Watching the PTL games

deanvogs said:
Everything else I've seen about Bohannon and Williams was positive (Sans Lightning of course). Many mentioned that Moss struggled shooting.
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I said positive things about their basketball abilities. But neither one of them are BIG PGs. That's what I'm saying and apparently it bothers some people. It's not my fault they will be asked to play a position they are not best suited to play.
I will reiterate, CW is a very capable SG/SF for a BIG team. As a SO, here's better suited as a backup to a guy like Jok or he could start but will have a learning curve.
Bohannon can play SG all day long. He's not going to create his own offense or run an offense but he doesn't have to. He is exactly what we wanted Ogelsby and Ellingson for.
 


lightning1 said:
Not absolutes. My absolute opinion. I don't care who won the game.
CW didn't abuse anyone in the post. And even if he did....how does that make him a starting BIG PG? As far a his PG abilities go...the 8+ turnovers is where the rubber meets the road, in my opinion. You guys can hold your breath waiting for him to abuse a Tom Izzo team in the post.
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I said in an earlier thread you won't be able to learn a whole lot from PTL on CW's ability as a PG. The turnovers, if there were that many, are alarming, but again playing with a bunch of players you haven't played with and when playing glorified pickup ball, that stuff tends to happen.

With PTL, things are never as good as they seem, and probably never bad as they seem. On one hand you had people wondering if Cook was a one and done, on the other you had yourself (and 5656) crying wolf about the PG situation. IMO, it's probably somewhere in the middle. The great thing is though, there is plenty of time to improve before the season.

Oh, and FWIW I think CW would be able to take advantage of 5'11 Tum Tum Nairn, Winston, and McQuaid in the post.
 


NikeHawk21 said:
I said in an earlier thread you won't be able to learn a whole lot from PTL on CW's ability as a PG. The turnovers, if there were that many, are alarming, but again playing with a bunch of players you haven't played with and when playing glorified pickup ball, that stuff tends to happen.

With PTL, things are never as good as they seem, and probably never bad as they seem. On one hand you had people wondering if Cook was a one and done, on the other you had yourself (and 5656) crying wolf about the PG situation. IMO, it's probably somewhere in the middle. The great thing is though, there is plenty of time to improve before the season.

Oh, and FWIW I think CW would be able to take advantage of 5'11 Tum Tum Nairn, Winston, and McQuaid in the post.
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McQuaid is 6'5 and Winston is tough as nails. I'm more worried about CW and Bohannon defending Nairn and Winston than anything they will do offensively.
 




Hawk5656 said:
McQuaid is 6'5 and Winston is tough as nails. I'm more worried about CW and Bohannon defending Nairn and Winston than anything they will do offensively.
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I believe the book on defending Nairn was sag way off him into the lane, seemed to work for most teams last year.
 






Hawk5656 said:
I'd be surprised if Winston wasn't their starting PG this year.
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I agree, I think Wintson will start, surprised Nairn didn't transfer.

The thing with mismatches is, you take advantage of them when they are there, and go elsewhere when they are not. There will be a few Big10 teams that primarily play smaller guards.
 


lightning1 said:
It won't fly against BIG teams. Not enough to get up a top half finish in the league. 7-10 maybe. Which is enough for most of the people here.
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After 1 PTL game you have already declared that we don't have a PG, and that we will finish 7-10 in the B1G (guessing you meant 7-11). Did you predict they would finish 3rd in the B1G with 12 wins last year?

I haven't seen any of the new players and I'd be willing to bet you whatever you want that this team finishes with AT LEAST 7 B1G wins. It only took Fran til year 2 to get the miserable roster he inherited to win 8 games, and he hasn't been below that since. No way, no how will he finish with less than 7 B1G wins.
 




deanvogs said:
After 1 PTL game you have already declared that we don't have a PG, and that we will finish 7-10 in the B1G (guessing you meant 7-11). Did you predict they would finish 3rd in the B1G with 12 wins last year?

I haven't seen any of the new players and I'd be willing to bet you whatever you want that this team finishes with AT LEAST 7 B1G wins. It only took Fran til year 2 to get the miserable roster he inherited to win 8 games, and he hasn't been below that since. No way, no how will he finish with less than 7 B1G wins.
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Pretty sure he meant 7-10 in the standings.
 


FCAS said:
Maybe I'm in the minority, but I just can't place any meaning on how many turnovers a guy has in a glorified pickup game.
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I agree. You can kinda get a feel for a player by other stats, but turnovers are a lot more likely in an environment like that.
 


NikeHawk21 said:
I said in an earlier thread you won't be able to learn a whole lot from PTL on CW's ability as a PG. The turnovers, if there were that many, are alarming, but again playing with a bunch of players you haven't played with and when playing glorified pickup ball, that stuff tends to happen.

With PTL, things are never as good as they seem, and probably never bad as they seem. On one hand you had people wondering if Cook was a one and done, on the other you had yourself (and 5656) crying wolf about the PG situation. IMO, it's probably somewhere in the middle. The great thing is though, there is plenty of time to improve before the season.

Oh, and FWIW I think CW would be able to take advantage of 5'11 Tum Tum Nairn, Winston, and McQuaid in the post.
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I never said or implied Cook is a 1 and done. You have me mixed up someone else. You don't have to wonder "if" there were that many turnovers. I counted that many by 1/2 way thru the 2nd half. The PTL league doesn't tell you much but it tells me if he's capable of 8 turnovers against a bunch of people D-2 or low D-1 competition, how many will he give up against BIG competition?
 


lightning1 said:
I never said or implied Cook is a 1 and done. You have me mixed up someone else. You don't have to wonder "if" there were that many turnovers. I counted that many by 1/2 way thru the 2nd half. The PTL league doesn't tell you much but it tells me if he's capable of 8 turnovers against a bunch of people D-2 or low D-1 competition, how many will he give up against BIG competition?
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He'll be fine against B1G competition, Fran doesn't need a PG to run his offense. That's what I've been told anyways
 


NikeHawk21 said:
I said in an earlier thread you won't be able to learn a whole lot from PTL on CW's ability as a PG. The turnovers, if there were that many, are alarming, but again playing with a bunch of players you haven't played with and when playing glorified pickup ball, that stuff tends to happen.

With PTL, things are never as good as they seem, and probably never bad as they seem. On one hand you had people wondering if Cook was a one and done, on the other you had yourself (and 5656) crying wolf about the PG situation. IMO, it's probably somewhere in the middle. The great thing is though, there is plenty of time to improve before the season.

Oh, and FWIW I think CW would be able to take advantage of 5'11 Tum Tum Nairn, Winston, and McQuaid in the post.
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CW is better suited for the 3, in my opinion because he has skills around the basket. He's a tough match up against smaller players, inside. But he's a liability against smaller players on the perimeter, where he'll get his pocket picked by quicker smaller guards. CW doesn't have PG handles. I'm sorry but that is a fact and a fact that can easily be determined by watching him play 1 PTL game.
 


lightning1 said:
I never said or implied Cook is a 1 and done. You have me mixed up someone else. You don't have to wonder "if" there were that many turnovers. I counted that many by 1/2 way thru the 2nd half. The PTL league doesn't tell you much but it tells me if he's capable of 8 turnovers against a bunch of people D-2 or low D-1 competition, how many will he give up against BIG competition?
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Re-read my post. My point it that some people were overly optimistic and some people were overly pessimistic after one PTL game. You were on the pessimistic side. Either way a long way till the season.
 


PCHawk said:
I agree. You can kinda get a feel for a player by other stats, but turnovers are a lot more likely in an environment like that.
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That depends on the turnovers. These weren't the behind the back, flashy pass variety. But you'll see soon enough when the season starts.
 


lightning1 said:
CW is better suited for the 3, in my opinion because he has skills around the basket. He's a tough match up against smaller players, inside. But he's a liability against smaller players on the perimeter, where he'll get his pocket picked by quicker smaller guards. CW doesn't have PG handles. I'm sorry but that is a fact and a fact that can easily be determined by watching him play 1 PTL game.
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Did you watch any games when Gesell was the PG? About the only good stat he had was limiting turnovers. Otherwise he was nonexistent. If they could win with him running point with his disappearing act then they'll be able to win with CW or JB or whoever else they decide to try at point.
 


NikeHawk21 said:
Re-read my post. My point it that some people were overly optimistic and some people were overly pessimistic after one PTL game. You were on the pessimistic side. Either way a long way till the season.
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I like the length and skill level of our team. If Fran decides to play 10 deep, 20 mins each and run, run, run...I like our chances of going to the tournament. We have enough guard skill to do that. We don't have the guard skill to play traditional half court offense.
 


DP5555 said:
Did you watch any games when Gesell was the PG? About the only good stat he had was limiting turnovers. Otherwise he was nonexistent. If they could win with him running point with his disappearing act then they'll be able to win with CW or JB or whoever else they decide to try at point.
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True. But Gesell could dribble the ball in and around defenders without getting his pocket picked. Even Sapp could do that.
 


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