Kinnick Stadium Seating

MelroseHawkins said:
Not disagreeing here. Somebody either made a bad calculation or mixed the drink wrong. Not sure. The perfect storm happened with the right formula is my guess. Hopefully a one fluke thing. But, to support your point, yes, I think the Iowa training staff had a pretty intense workout regimen which played a part in the role.
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Let's suppose your premise is true and it could be. There are several questions that can be totally unrelated to each other.

1. Was there an abuse of authority to get young men to do something beyond what they could/should do at that point?

2. Has excessive body building been a part of the KF program of turning off radar players into NFL players?

3. Why was Doyle given an internal award at that time?

4. Why did the players drop out?

5. What was the long term damage done to the players?

Those are reasonable questions.

One thing that sticks in my mind. Iowa linemen do well in the NFL. However, when draft predictions are made, oft there is a comment about players who happen to be from Iowa lacking in fundamentals. Devries was really criticized once he got to the NFL as well. Related to that, I also wonder why a school that is supposed to be Lineman University struggles so much in some years on the line. Should it not be Reload?

Drug interactions are also a part of being related to rhabdo.

Statins - can cause more aggressive behavior

Cyclosporine - aggression

erythromycin - aggression

cocaine - aggression

ecstacy - Violence and aggression (aside from being the hug drug). Decreased impulse control. The South African Govt when it was white controlled used this as a way to get people to say and do things they normally wouldn't do.

lsd - aggression and violence

I am not saying this type of use went on at a program level. Individually maybe. However, the older I get, the less surprised I am about the way the world works. I also have to believe there is a reason these guys just disappeared from radar which could be because of a severe injury or who knows what else.

As fans we naturally think the best of "our" program.

Let the criticism commence. Fact is that none of us know one way or another. We do know this was a strange incident.

I do doubt there was a concerted effort at the program level. I do doubt this was an entirely innocent occurrence. What happened in between is good question.
 
tksirius said:
Chris Doyle and his staff have changed procedures to assure that it doesn't happen again but they didn't do anything wrong. It's all on the players. Are you for real?
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Do you think it is really out of line when its been said that those players were drinking before the workout and the second listed cause on the wiki page is alcohol withdrawal. Did you think that maybe the change the coaches were doing were ensuring the players weren't binge drinking before a conditioning workout as the change?
 
tksirius said:
BTW, myself and a couple of others had some super dark urine and extreme soreness in high school after doing a somewhat similar squat workout. Of course, had no clue of rhabdo then and no doctor visit happened. We all talked about it and that's where it ended, so I find it difficult to believe this hadn't occurred with this workout before this case was made public. Just my opinion.
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Very well could have. I have also heard this is not that uncommon among other universities or sports teams. It is still rare that it went that far but I believe for some reason all the ingredients were there that day for the perfect storm formula, unfortunately. There was something systemic just by the mere fact of so many being afflicted at the EXACT same time with the EXACT condition.

Now if 3 guys out of 13 came down with it, one could maybe look at some other outside factors for a causal relationship.
 
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HawkGold said:
Let's suppose your premise is true and it could be. There are several questions that can be totally unrelated to each other.

1. Was there an abuse of authority to get young men to do something beyond what they could/should do at that point?

2. Has excessive body building been a part of the KF program of turning off radar players into NFL players?

3. Why was Doyle given an internal award at that time?

4. Why did the players drop out?

5. What was the long term damage done to the players?

Those are reasonable questions.

One thing that sticks in my mind. Iowa linemen do well in the NFL. However, when draft predictions are made, oft there is a comment about players who happen to be from Iowa lacking in fundamentals. Devries was really criticized once he got to the NFL as well. Related to that, I also wonder why a school that is supposed to be Lineman University struggles so much in some years on the line. Should it not be Reload?

Drug interactions are also a part of being related to rhabdo.

Statins - can cause more aggressive behavior

Cyclosporine - aggression

erythromycin - aggression

cocaine - aggression

ecstacy - Violence and aggression (aside from being the hug drug). Decreased impulse control. The South African Govt when it was white controlled used this as a way to get people to say and do things they normally wouldn't do.

lsd - aggression and violence

I am not saying this type of use went on at a program level. Individually maybe. However, the older I get, the less surprised I am about the way the world works. I also have to believe there is a reason these guys just disappeared from radar which could be because of a severe injury or who knows what else.

As fans we naturally think the best of "our" program.

Let the criticism commence. Fact is that none of us know one way or another. We do know this was a strange incident.

I do doubt there was a concerted effort at the program level. I do doubt this was an entirely innocent occurrence. What happened in between is good question.
Click to expand...


All valid questions at the top. I'm not touching the drug interaction topic as not sure how much relates to this case with the aggressive behavior talk.

Iowa lineman drafted are typically looked at as ready to compete right away which shows they are prepared with their size and technique. Many played as rookies, Gallery, Bulaga, Yanda, etc.. I think teams look to check out Iowa guys for this reason, they come in ready to contribute right away. There are many factors that they look at with lineman and some may not have all the attributes. Like I think they complained about Gallery's arm length or small hands or something if I remember correctly. But, in general, Iowa guys are ready in short time after getting drafted.
 
MelroseHawkins said:
All valid questions at the top. I'm not touching the drug interaction topic as not sure how much relates to this case with the aggressive behavior talk.

Iowa lineman drafted are typically looked at as ready to compete right away which shows they are prepared with their size and technique. Many played as rookies, Gallery, Bulaga, Yanda, etc.. I think teams look to check out Iowa guys for this reason, they come in ready to contribute right away. There are many factors that they look at with lineman and some may not have all the attributes. Like I think they complained about Gallery's arm length or small hands or something if I remember correctly. But, in general, Iowa guys are ready in short time after getting drafted.
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Football is about aggression. All of those drugs are related to aggression and rhabdo. Could there have been a staff member encouraging those drugs? Could it be players encouraging the use? A few of them especially ecstasy are related with aggression and getting users to do things they normally wouldn't do or say. It's plausible. Ecstasy leaves the system quickly and it's use is quite widespread. If I were to hone in on one if I were investigating this incident, that is the drug I would first inquire about. Could a staff member "wink wink" about it? Of course.

It is this type of thing that makes some make a connection (even if totally invalid) with PSU.

When you have a system that is doing something that most other programs can't replicate you have to wonder.

That said, I do think KF has the right connections to get players to be looked at. That might be even stronger than his coaching them up.

I will still stand by my point that Iowa line players are at times lacking in fundamentals. If that premise is true, stamina and physical force must play a big part.

The season needs to get here and Brian F leads the team to a 40 point scoring average.
 
tksirius said:
Ok, so let's say it was an electrolyte issue. Either the training staff screwed up or the "electrolyte substance" manufacturrer has to pay up. Maybe a way to get back that $6.5 million?
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Not a bad thought. MeyerBaum can't be the only one(s) out there with bulldog lawyers.
 
HawkGold said:
Let's suppose your premise is true and it could be. There are several questions that can be totally unrelated to each other.

1. Was there an abuse of authority to get young men to do something beyond what they could/should do at that point?

2. Has excessive body building been a part of the KF program of turning off radar players into NFL players?

3. Why was Doyle given an internal award at that time?

4. Why did the players drop out?

5. What was the long term damage done to the players?

Those are reasonable questions.

One thing that sticks in my mind. Iowa linemen do well in the NFL. However, when draft predictions are made, oft there is a comment about players who happen to be from Iowa lacking in fundamentals. Devries was really criticized once he got to the NFL as well. Related to that, I also wonder why a school that is supposed to be Lineman University struggles so much in some years on the line. Should it not be Reload?

Drug interactions are also a part of being related to rhabdo.

Statins - can cause more aggressive behavior

Cyclosporine - aggression

erythromycin - aggression

cocaine - aggression

ecstacy - Violence and aggression (aside from being the hug drug). Decreased impulse control. The South African Govt when it was white controlled used this as a way to get people to say and do things they normally wouldn't do.

lsd - aggression and violence

I am not saying this type of use went on at a program level. Individually maybe. However, the older I get, the less surprised I am about the way the world works. I also have to believe there is a reason these guys just disappeared from radar which could be because of a severe injury or who knows what else.

As fans we naturally think the best of "our" program.

Let the criticism commence. Fact is that none of us know one way or another. We do know this was a strange incident.

I do doubt there was a concerted effort at the program level. I do doubt this was an entirely innocent occurrence. What happened in between is good question.
Click to expand...

The part above that I bolded...

That's wrong. Look at BTN "bus tour" notes over the years. Look at scout notes. Iowa players have been pointed out as having better "fundamentals" coaching than most, not worse.

But back to the original topic...not a bad seat in the house!
 
HawkGold said:
Let's suppose your premise is true and it could be. There are several questions that can be totally unrelated to each other.

1. Was there an abuse of authority to get young men to do something beyond what they could/should do at that point?

2. Has excessive body building been a part of the KF program of turning off radar players into NFL players?

3. Why was Doyle given an internal award at that time?

4. Why did the players drop out?

5. What was the long term damage done to the players?

Those are reasonable questions.

One thing that sticks in my mind. Iowa linemen do well in the NFL. However, when draft predictions are made, oft there is a comment about players who happen to be from Iowa lacking in fundamentals. Devries was really criticized once he got to the NFL as well. Related to that, I also wonder why a school that is supposed to be Lineman University struggles so much in some years on the line. Should it not be Reload?

Drug interactions are also a part of being related to rhabdo.

Statins - can cause more aggressive behavior

Cyclosporine - aggression

erythromycin - aggression

cocaine - aggression

ecstacy - Violence and aggression (aside from being the hug drug). Decreased impulse control. The South African Govt when it was white controlled used this as a way to get people to say and do things they normally wouldn't do.

lsd - aggression and violence

I am not saying this type of use went on at a program level. Individually maybe. However, the older I get, the less surprised I am about the way the world works. I also have to believe there is a reason these guys just disappeared from radar which could be because of a severe injury or who knows what else.

As fans we naturally think the best of "our" program.

Let the criticism commence. Fact is that none of us know one way or another. We do know this was a strange incident.

I do doubt there was a concerted effort at the program level. I do doubt this was an entirely innocent occurrence. What happened in between is good question.
Click to expand...

Dude, you're playing pretty loose with whatever pharma info you're referencing. Aggression is not a key side effect of all the things you listed...at least not to a significant degree.
 
hawkeyebob62 said:
The part above that I bolded...

That's wrong. Look at BTN "bus tour" notes over the years. Look at scout notes. Iowa players have been pointed out as having better "fundamentals" coaching than most, not worse.

But back to the original topic...not a bad seat in the house!
Click to expand...

You are not correct. I understand your loyalty though. Iowa players are known for explosiveness and strength. The also know basic NFL type schemes pretty well. There are deficiencies oft noted in technique.

Also, I didn't switch the topic. Talk to Melrose about that.

My point wasn't really about fundamentals. However, anyone has to admit the whole rhabdo thing doesn't make a lot of sense.
 
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