team members. The family thought it was a great idea. Several players who were starters agreed to come and visit to grant a dying kid's wish. The director of operations for the team contacted me and said that since the Big Tourney was approaching the coach didn't want any distractions and would have to wait until after the tourney. The director said he'd as again. Still no. The coach was under fire and didn't want distractions. I had to get permission from the family, but the kid was never informed about the possibility.

The team lost in the first round I think, don't remember for sure. I got an email from the director and said they could do it now. My reply, "he died this morning". The coach was maybe fired that very day.

Is the idolatry of college athletics by fans an issue? Yep, it is. But it hasn't, and isn't, causing the issues being seen at places like PSU, Baylor, and MSU. That is caused by administrators hellbent on protecting their own inflated salaries by sweeping this shit under the rug. Did you know that the smug MSU president, who recently resigned, is getting her $750k salary paid for an entire year and will then receive 75% of that salary ($563k) for the next 5 years....plus get free tickets to every MSU sporting event along with free parking....plus an "emertius" office and use of a secretary for life? That's why they coverup....so they can grow the budget and pad their pockets with bullshit deals like this.....

 

[tweeterhawk]

I don't know how I feel about this. On the one hand, Michigan State should be investigated for its inaction or cover-up of reports of sexual abuse by Larry Nassar. I would feel more comfortable if the individual announcing this investigation was not also running for governor of Michigan so I could feel his motives were to seek justice and not just political grandstanding.

I'm also troubled that at least at the outset this investigation apparently will not cover the allegations of the mishandling or cover-up of sexual assault by MSU football and basketball players, as outlined in the ESPN report. At least that was not clear from the news accounts I've read since Schuette's news conference. Perhaps the Nassar case opens the door for investigators to find other wrongdoing within various MSU departments and offices.

My gut tells me Izzo's and Dantonio's hands are not clean in all of this, and MSU could be facing a scandal bigger than Penn State.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/01/27/us/michigan-state-attorney-general-nassar-investigation/index.html

 

[Casey388]

This is a really good article on espn about Izzo needing to stop making excuses and start being honest.

http://theundefeated.com/features/m...h-tom-izzo-stop-deflecting-and-start-talking/

 

[HawkGold]

This is a really good article on espn about Izzo needing to stop making excuses and start being honest.

http://theundefeated.com/features/m...h-tom-izzo-stop-deflecting-and-start-talking/

Izzo's last interview was puzzling. The normally quite personable Izzo was obviously under stress. To be blunt, he didn't handle it well and raised more questions. Hopefully it's more just his being overwhelmed wondering if he could have done more. He came across guilty as hell.

In his defense, there were in inaccuracies in the question statements by the reporter. The weren't questions as much as they were statements. They weren't entirely accurate and that may have thrown him off if he was already stressed.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

Izzo's last interview was puzzling. The normally quite personable Izzo was obviously under stress. To be blunt, he didn't handle it well and raised more questions. Hopefully it's more just his being overwhelmed wondering if he could have done more. He came across guilty as hell.

In his defense, there were in inaccuracies in the question statements by the reporter. The weren't questions as much as they were statements. They weren't entirely accurate and that may have thrown him off if he was already stressed.

It was so bad. That's why 'no comment' is so popular amongst those folks under the gun. That only made him look worse and didn't answer/resolve anything. What's the over under on him finishing the season? I think it's a given he don't come back next yr. It's just a matter of when.

 

[HawkGold]

It was so bad. That's why 'no comment' is so popular amongst those folks under the gun. That only made him look worse and didn't answer/resolve anything. What's the over under on him finishing the season? I think it's a given he don't come back next yr. It's just a matter of when.

Don't know what the outcome will be. His house of cards may come crumbling down. He may have done what he was supposed to do. The issue just isn't the coach. It's university police, local police, local prosecutors, university officials and on up and down the line. The days of cover up are probably over.

If I hadn't seen some sort of similar things involving criminal charges and cronyism as well as just plain out cronyism, I would have likely not believed a lot of it. It's just pervasive everywhere. Donors have a lot of pull. Politicians have a lot of pull. Money and relationships have a lot of value with universities which is sort of the opposite of what we like to believe about them. It's even more pervasive that people think. At most universities, they may announce a 3 percent pay increase. But the pay increases may to buddies (say 5 percent) while others get 1 percent. This really come into play on pensions. At the end of careers, mediocre employees can skyrocket to higher positions to pad the retirement while those pulling the load get peanuts. Sort of having each others backs if you have the right crony in position.

I know some of you get upset about wondering why in the hell the AD is giving these types of contracts, I've seen it all. A local prof who made about 90K most of his career on average blew threw becoming a Dean, Chancellor and system Pres. Oh by the way as Dean he gave a 60K job to the inept brother on a board of regents member who wanted the ineptness out of the family business. It's just the way it works.

Sorry Thompson, I have my reasons for looking funny at the Doyle of the Year Award.