This sucks

[Northside Hawk]

It's a shitty season mixed in with a bunch of mediocre seasons. It's time to move on. We've seen the ceiling with Fran and it's a 2nd round NCAA beat down.

I'm sick of second round beat downs. And Mr. Davis had more than his share. And Lute actually had more than his share of first round chokes (Stan Joplin, among others, says hello). I often wonder how these boards would have treated Lute if social media was around in those days. He is revered in these parts and rightly so. But his teams left my heart in about a hundred thousand pieces more than once.

Wouldn't just one extended run in the dance be cool as hell? Like the Bucky's in the Kaminsky/Dekker era?

 

[PCHawk]

Just to be clear, I'm not even arguing whether or not Fran should keep his job. All I'm saying is it has to be really really bad to want to root against him, just for the sake of change.

 

[PCHawk]

Are you f'ing serious?!! He has been here 8 years. Don't you think he should have figured out by now "he just needs to focus more time on it" ??

He either doesn't know how to coach defense or doesn't care. Which is it? Because he has a history. What is the common denominator because the last time I checked no player has 8 years of eligibility?

That's my point. We don't know whether he doesn't know how or he doesn't care. That was the whole point of my post. Why do you start your post with "are you serious" then end it agreeing with me?

 

[lightning1]

Just to be clear, I'm not even arguing whether or not Fran should keep his job. All I'm saying is it has to be really really bad to want to root against him, just for the sake of change.

Not in my opinion. When change is the only hope you have, you want to get it going as soon as possible.

 

[PCHawk]

I guess it depends on your definition of "pretty good". If the NCAA appearances were more regular, I'd be more inclined to agree with you. But two 2nd round beat downs in 8 years, and a First Four loss.. Things have also trended downwards the last couple seasons in a big way. A few years ago, I was satisfied, but at this point, Fran's body of work Leaves me cold. Lukewarm at best.

Fran's gotta make the dance next year or he'll lose me completely.

As for rooting against the Hawks.. I'd rather see them win of course (to answer your question about a hypothetical 3rd place finish next year) but from a certain perspective, I kind of can see where some people are coming from with that.

With Barta at the helm, it's not hard for a coach to do just enough to keep his job and get a fat extension/buyout, keeping us mired in overall mediocrity for several more years. I guess some people would rather a fresh start than continued stagnation, right or wrong.

My definition of pretty good was based on individual seasons. Fran has shown he can have pretty good seasons and he's shown he can string together pretty good seasons. Now he has shown he can have awful seasons. He also hasn't shown he can have a complete great season yet. He's shown signs he can. But he hasn't done it yet.

 

[lightning1]

That's my point. We don't know whether he doesn't know how or he doesn't care. That was the whole point of my post. Why do you start your post with "are you serious" then end it agreeing with me?

The fact that we are debating whether or not Fran knows how to do his job....should seal the deal on everyone wanting his dismissal. NOW!

 

[Northside Hawk]

Are you f'ing serious?!! He has been here 8 years. Don't you think he should have figured out by now "he just needs to focus more time on it" ??

He either doesn't know how to coach defense or doesn't care. Which is it? Because he has a history. What is the common denominator because the last time I checked no player has 8 years of eligibility?

Jess Settles had at least eight years of elgibility. He was one year removed from playing with Acie Earl and one year removed from playing for Steve Alford.

 

[lightning1]

I'm sick of second round beat downs. And Mr. Davis had more than his share. And Lute actually had more than his share of first round chokes (Stan Joplin, among others, says hello). I often wonder how these boards would have treated Lute if social media was around in those days. He is revered in these parts and rightly so. But his teams left my heart in about a hundred thousand pieces more than once.

Wouldn't just one extended run in the dance be cool as hell? Like the Bucky's in the Kaminsky/Dekker era?

Lute's 1979-80 team was the last Final Four we had. It was also the first season that I started following Iowa basketball.
Lute's NCAA losses were 2pts, 3 pts, 4 pts and 1 pt. The 79-80 Final Four loss was 17 pts because Lester couldn't go. With a healthy Lester, we beat that Purdue team. Thinking about those days just makes me more upset about the current state of Iowa basketball. Iowa basketball over the past 25 years, in fact.

 

[Northside Hawk]

Lute's 1979-80 team was the last Final Four we had. It was also the first season that I started following Iowa basketball.
Lute's NCAA losses were 2pts, 3 pts, 4 pts and 1 pt. The 79-80 Final Four loss was 17 pts because Lester couldn't go. With a healthy Lester, we beat that Purdue team. Thinking about those days just makes me more upset about the current state of Iowa basketball. Iowa basketball over the past 25 years, in fact.

With a healthy Lester, we don't play that Purdue team because we would have played (and beat) UCLA for the championship. But you already knew that. I'm not down on Lute, but think Kirk Ferentz with me for a minute. Lute pissed away several NCAA games and late season Big Ten games (in the pre shot clock era, and that's critical in this argument) because he stalled late in games and let lesser competition hang around. Remember Toledo in 1979, Wichita State in 1981, and Idaho in 1982. But you are right. While the last 25 years haven't been complete misery, sometimes it's better to have lost in love than to have not lost at all, so to speak.

 

[revkev73]

Embrace the change...

Fran is loading up on slow white guys...and...

He has talked about trying to coach defense...

RAISE!!!!!!!

 

[PCHawk]

The fact that we are debating whether or not Fran knows how to do his job....should seal the deal on everyone wanting his dismissal. NOW!

If the deciding factor on whether a coach should be fired or not is if fans on a message board question if he can do his job, there would be a lot of job openings as of right NOW!!!!!!!!!

 

[revkev73]

Let's do it the Iowa way...pretend the program is great, the coaching is great, the players are quick and deep down really "love" to play defense...and also understand that the team would be much better if every fan was positive instead of questioning the decisions made my incompetent multi millionaires...the sports intelligentsia of Iowa...

Yah...that works...

 

[trj]

At this point I am hoping my patience will be rewarded. Similar to Villanova sticking with Jay Wright on multiple occasions. A deep run in the tournament in 19-20 and all of this would have been worth it.

 

[ArvadaHawk]

We don't have a point guard in the traditional sense but JBo knows how to feed the post at the right angle which many jet quick points don't know how to do. Getting the ball inside, even at the high school level, doesn't do any good if said post player is tied up when he receives it. JBo isn't racking all those assists up by accident. But all comments about his defense are well founded. And as has often been pointed out the rest of the defense crumbles like a house of cards.

North, JBo gets many of his assists in the open court. Our problems are in the half court. It is clear that JBo has problems in the half court initiating the offense when the defense is in man defense. Overall foot speed and lateral quickness show on both offense and defense. Look beyond the assist stats and watch how the offense operates in the half court and watch how often our opponents get into the lane and break our defensive integrity.

 

[lightning1]

With a healthy Lester, we don't play that Purdue team because we would have played (and beat) UCLA for the championship. But you already knew that. I'm not down on Lute, but think Kirk Ferentz with me for a minute. Lute pissed away several NCAA games and late season Big Ten games (in the pre shot clock era, and that's critical in this argument) because he stalled late in games and let lesser competition hang around. Remember Toledo in 1979, Wichita State in 1981, and Idaho in 1982. But you are right. While the last 25 years haven't been complete misery, sometimes it's better to have lost in love than to have not lost at all, so to speak.

Oh yeah. We lost to Louisville and the Purdue game was consolation. I thought something about that scenario didn't feel right. It's been a long time to go off memory. My apologies. I was 9 years old when I started watching Lute Olsen's teams. I don't have a great recollection of them. I suppose my adult opinion of his results might differ from my opinion of them when I was a kid.

 

[Northside Hawk]

North, JBo gets many of his assists in the open court. Our problems are in the half court. It is clear that JBo has problems in the half court initiating the offense when the defense is in man defense. Overall foot speed and lateral quickness show on both offense and defense. Look beyond the assist stats and watch how the offense operates in the half court and watch how often our opponents get into the lane and break our defensive integrity.

Points well taken. One of the reasons the half court struggled, like you say, is because Cordell was dribbling the ball of his leg or getting it stripped from his hands when he tried to make his move. One of the 178 ways he wasn't as effective this year. JBo was trying. And I like Cordell. He just needs to get his head in a good place, accept his role (he's no Garza), and come back strong.

 

[Northside Hawk]

Oh yeah. We lost to Louisville and the Purdue game was consolation. I thought something about that scenario didn't feel right. It's been a long time to go off memory. My apologies. I was 9 years old when I started watching Lute Olsen's teams. I don't have a great recollection of them. I suppose my adult opinion of his results might differ from my opinion of them when I was a kid.

I know how you feel. When I went to school the Hamburg Inn was my second third and fourth food group (along with, of course, Paul Revere's Wedgies). Now when I return to Iowa City I'm scared to take my wife there because it may not be as I remembered thirty years ago. And by the way, I'm only about five years older than you.

 

[lightning1]

I know how you feel. When I went to school the Hamburg Inn was my second third and fourth food group. Now when I return to Iowa City I'm scared to take my wife there because it may not be as I remembered thirty years ago. And by the way, I'm only about five years older than you.

I remember the mid 80s teams a lot better than Lute's teams, as far as game by game results. The quality of Big Ten basketball back in the mid to late 80s still blows my mind.

 

[lightning1]

If the deciding factor on whether a coach should be fired or not is if fans on a message board question if he can do his job, there would be a lot of job openings as of right NOW!!!!!!!!!

You're the one "questioning" it. Most of us already know the answer.

 

[Northside Hawk]

I remember the mid 80s teams a lot better than Lute's teams, as far as game by game results. The quality of Big Ten basketball back in the mid to late 80s still blows my mind.

This OMG. Even middle of the pack conference teams had players like Scott Skiles, Dennis Hopson. In January 1987 Iowa, Purdue, Illinois, and Indiana were all ranked in the top ten and Iowa beat them all in eight days. Dick Vitale made regular visits to town because Iowa was frequently playing in the biggest game in the country that night. Students had no trouble finding Carver back then. And the blue hairs were told to take their bridge tournaments elsewhere.