Right I'm well aware of what he wrote in the article. So if that was your daughter and that happened would your brother getting blown off by the athletic department be a satisfactory response for you? If the dad was all willing to go pay Pierce a visit personally because of this and was talked down because his baby brother saying he'd go to the athletic department over it. Then after getting blown off by them with the letter (that may or may not exist) the dad was all cool with it and decided to not pursue it anymore because the daughter didn't want him to?? Hmmm ok. Look I think Alford and Pierce are d o u c h e bags for a lack of a better word. That doesn't mean Hartys story is true. Believe it if you want. When storys have as many holes in them as this one does I get skeptical. It doesn't change my thoughts on Alford and Pierce either way. But makes me wonder about Hartys word and what it's worth.
Bombshell Alford Article by Harty
- Thread starter Hawkfromnorwalk
- Start date
SuperNovaHawk
Active Member
I grew up with his niece and was good friends with her throughout our time at Iowa. The incident most definitely occurred. Don't know anything about the behind the scenes following, but can say the incident itself occurred.
sportstalent
Well-Known Member
Harty's word holds more value to me than Alford or PP, for the record.
Just look at the actions post rape and to me it speaks volumes to how all players involved treated anything prior to the authorities being called in, just like every case with Iowa athletics.
tm3308
Well-Known Member
How is that so difficult to believe? Obviously, I would want to pursue it. But if I felt doing so would cause more harm for my daughter, then maybe I'd reconsider. It's really not difficult to wrap your head around, unless you're being deliberately obtuse.
sportstalent
Well-Known Member
There is also the difficulty of proving something happened, given what the situation sounds like and witnesses, therefore it is a lot easier not to put yourself through it. It is still a he said, she said cough, cough Kobe Bryant.
What it comes down to for the victim is given the scenario at hand, it is a no win situation. You lose both ways even if PP was proven guilty. There are always people that believe athletes are simply targets, but they also do their best sometimes to put themselves in those situations, unprovoked.
To think this situation is an isolated event is crazy because it actually makes me wonder how many other times this happened.
Just read back at my prior posts. Hartys story has holes all over it. If the university will acknowledge this report or Lansing admits having written and sent this letter or if this letter comes to light then we have something to go on. Otherwise it's his word and that's it. Well or the niece could speak out now too and be more specific then what Harty was. Now I'd believe Harty over anything out of Alford or Pierces mouth as well. However that in and of itself sure doesn't make his story gospel however.
I agree with everything you say here. Yet as a victim and allowing Pierce to go on without even charging him with it so at least it's publicly out there this guy is a scum bag. Aren't you just allowing him the chance to go on and continue doing it?? I'm not saying it's a no brainer decision for an 18 yr old girl to make to just sleep on it and decide to do that. But I would have thought after having talked with her family and having a guy like Pat Harty who would have the access of communication with the program that they would have chosen a different path then letting it slide with just the letter recieved from Lansing. I do believe victims have an obligation to do the right thing as hard as that may be sometimes. If not for them but for the future victims of predators.
BillikenHawkeye
Active Member
Why would Harty make up a story like this and then publish it if it didn't happen? It's not like Harty is trying to make a name for himself by publishing a muckracking piece on Alford. Yes, Harty said he didn't like Steve Alford, and couldn't report on his teams objectively, but he said the reason for that was because of how Alford responded (or didn't respond) to his niece. I think most of us would feel the same way if this happened to one of our close relatives.
Obviously the reason Mr. Harty didn't push things with the police or others at the time was because this young woman didn't want to deal the the naysayers who would doubt her story or question her motives. Who can blame her? She didn't want to experience what so many people are now saying about her uncle. Good for her for not allowing herself to be victimized twice, and good for her father and uncle for respecting her wishes. But shame on the University and Alford for trying to brush it aside. I was a student at Iowa when this happened and I can guarantee you that this wasn't the only woman who had a negative experience with PP but was too afraid to say anything.
I think the only reason Harty is writing about this now is because Alford still hasn't shown any remorse, contrition, or even acknowledged that he should have handled things differently. Alford is reaping what he sows. I don't think Harty would have written this column had Alford responded to the questions about PP with more humility.
I don't think most people, even the most ardent Alford haters such as myself, would continue to hold the PP incident against him if he simply acknowledged that he erred, that he learned something from the experience, and that he has some sympathy for the victims. That he continues to shift blame and refuses to accept responsibility for his actions shows that he continues to have the same arrogance and character flaws he had while coaching at Iowa.
Obviously the reason Mr. Harty didn't push things with the police or others at the time was because this young woman didn't want to deal the the naysayers who would doubt her story or question her motives. Who can blame her? She didn't want to experience what so many people are now saying about her uncle. Good for her for not allowing herself to be victimized twice, and good for her father and uncle for respecting her wishes. But shame on the University and Alford for trying to brush it aside. I was a student at Iowa when this happened and I can guarantee you that this wasn't the only woman who had a negative experience with PP but was too afraid to say anything.
I think the only reason Harty is writing about this now is because Alford still hasn't shown any remorse, contrition, or even acknowledged that he should have handled things differently. Alford is reaping what he sows. I don't think Harty would have written this column had Alford responded to the questions about PP with more humility.
I don't think most people, even the most ardent Alford haters such as myself, would continue to hold the PP incident against him if he simply acknowledged that he erred, that he learned something from the experience, and that he has some sympathy for the victims. That he continues to shift blame and refuses to accept responsibility for his actions shows that he continues to have the same arrogance and character flaws he had while coaching at Iowa.
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okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
Hilarious. There is no evidence from the article Alford even knew. And he is reaping what he sows? What the hell does that mean? He just walked into one of the five best college basketball head coach jobs in the country and got a giant, fairly long term contract that he will get paid on no matter how he performs. Sounds like he is really getting punished by God or karma or whatever for his missteps. Oh yeah, buddy, he really cares what some guy in Crapids thinks about him.
Billso
Well-Known Member
Billiken was referring to Alford's handling of the rape case, not Harty's niece. Don't be obtuse.
franstheman
Well-Known Member
WOW, This changes my opinion of the guy.
hawkeyebob62
Well-Known Member
Given what we do/don't know about the timing of the incident, and the fact the girl had only been on-campus a couple weeks...how did she know who Pierre Pierce was? OTOH, why was Pierce allowed to stay at Iowa? Why not give him an ultimatum that he either comes clean, or he's gone?
Unfortunately, there's too much we don't know. We don't know how often or thoroughly Pierce was questioned, whether his alocution on his guilty plea was consistent/factual (i.e., did he only give the story once, and if more than once, were all accounts consistent?), how much the victim was willing to have to "relive", etc.
It's disturbing, though, that victims too often don't/won't testify or press charges because they want to "move on", "get past it", etc. Are there not counselors available who can show some sorts of statistics or studies that NOT confronting might lead to PTSD, suppressed anger, etc.?
tm3308
Well-Known Member
I feel like PTSD, etc. is probably still a strong possibility, even if the victim testifies. But also, Harty's niece wasn't raped. Her screams got him out of the room. Which is another reason I'm guessing she didn't want to go through with it. It'd be tough enough for her on campus if she'd been raped and chose to go after Iowa's star basketball player. But to do it when the assault only nearly occurred would make the scrutiny focused on here all the more intense. There would be no DNA evidence, just her word against his.
hawkeyebob62
Well-Known Member
I still wonder how she knew who Pierre Pierce was. OTOH, while I can understand her reluctance, I also wonder if peer pressure made her reluctant, or whether she actually invited Pierce to her room, or whatever. In other words, by NOT pressing on, too many variables and permutations can be postulated by message board folks like us
tm3308
Well-Known Member
I still wonder how she knew who Pierre Pierce was. OTOH, while I can understand her reluctance, I also wonder if peer pressure made her reluctant, or whether she actually invited Pierce to her room, or whatever. In other words, by NOT pressing on, too many variables and permutations can be postulated by message board folks like us
Pierce would have been a sophomore at the time of the incident, so he was already known across the state.
I think what he's questioning is would an 18 yr old girl know who Pierce is regardless of how well known he is as an athlete. I can see that but I'll give her that benefit of the doubt since her uncle is a writer for Iowa sports. She may have not known who he was at first or till after he'd left and she saw his face other ways. That we just don't know yet either.
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
Steve Alford is a piece of $h!t. Plain and simple.
sportstalent
Well-Known Member
Since no assault of any kind took place just how far can you take it? That is the problem with the incident, she was able to not be a victim and if she did want to pursue anything from there how can it be proven, it can't without a bunch of people. Probably more than normal because he is an athlete and would 'never' do anything wrong because he is 'a good kid' just ask his coach.
hawkdrummer1
Well-Known Member
Sure, he made most of this up. Makes sense...he'd put his credibility and career on the line with a made up story. And his editors would go right along with it, making their newspaper vulnerable to a lawsuits by both the University and Alford. His brother and niece are in on it too...for sure.
Yeah, that makes sense.
