Huff to Creighton

hawkforlife9 said:
That's a real slap... Creighton???? Ouch.
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This.

I like Fran, I really do. But he's losing many more of these recruiting battles than he's winning, for whatever reason. Creighton's in what's considered a much weaker conference and yet Huff goes there. We seem to be in the lead for Atwood and then he goes to ASU.....

And next season, we likely don't make the NCAAs....how's that going to play in Peoria-or Iowa City?
 
Maybe Coach McDermott sold him on not only PT and style of play but that he could turn him into the next Dougie Mcbuckets.....haha jk. It's hard to know what goes on in recruits heads unless you know them better then any of us do. Speculating is most of what we do and I have fun with it. Taking it too seriously will only make you miserable. I know someone currently in the football program and have shared some tidbits from time to time on them. So I don't doubt that people can know more about the basketball program too through similar ways. Has he shared anything in the past that has come true to establish credibility?
 
This staff can't close the deal on recruits. Maybe they need to find a new assistant who is a closer.
 
SteveGarvey said:
This.

I like Fran, I really do. But he's losing many more of these recruiting battles than he's winning, for whatever reason. Creighton's in what's considered a much weaker conference and yet Huff goes there. We seem to be in the lead for Atwood and then he goes to ASU.....

And next season, we likely don't make the NCAAs....how's that going to play in Peoria-or Iowa City?
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Fran and staff will always lose more than they win in the recruiting battle based on the shear amount of recruits they contact, go after and garner interest from. His teams have improved every year since he took over. Last year did not end like many of us expected. We will have to wait and see how next year shakes out before I think we can really get concerned. With that said, I thought either Atwood or Huff would have picked Iowa.
 
deanvogs said:
What programs DON'T need the players to develop? Kentucky? I mean seriously, if you aren't a top 10-20 kid who is NBA ready, isn't that the point, that these kids will develop and become better than they are in HS? I'd rather get a Burke or Oladipo (both 150ish type recruits) who develop, than getting a Matt Thomas/Woodbury (both ranked around 50ish). My point isn't to bash Thomas or Woodbury, but rather that lots of times kids ranked well below or not ranked at all become the much better basketball players.
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The hit rate for top 50 kids is astronomically higher. You're picking out two huge outliers in oladipo and Burke.
 
what no one wants to say:

Creighton is, and has been, the better program. NCAA '99, '00, '01, '02, '03, '05, '07, '12, '13; a first-team AA. They ain't the Willis Reed Bluejays anymore.

Huff went to the better program.

Fran needs to land some players, and he needs a sweet 16 trip. If those things don't happen before Utoff-Gesell-Woodbury graduate, then this program is headed for the 8-10, 9-9 treadmill, and the recruiting struggles that accompany it.
 
PalmettoHawkFan said:
what no one wants to say:

Creighton is, and has been, the better program. NCAA '99, '00, '01, '02, '03, '05, '07, '12, '13; a first-team AA. They ain't the Willis Reed Bluejays anymore.

Huff went to the better program.

Fran needs to land some players, and he needs a sweet 16 trip. If those things don't happen before Utoff-Gesell-Woodbury graduate, then this program is headed for the 8-10, 9-9 treadmill, and the recruiting struggles that accompany it.
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So basically we'll be back to the kind of program we were for the 20 years before Lickliter took over.
 
not quite -- Mr. Davis's 9-9 teams had some serious talent (Ray Thompson, Moses, Garner (yes, even Garner), Earl, Millard, Murray, Settles, Kingsbury, Woolridge, Koch, Davis, Oliver, Rod Thompson, and Range were all top 100, with Street and Bowen the unranked 3 stars who really developed) and as a result, could hit 11-13 wins in a good year.

If you're gambling on under the radar 3 stars every year, 8-10, 9-9 becomes the regular level and 10-8 becomes the ceiling -- not a lot of margin. picking up those additional 2-3 wins a year in the Big Ten requires a big difference in talent.
 
PalmettoHawkFan said:
not quite -- Mr. Davis's 9-9 teams had some serious talent (Ray Thompson, Moses, Garner (yes, even Garner), Earl, Millard, Murray, Settles, Kingsbury, Woolridge, Koch, Davis, Oliver, Rod Thompson, and Range were all top 100, with Street and Bowen the unranked 3 stars who really developed) and as a result, could hit 11-13 wins in a good year.

If you're gambling on under the radar 3 stars every year, 8-10, 9-9 becomes the regular level and 10-8 becomes the ceiling -- not a lot of margin. picking up those additional 2-3 wins a year in the Big Ten requires a big difference in talent.
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Mr. Davis went 99-95 in the B10 over his last 11 years in the B10, whether he had more talent or not he was still a .500 coach. He never won more than 12 games over that stretch, and went to one sweet 16. Alford wasn't even able to replicate those results. Iowa's ceiling as a program may very well be a 9-9, 10-8 type program.
 
I guess if the premise is Huff didn't go to Iowa because the players hate the coach, and must have somehow communicated that on the visit or lack of support, how then do we explain Dickerson, or the kid from Chicago, Pemsl last week, etc? It's the same players on the visits.

Fran can be pretty abrasive. But he also fights for his players and they know that. I talk to a few people who are very close to some players. I've just not heard this same sentiment.

Look, there are times where my dad got on my case, hard, and I didn't care for him that day or week. But in the end, I knew where he stood and where I stood and that we stood together.

There'd be people bailing off the ship if Fran were such an *******. How do we know this? We saw Iowa lose its best player four years in a row with Lick. It can happen. Woodbury and Gesell have two years to play and the redshirt. Jok has three. I mean, even Sapp hasn't taken off.

So, do they not like Fran sometimes? I am sure that is the case. ANyone who played at the high school level can say that about their coaches. But that doesn't mean they don't like him in general, or that he is a 'bad person'. That's silly.
 
JonDMiller said:
I guess if the premise is Huff didn't go to Iowa because the players hate the coach, and must have somehow communicated that on the visit or lack of support, how then do we explain Dickerson, or the kid from Chicago, Pemsl last week, etc? It's the same players on the visits.

Fran can be pretty abrasive. But he also fights for his players and they know that. I talk to a few people who are very close to some players. I've just not heard this same sentiment.

Look, there are times where my dad got on my case, hard, and I didn't care for him that day or week. But in the end, I knew where he stood and where I stood and that we stood together.

There'd be people bailing off the ship if Fran were such an *******. How do we know this? We saw Iowa lose its best player four years in a row with Lick. It can happen. Woodbury and Gesell have two years to play and the redshirt. Jok has three. I mean, even Sapp hasn't taken off.

So, do they not like Fran sometimes? I am sure that is the case. ANyone who played at the high school level can say that about their coaches. But that doesn't mean they don't like him in general, or that he is a 'bad person'. That's silly.
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I'm pretty close to the program as well and I can tell you with 100% certainty that this is 100% fact. Players love Fran. End of story.

Regarding Huff - He better hope McD is still around in a few years. He won't have the luxury of his son playing for him.
 
As much as this may pain some to hear, Creighton has more support for its basketball program than does Iowa, or most Big Ten schools, if you look at attendance and you look over the span of the 10-15 years or so. They have nine straight years of Top 25 in attendance..not sure where they ranked this past year, but the previous two years they ranked 6th in the sport in attendance..they were over 17K per game two seasons ago and I suspect they probably were last year, too.

They are now in a much better league, too. So while losing a player to Creighton stinks, it's not like someone just chose Drake over Iowa
 
JonDMiller said:
As much as this may pain some to hear, Creighton has more support for its basketball program than does Iowa, or most Big Ten schools, if you look at attendance and you look over the span of the 10-15 years or so. They have nine straight years of Top 25 in attendance..not sure where they ranked this past year, but the previous two years they ranked 6th in the sport in attendance..they were over 17K per game two seasons ago and I suspect they probably were last year, too.

They are now in a much better league, too. So while losing a player to Creighton stinks, it's not like someone just chose Drake over Iowa
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That, I can't agree with. Take a look at the current makeup of the Big East.. It's a good conference, but the Big Ten is easily as competitive, if not more so, IMO. To say that the Big East is a "much better league" than the Big Ten... No. Maybe before the Big East split up and the AA Conference formed, then I would have agreed with you.
 
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1977Hawkeye said:
That, I can't agree with. Take a look at the current makeup of the Big East.. It's a good conference, but the Big Ten is easily as competitive, if not more so, IMO. To say that the Big East is a "much better league" than the Big Ten... No. Maybe before the Big East split up and the AA Conference formed, then I would have agreed with you.
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Creighton is in a much better league than the MVC.
 
1977Hawkeye said:
That, I can't agree with. Take a look at the current makeup of the Big East.. It's a good conference, but the Big Ten is easily as competitive, if not more so, IMO. To say that the Big East is a "much better league" than the Big Ten... No. Maybe before the Big East split up and the AA Conference formed, then I would have agreed with you.
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I think he was saying Creighton is in a much better league than they were in. Big East>MVC
 
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