Iowa Football Investigation Discussion

[Motigerhawk]

I know you live in Missouri. Rural areas don't hate St. Louis. Some areas prefer KC. St Louis itself has areas equal to E St L. I live in Illinois. Illinoisians don't have Missouri for E St. Louis. They don't give it much of a thought. Chicago is a much bigger problem for IL. Missourians hate Kansan's? Seriously? Maybe 120 years ago.

Afton is an interesting place where former Yugoslavians who used to kill each other live in peace.

St Louis was never going to fall to the Confederacy. I believe MO had the 2nd most civil war battles after TN. Southern Iowa had a lot of confederate sympathies. A lot of Iowan's immigrated from VA to TN to Iowa.

I don't know of any Missouri politicians remotely similar to Iowa's King. Harold Volkmer was a DixieCrat, but did champion minority rights.

The I 70 World Series was quite a divide, I'll grant that.

If my memory is correct, the Iowa 1st Regiment in their final battle wore guard gray and a number of confederates wore blues stolen from St Louis.

You are sorely mistaken.

St. Louis is a shit show. Soooooo many murders.

The rural counties do not agree with St Louis politics.

 

[HawkGold]

You are sorely mistaken.

St. Louis is a shit show. Soooooo many murders.

The rural counties do not agree with St Louis politics.

Said IL doesn't think much about E ST L. Chicago overshadows it. Been in rural No a lot. Maybe a Royals Cardinal thing. Politics yes. But in gen no. Down state Chicago and Chicago yes...

 

[HuckFinn]

Please send me a memo explaining why I should give a shit about judgments of St. Louis, or Missouri, or whatever. I think walleyes from Canada Fight harder, are prettier, and taste better than US walleyes. So there!

 

[Husky28]

WWO....journalism. Ha hahaha ha

And I find it ironic that Rob H liked this post... btw... my posts never said anything about them being journalists... they just did what a large portion of “journalists” fail to do in this day and age... they at least made a public attempt to show the various viewpoints... including their perspective of which they experienced it personally - which btw in some parts verified the reports of the issues that were made public. Do you have an issue with that?

 

[SmokeTownHawk]

Which may well happen, although it may not happen right away. I would hope that Brian would search for work elsewhere and get out from under the cloud. I doubt if they run from this mess right off. The wheels might start turning in the background though. Who knows, it might ultimately be Kirk that initiates the change of guard.

I think it will be Kirk who initiates things. Might not be right away unless Brian is going to be cut loose. Then I could see the whole lot of them including Barta ride outta town.

 

[atomicblue224]

The position is positive and needed. The program needs it. The program should move on without KF and Barta. We shouldn't need a position to make sure we are decent humans. KF and Barta failed at basic humanity.

Well, who is that?

Human decency shouldn't have to be taught to a 60 yo. Nice ostrich move

https://par.pw/l/cx9XD, Like this guy with the hat?

 

[tweeterhawk]

Well, who is that?

https://par.pw/l/cx9XD, Like this guy with the hat?

Hawks represent!

 

[HawkGold]

And I find it ironic that Rob H liked this post... btw... my posts never said anything about them being journalists... they just did what a large portion of “journalists” fail to do in this day and age... they at least made a public attempt to show the various viewpoints... including their perspective of which they experienced it personally - which btw in some parts verified the reports of the issues that were made public. Do you have an issue with that?

I have an issue with the following....it is not unbiased. However KF created a situation where writers couldn't be unbiased. They would be punished.

Language....they are immature. Much of what they say is immature regardless of language.

Advertising. Wow lots of it.


These guys owe a lot to KF.

I used to criticize Rob about some of his reporting. No one...no one properly reported Rhabdo for example. Why. ...abuse of power and he had it.

The real relationship that needs to be investigated is KF and GB.

 

[HawkGold]

Well, who is that?

https://par.pw/l/cx9XD, Like this guy with the hat?

You lost me.

Someone not tied to KF or could be blackballed within the reach of KF abuse of power.

 

[RobHowe]

And I find it ironic that Rob H liked this post... btw... my posts never said anything about them being journalists... they just did what a large portion of “journalists” fail to do in this day and age... they at least made a public attempt to show the various viewpoints... including their perspective of which they experienced it personally - which btw in some parts verified the reports of the issues that were made public. Do you have an issue with that?

They push their narrative, mainly that the problems in the program are less about race and more about tough coaching. And a lot of fans are relating to that.

I saw one of them try to diminish Matt Hankins’ experience when he shared it on social media. Another attacked Rafael Eubanks and offered to meet up and fight him because he questioned them.

When they had on James Daniels and Jordan Lomax, they interrupted them and talked more than the guests.

They served on a leadership group in ‘17 with 16 Whites and 2 Blacks, one of whom was Akrum Wadley, who they dedicated a podcast to ripping apart while never reaching out to talk to him about his Iowa experience. And they picked and chose a few parts of his story to discredit while ignoring the bulk of his allegations they couldn’t.

They’ve definitely added some value to the discussion. I’ve listened to several podcasts recently. I respect their experience as I do the 60 plus players who came out and alleged mistreatment, many based on race.

However, they are 3 guys and some fans weigh their experiences equally or more than the 60 plus who experienced something different.

I’ve shared every story from players and coaches throughout the last month and a half that I’ve seen, including several of their podcasts. Other journalists have done the same. We’ve reached out to former players to tell their stories and ask questions. None have wanted to talk. We cover press conferences and share press releases from UI. I reach out and share UI comments in response to player stories. Some readers and fans don’t see the coverage as equal because there have been way more negative stories than positive ones.

We are doing our jobs. Don’t act like 3 guys in their mid 20s who haven’t even experienced life yet are prophets. They’re a small percentage of former players sharing their stories and experiences, which are much different than most of the others. And I’ve talked to a number of players that see them as being a negative influence on the change they want to happen.

 

[AreWeThereYet]

I think it will be Kirk who initiates things. Might not be right away unless Brian is going to be cut loose. Then I could see the whole lot of them including Barta ride outta town.

I would think any thinking on this would be on hold pending what happens to the season. If they play this year than I would imagine any consideration would wait for the end of the season. If there is no season than you might see some staff changes.

 

[Husky28]

They push their narrative, mainly that the problems in the program are less about race and more about tough coaching. And a lot of fans are relating to that.

I saw one of them try to diminish Matt Hankins’ experience when he shared it on social media. Another attacked Rafael Eubanks and offered to meet up and fight him because he questioned them.

When they had on James Daniels and Jordan Lomax, they interrupted them and talked more than the guests.

They served on a leadership group in ‘17 with 16 Whites and 2 Blacks, one of whom was Akrum Wadley, who they dedicated a podcast to ripping apart while never reaching out to talk to him about his Iowa experience. And they picked and chose a few parts of his story to discredit while ignoring the bulk of his allegations they couldn’t.

They’ve definitely added some value to the discussion. I’ve listened to several podcasts recently. I respect their experience as I do the 60 plus players who came out and alleged mistreatment, many based on race.

However, they are 3 guys and some fans weigh their experiences equally or more than the 60 plus who experienced something different.

I’ve shared every story from players and coaches throughout the last month and a half that I’ve seen, including several of their podcasts. Other journalists have done the same. We’ve reached out to former players to tell their stories and ask questions. None have wanted to talk. We cover press conferences and share press releases from UI. I reach out and share UI comments in response to player stories. Some readers and fans don’t see the coverage as equal because there have been way more negative stories than positive ones.

We are doing our jobs. Don’t act like 3 guys in their mid 20s who haven’t even experienced life yet are prophets. They’re a small percentage of former players sharing their stories and experiences, which are much different than most of the others. And I’ve talked to a number of players that see them as being a negative influence on the change they want to happen.

Hmmmm. But yet they found someone to share...

I’ve never once said their story is perfect... or even said they were journalists. Look. All I’ve asked for is fair discussions from all angles and if it can’t be found, then state it accordingly. That’s where I’m at on this whole thing. Ive followed Jon M before you were around and have continued to follow through today and I don’t have a bone to pick or anything like it. And I’m sure you are well aware that I haven’t been contentious or critical of you or Jon. Until recently... Zero.

But out of a conservative number of 18 incoming each year, 360 over 20 years, nobody could find all sides? I struggle with that.

Like you I don’t listen to them very often and believe Drake will get owned in due time... But recently, I have listened to a few - just to try and understand the full picture.

As far as their opinions go, it’s not hard to read between the lines on their discussions no matter what they say or think. Of course its biased, from their angle... doesn’t mean I agree with them. Like it or not it’s their story too.

 

[RobHowe]

They played with James and Jordan. That's why they got them on their show. And, again, I thought what James and Jordan were able to share was good. And I certainly value the experiences of the WUWs as well. From the start of this story, I've approached it that I would value all stories, try to listen to them all and share them. I've shared four or five WUW pods on here and on Twitter. Their voices have been heard more than most.

I understand struggling with not hearing more interviews with players. But to think that journalists aren't trying to secure interviews with these guys doesn't make sense. That's what we do. I've spoken to a lot of guys off the record during the last month and a half, gathering a wide array of views for hours. Akrum Wadley was going to talk to me and then he canceled.

With this subject, they don't want to talk publicly. Maybe they will in time.

Just like the WUW have a platform, James Daniels and all of the players that came after him with stories used the platform they have these days - Social Media. They don't need reporters to tell their stories. They can tell them directly to people/fans.

It's also why Derek Jeter started The Players Tribune. Athletes tell their own stories now more than ever.

From my perspective, this story to date is lopsided because we have so many players coming out with their bad experiences. Why aren't more players coming out talking about their good experiences? I'm sure some of it is out of respect for their teammates who feel wronged. But even then, you would think the gap would be a little closer.

 

[okeefe4prez]

Can you not really see past certain things? Are things only black and white?

Institutional racism is by definition not committed by an individual. By definition. I'm just trying to help you become woke and not sound like a poser.

 

[AreWeThereYet]

Institutional racism is by definition not committed by an individual. By definition. I'm just trying to help you become woke and not sound like a poser.

I think your definition of institutional racism is a bit off, actually. Institutional racism is embedded within the normal practice of an organization. Coaches screaming demeaning profanities to motivate players is pretty pervasive. There are definite limits to how far you can go with that. Some demeaning abuse is just demeaning abuse. If it is racially tinged or targeted at a specific ethnicity it is racism. If it is practiced and tolerated within an organization or pervasive within team sports in general it is institutional racism.

I don't think the things Doyle is accused of are particularly exceptional in football or sports in general. I am not saying all coaches at Iowa or in general do so, but I've seen enough to know it is pervasive in coaching.

 

[HawkGold]

Institutional racism is by definition not committed by an individual. By definition. I'm just trying to help you become woke and not sound like a poser.

My you are sounding like Deano on anti-depressants. KF represents what institutional racism is all about. An
institution is nothing without people.

 

[HuckFinn]

My you are sounding like Deano on anti-depressants. KF represents what institutional racism is all about. An
institution is nothing without people.

You need to think about forgiveness and people’s ability to recognize their faults and have the courage not only to own up to them, but also attempt to correct them.

 

[HawkGold]

You need to think about forgiveness and people’s ability to recognize their faults and have the courage not only to own up to them, but also attempt to correct them.

Dean? No problem. I can forgive KF but it's time to move on. The Rhabdo thing alone was enough.i just don't believe he should have the chance. How many times should a wife go back to a wife beating husband? Is not going back unforgiveness?

 

[HuckFinn]

Dean? No problem. I can forgive KF but it's time to move on. The Rhabdo thing alone was enough.i just don't believe he should have the chance. How many times should a wife go back to a wife beating husband? Is not going back unforgiveness?

Hyperbole does not enhance your credibility. Nor does your position on forgiveness.

 

[HawkGold]

Hyperbole does not enhance your credibility. Nor does your position on forgiveness.

Thank you Dr Graham.

Should OSU not have fired the wife beater?

What about pushing Urban out? JoPa?

Why not keep Doyle?

Forgiveness involves not wishing harm on those who harmed you. It is not how the Mennonites say....forget it.. move on and leave victims with perps. I don't think you get the seriousness. You do realize the system resulted in players have permeant kidney injuries. KF was involved in covering a rape. It was the standard then. Time has passed him by. Those days are gone. Forgive him but remove chances of further abuse and help victims heal.