Hawkeyes Dreams Dashed in Chicago

HawkPrdatr40 said:
You go ahead and talk about officiating.. I will see the real reasons.

Here is where Iowa lost this game:
1. Iowa had 21 Turnovers

2. Iowa allowed 14 Offensive Rebounds

3. MSU 17-2 Run. Iowa was up 47-37 with 10:24 to go in the game and with 1:54 seconds we were trailing 49-50. Made 1 FG?? That won't get it done.. Iowa also turn the ball over 5 times in that stretch. UGLY!!
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Maybe you want to fact check first; it was 17 turnovers to 13.... not a huge difference.

Iowa Hawkeyes vs. Michigan State Spartans - Box Score - March 15, 2013 - ESPN

Yes we could have still won but officiating played a role in this as well. It can dictate how physical a team can get (but not both ways!) on an opponent which also leads to turnovers and empty possessions. It can lead to a foul call on one end that is not a foul call on the other in a 3 point loss. One team gets to go to the line while another is left with an empty possession at the rim. It can lead to the turnover or a marble offensive foul(?) that takes possessions away as well in a 3 point loss. It can lead to a no call foul on a three point attempt where a clean block is whistled on the last possession. If we had gotten a few of these exact breaks our way down the stretch it might have been the difference in a 3 point game our way.

MSU is a slowly degrading program that now has to rely on officiating breaks to win. This happens in many of their games if you watch. They were once a program that was so good top to bottom that this was not the case. As a bigfan of the B1G it's really hard to give them the respect they once got from me. I like to give props to opponents who are good and playing a good style of basketball,,,,, not programs that need help from officiating to sneak out victories. The evidence will be in the NCAA tourney. Just like last year where they won the league and had a 1 seed only to be knocked out in the round of 16 embarrasing the league. Why? Because they were not that good but and when not in conference did not get all of these suspect breaks.

The bottom line is we do have to learn how to win despite this stuff... but this will always be the mantra for teams not named Indiana, MSU, OSU, Wisconsin, etc
 
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SpecialKHawk said:
Maybe you want to fact check first; it was 17 turnovers to 13.... not a huge difference.

Iowa Hawkeyes vs. Michigan State Spartans - Box Score - March 15, 2013 - ESPN

Yes we could have still won but officiating played a role in this as well. It can dictate how physical a team can get (but not both ways!) on an opponent which also leads to turnovers and empty possessions. It can lead to a foul call on one end that is not a foul call on the other in a 3 point loss. One team gets to go to the line while another is left with an empty possession at the rim. It can lead to the turnover or a marble offensive foul(?) that takes possessions away as well in a 3 point loss. It can lead to a no call foul on a three point attempt where a clean block is whistled on the last possession. If we had gotten a few of these exact breaks our way down the stretch it might have been the difference in a 3 point game our way.

MSU is a slowly degrading program that now has to rely on officiating breaks to win. This happens in many of their games if you watch. They were once a program that was so good top to bottom that this was not the case. As a bigfan of the B1G it's really hard to give them the respect they once got from me. I like to give props to opponents who are good and playing a good style of basketball,,,,, not programs that need help from officiating to sneak out victories. The evidence will be in the NCAA tourney. Just like last year where they won the league and had a 1 seed only to be knocked out in the round of 16 embarrasing the league. Why? Because they were not that good but and when not in conference did not get all of these suspect breaks.

The bottom line is we do have to learn how to win despite this stuff... but this will always be the mantra for teams not named Indiana, MSU, OSU, Wisconsin, etc
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We both know Iowa had more than 17.. I used Yahoo Sports. So let's go to the official site.. Says Iowa 19-13.

Iowa Official Athletic Site - Men's Basketball
 
In addition to outrebounding iowa and having more turnovers MSU also had far superior guard play.
 
DuffMan said:
This is dumb. If the B10 had a rooting interest last night it would have been for Iowa. Them winning meant they get into the NCAA. The more B10 teams in the tourney the better.
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Referees have a tough job. Most at the NCAA D-1 level are in over their heads, though..

And do not try to tell me for one minute that programs like Kansas (ask ISU fans) MSU (ask ISU fans again), Duke, etc. do not get the benefit of calls in crucial situations.
You see the 50/50 calls go their way almost all the time when the games are in doubt. Officials ARE intimidated by the big time coaches/programs.

Iowa did enough to lose the game on their own but the 50/50 calls definetly went the other way last night.
 
Clemmons learned a lot this year. He learned a whole lot from that game last night. He'll be a very physical guard over the next 3 years. He'll learn how to play the same kind of defense that those MSU guards played. He'll learn the ropes about how to use hips, chest, knees, shirt grabs, and hand checks while avoiding fouls. He will have many more assists than turnovers, and that ratio could be 2.5 to 1 when he's a senior.
 
blubberhawk said:
Referees have a tough job. Most at the NCAA D-1 level are in over their heads, though..

And do not try to tell me for one minute that programs like Kansas (ask ISU fans) MSU (ask ISU fans again), Duke, etc. do not get the benefit of calls in crucial situations.
You see the 50/50 calls go their way almost all the time when the games are in doubt. Officials ARE intimidated by the big time coaches/programs.

Iowa did enough to lose the game on their own but the 50/50 calls definetly went the other way last night.
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I didn't try to tell you anything other than if the B10 had a rooting interest in seeing a team win lat night it was Iowa.
 
DuffMan said:
Yes, this comes off as a whiney rant.
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I am sick and tired. Sick and tired of people defending the officials when they do a poor job in a game. Has it ever occured to you (and many others) that there are times when poor officiating can impact the final score of a game? And, on a larger scale, when the same officials' names come up time and again...over a number of years. (HAPPY VALENTINES' DAY!) So, we will continue to watch the bt officials refuse to call what are clearly fouls...like hand checking and holding, contact during or after a shot is taken, pushing guys out of bounds, throwing body blocks during a scrum for a loose ball, and then we can all brag about how the bt is such a "physical" conference. I may well be proven wrong, but I sincerely hope that the "physical" teams...i.e., Wisc, MSU, OSU, get taken to the woodshed by the officials who work the NCAA tournament. And, the next time I think the officials impacted the Hawks negatively in a basketball game, I will post my opinion. Then, Duff, you can (erroneously) tell me I don't know what I am talking about.
 
doclee said:
I am sick and tired. Sick and tired of people defending the officials when they do a poor job in a game. Has it ever occured to you (and many others) that there are times when poor officiating can impact the final score of a game? And, on a larger scale, when the same officials' names come up time and again...over a number of years. (HAPPY VALENTINES' DAY!) So, we will continue to watch the bt officials refuse to call what are clearly fouls...like hand checking and holding, contact during or after a shot is taken, pushing guys out of bounds, throwing body blocks during a scrum for a loose ball, and then we can all brag about how the bt is such a "physical" conference. I may well be proven wrong, but I sincerely hope that the "physical" teams...i.e., Wisc, MSU, OSU, get taken to the woodshed by the officials who work the NCAA tournament. And, the next time I think the officials impacted the Hawks negatively in a basketball game, I will post my opinion. Then, Duff, you can (erroneously) tell me I don't know what I am talking about.
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All I can say is that I'm quickly becoming very ticked off about the way college hoops is officiated. If it was at least consistent, I could live with it. But it is not.
 
Sure officiating can impact a score, but it rarely impacts the outcome. Tonight the officials didn't impace the outcome, that was decided on the floor.
 
ICHAWK said:
If the goal of the NCAA tournament was to get the best 68 teams in Iowa would be dancing...

I don't listen to Izzo at all. If it were up to that clown Lickliter would still be coaching at Iowa. So I don't care what that clown says.
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Think how ludicrous that sounds. We're 68! We're 68!
 
1977Hawkeye said:
All I can say is that I'm quickly becoming very ticked off about the way college hoops is officiated. If it was at least consistent, I could live with it. But it is not.
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Have you not been watching like for the past 35 years?
 
doclee said:
I am sick and tired. Sick and tired of people defending the officials when they do a poor job in a game. Has it ever occured to you (and many others) that there are times when poor officiating can impact the final score of a game? And, on a larger scale, when the same officials' names come up time and again...over a number of years. (HAPPY VALENTINES' DAY!) So, we will continue to watch the bt officials refuse to call what are clearly fouls...like hand checking and holding, contact during or after a shot is taken, pushing guys out of bounds, throwing body blocks during a scrum for a loose ball, and then we can all brag about how the bt is such a "physical" conference. I may well be proven wrong, but I sincerely hope that the "physical" teams...i.e., Wisc, MSU, OSU, get taken to the woodshed by the officials who work the NCAA tournament. And, the next time I think the officials impacted the Hawks negatively in a basketball game, I will post my opinion. Then, Duff, you can (erroneously) tell me I don't know what I am talking about.
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You are correct. The officials are a big part of EVERY game, and yes, they play a huge part in determining who wins.
Players, coaches, and officials all determine outcomes. We blame players, we blame coaches. Why in the hell are referees any different? The bad thing about reffing is the inconsistencies. Refs need to start fouling out players in the first half and then maybe all the handchecking, hip checking & bumbing will cease.
 
ILHawk said:
Have you not been watching like for the past 35 years?
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I have been watching college basketball since the Ralph Miller days in Iowa City...is that 35 years? The officiating got a boost by going from 2 officials to 3...do you remember that? The officials have definitely NOT kept up with the game in the BT. They went from allowing a lot of physical play under the basket, then proceeded to allow hand checks, traveling, carrying the ball, ignoring 3 seconds in the lane, holding, pushing, continuation calls, to the point that the game in the BT has become a joke. If you like the N Boring A, you love BT officiating. IL Hawk, you need to know your history before you make statements like the above.
 
doclee said:
I have been watching college basketball since the Ralph Miller days in Iowa City...is that 35 years? The officiating got a boost by going from 2 officials to 3...do you remember that? The officials have definitely NOT kept up with the game in the BT. They went from allowing a lot of physical play under the basket, then proceeded to allow hand checks, traveling, carrying the ball, ignoring 3 seconds in the lane, holding, pushing, continuation calls, to the point that the game in the BT has become a joke. If you like the N Boring A, you love BT officiating. IL Hawk, you need to know your history before you make statements like the above.
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they don't just do B1G games. The whining gets old. I know my Iowa history quite well thank you.
 
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