I'm taking opinions on Marble's future at the point.

Drew

I absolutely disagree with that logic. Its always better to have two big guys on the court if possible. The college court is not smaller than the NBA court either.

Most good teams do play two true post players just look at the current top ten, Mizzou is clearly the exception, and they are not that good.

Iowa will play two bigs at most times next year.

White can play both the 3 and 4 at certain times depending on matchups.
 
RocknRollface said:
Drew

I absolutely disagree with that logic. Its always better to have two big guys on the court if possible. The college court is not smaller than the NBA court either.

Most good teams do play two true post players just look at the current top ten, Mizzou is clearly the exception, and they are not that good.

Iowa will play two bigs at most times next year.

White can play both the 3 and 4 at certain times depending on matchups.
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Yeah, I don't know where I got the smaller court thing from. I'm wrong there. The lane is far more congested than the NBA game, however. I'm not saying don't play with two post players. It's just that one of those post players better have some perimeter game. If you play two post player with little ability outside of 10 feet ... the lane is going to be very congested for drivers, cutters, and post players.

By playing a big-lineup you just congest everything. You need guys in the lineup that can play with the ball in their hands. Mizzou is unique, but look at the other top teams and try to find many that don't start three guard-type players and one big that can play on the perimeter ... there is not many.
 
drew003 said:
Yeah, I don't know where I got the smaller court thing from. I'm wrong there. The lane is far more congested than the NBA game, however. I'm not saying don't play with two post players. It's just that one of those post players better have some perimeter game. If you play two post player with little ability outside of 10 feet ... the lane is going to be very congested for drivers, cutters, and post players.

By playing a big-lineup you just congest everything. You need guys in the lineup that can play with the ball in their hands. Mizzou is unique, but look at the other top teams and try to find many that don't start three guard-type players and one big that can play on the perimeter ... there is not many.
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This is more due to the lack of quality big men in D-1 rather than by design. If you have two quality big men, you should certainly throw them out there. Like you said most teams don't have two big guys, so they have to deal with trying to match an undersized four up with a big guy.

You want to get your best players on the court together, if both Meyer and Woodbury turn out to be studs, well you better believe Fran will run them out there together.
 
drew003 said:
Yeah, I don't know where I got the smaller court thing from. I'm wrong there. The lane is far more congested than the NBA game, however. I'm not saying don't play with two post players. It's just that one of those post players better have some perimeter game. If you play two post player with little ability outside of 10 feet ... the lane is going to be very congested for drivers, cutters, and post players.

By playing a big-lineup you just congest everything. You need guys in the lineup that can play with the ball in their hands. Mizzou is unique, but look at the other top teams and try to find many that don't start three guard-type players and one big that can play on the perimeter ... there is not many.
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OSU, Kansas off the top of my head.

The lane may be more congested but you get far more rebounds and you congest the lane for the other team when on defense.

The lane is more congested in college because A, teams give much greater effort on D than regular season NBA, when playoffs come, the NBA lane will be alot more congested, and B, there is a defensive 3 second rule in the NBA.

Yes, its nice to have a post who can shoot outside, but I would rather have two bigs who can't play outside than be undersized.
 
hawkfan33 said:
This is more due to the lack of quality big men in D-1 rather than by design. If you have two quality big men, you should certainly throw them out there. Like you said most teams don't have two big guys, so they have to deal with trying to match an undersized four up with a big guy.

You want to get your best players on the court together, if both Meyer and Woodbury turn out to be studs, well you better believe Fran will run them out there together.
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Myer actually has a good outside game too, so win win.
 
what ive noticed is white plays the 4 as a high post that has outside game pulling the defender out of the lane to open it up for bc and marble to attack. he will also play the 3 but i am starting to think him and meyer will be good backups at 4 and white backing up 3 also with meyer backing up the 5 when we go a little smaller. because of how i see white i dont see him starting. i see ogelsby or ingram starting at the 2 with marble at the 3. could marble play the 2, yes but his length will be what we need against the good 3s.
 
that very length is the reason why Marble and wWite should start.
Marble 6'6 to 6'7 and White at 6'8 with his long arms will make for mismatch nightmares on both end of the court

Clemmons 6'1 pg
Ingram 6'3 sg
Marble 6'6 wg
McCabe 6'8 pf
Meyer 6'10 c
for your small line up
Gesell 6'2 pg/Clemmons 6'1
Marble 6'6 sg/Oglesby 6'5
White 6'8 sf'/May 6'5
Basabe 6'7or 6'8 as reports are coming out he has grown pf/McCabe same with McCabe
Woodbury7'1 c/Olaseni 6'10
the starters with backups
Marble 6'6 pg
Oglesby 6'5 sg
White 6'8 sf
Meyer 6'10 pf
Woodbury 7'1 c
as your tall lineup
with Ingram and Meyer able to play as needed, Iowa will be deeper than they have been in years
Marble will be a 2 to finish his career, and White is to play the 3 to allow both to be on the floor as much as possible
 
ogelsby or ingram will start at the 2 because every team needs 1 spot up shooter on the court and they will be our best options (gesell and marble are similar decent shooters but more of drivers, dont know about clemmons). white is a serviceable 3 but more of a 4 and definitely not quick enough to play 3 for 20+ min. since he is more of a 4 he will not start because of basabe. this leaves white on the bench and marble at the 3 as i see.
 
ogelsby or ingram will start at the 2 because every team needs 1 spot up shooter on the court and they will be our best options (gesell and marble are similar decent shooters but more of drivers, dont know about clemmons). white is a serviceable 3 but more of a 4 and definitely not quick enough to play 3 for 20+ min. since he is more of a 4 he will not start because of basabe. this leaves white on the bench and marble at the 3 as i see.
 
Foval21 said:
ogelsby or ingram will start at the 2 because every team needs 1 spot up shooter on the court and they will be our best options (gesell and marble are similar decent shooters but more of drivers, dont know about clemmons). white is a serviceable 3 but more of a 4 and definitely not quick enough to play 3 for 20+ min. since he is more of a 4 he will not start because of basabe. this leaves white on the bench and marble at the 3 as i see.
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I don't think either one of them starts. I think it will be:
Gessell
Marble
May
Basabe
Woodbury

From everything I've read it sounds like Gessell is a better shooter than Ingram and unless Ogelsby makes huge, huge strides this offseason he is nothing more than a role player at this point.
 
hawkfan33 said:
Foval21 said:
ogelsby or ingram will start at the 2 because every team needs 1 spot up shooter on the court and they will be our best options (gesell and marble are similar decent shooters but more of drivers, dont know about clemmons). white is a serviceable 3 but more of a 4 and definitely not quick enough to play 3 for 20 min. since he is more of a 4 he will not start because of basabe. this leaves white on the bench and marble at the 3 as i see.
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I don't think either one of them starts. I think it will be:GessellMarbleMayBasabeWoodburyFrom everything I've read it sounds like Gessell is a better shooter than Ingram and unless Ogelsby makes huge, huge strides this offseason he is nothing more than a role player at this point.
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with that lineup we still dont have a true shooter which will allow teams to crowd the lane. i like what may has been doing but next year i think he is a role player off the bench as a defensive stopper.
 
Foval21 said:
with that lineup we still dont have a true shooter which will allow teams to crowd the lane. i like what may has been doing but next year i think he is a role player off the bench as a defensive stopper.
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Most "true shooters" are role players. Ogelsby is not a B10 quality starter right now. Fran has stuck with May this long, don't seem him suddenly having him come off the bench next year.
 
hawkfan33 said:
Foval21 said:
with that lineup we still dont have a true shooter which will allow teams to crowd the lane. i like what may has been doing but next year i think he is a role player off the bench as a defensive stopper.
Click to expand...
Most "true shooters" are role players. Ogelsby is not a B10 quality starter right now. Fran has stuck with May this long, don't seem him suddenly having him come off the bench next year.
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may came off the bench last year (when marble emerged). ogelsby could easily develop this off season to be a starter over may. but i agree may could very well start.
 
The 2011 basketball poster of the year will wait until these players get on campus. Until then this speculation is meaningless. Wait for my analysis. TIA.
 
hawkfan33 said:
Most "true shooters" are role players. Ogelsby is not a B10 quality starter right now. Fran has stuck with May this long, don't seem him suddenly having him come off the bench next year.
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Sticking with him given the current options doesn't mean he will stick with him as a starter given new/improved options next year.

Not to mention he starts now but he really doesn't play many minuets.

Honestly, not to be hard on the guy, but I don't see much of a reason May should be getting many minuets at all next year.
 
if May starts it will be because he will be the only senior on the team, and i hope May finally finishes out his career like Gatens is, he won't have to carry the scoring load but he can provide senior leadership,
and do the little thing that don't show up in the stats.
Marble is the 2nd leading scorer on this team at over 11 ppg and only avg's 1 3 pt atttp per game
the 3 pt fg is nice, but you can do more damage at the ft line, also if he make his next 3 pointer he will be at 35% on the year, he doesn't shoot from deep because he doesn't have too, not sure what the big hang up is on the 3 is, they are nice but they are not the end all. all you need is to know is that they can make them to make the team respect the perimeter so teams don't sag in the middle. the Threat also is magnified by having a tall center that can and does pass the ball back out to the perimeter guys
 
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marble is average at best on 3s. his percentage is high because he doesnt take many and is very selective on them. no one would call his dad a 3 pt shooter but look at the stats jon found for his senior year he shot like 40+ percent.
 
forgot this...i am not hung up on the 3 but you need a shooter on the court otherwise the whole defense will sag down and take away the drive. gatens ability to shoot the 3 keeps marble and bc able to drive and slash like they do. ogelsby will be our top guy to do that next year. hopefully ingram and gesell and clemmons can bring enough 3s so teams dont sag or go to a strict zone to keep our slashers from penetrating. marble is a good percentage 3 point shooter because he has a lot of room to shoot because he is drive 1st and is selective with it.
 
One thing to remember is that our wings dont shoot nearly as well as they could because of the lack of an inside/out approach to getting open looks. We get almost all of our looks from 3 on down screens and stagger screens. The easiest look at three is if you can spot up and have the post kick it out to you. That's one of the things I look to see improve next year with the addition of Woodbury and Meyer.
 
I'll stick with my earlier opinions on the matter.

I'm not 100% sure Gesell starts right away or for sure as a frosh - esp with what we are hearing about Clemmons. But one of them will be at the 1 at some point next season.

My thoughts are this...

Marble starts at PG next year, transitions to the 3 by mid-season with Gesell and/or Clemmons at the point. Devyn is too dynamic of a wing to not play there.
 
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