THIS RECRUITING STORY IS GETTING OLD

[greenrocket]

I listened to the On Iowa Pod last night and Dochterman was saying he heard that Atwood played a pickup game with the team on his visit...and he had his stuff handed to him by Uthoff and White and that he wasn't going to be starting for Iowa next year if he came there....and Arizona State, he probably will. If that did happen and was a part of it all, is that 'losing out' on a player?

The only people who were high on Atwood were people on message boards. To Jon's other point...expectations are a bit high for a team that has been at the bottom of the proverbial barrel for nearly a decade. We all need a dose of humility and to take off the black and gold glasses for a second.

I do think that Fran will get some good recruits in - it IS a numbers game and if you get that one 4* or 5* to sign up, it can change everything. This ain't football...

 

[WindsorHawk]

The 2013-14 team was not as good as the 2012-13 team. They definitely took a step back last year. The had more wins, a better winning percentage, and much more post-season success in year three over year 4.

Also, I would like to dispute the motion that Fran is great at player development. How many Fran recruits have been All B1G players? Marble twice, and White got third team last year. The other 15 players he's recruited? Nothing. No third team, no honorable mention.

Iowa wasn't ranked last season and had no chance at winning the NCAA Tournament. Both happened this season.

You did a very good job of making my case for me on player development. Fran's first real class contained Marble and he made all conference twice...didn't look all conference as a freshman. His 2nd real class contained White and he will likely make all conference twice. If we have 1 all conference player in every class we'll be fine.

 

[Tmoney12]

Seriously? Bo Ryan recruited Uthoff. In fact, IIRC, Bo Ryan pretty much went to the limit to make sure Uthoff wouldn't land at Iowa once the dust settled.

Alas, WTH does Bo Ryan know about basketball...

Uthoff left Wisconsin because he knew he was never going to play when he was stuck behind Dekker, who is younger, better, and has the exact same game as he does. I mean, if Uthoff was at Wisconin this year, what would his role be? Probably splitting backup minutes with Nigel Hayes; 10 mpg tops.

Also, Bo didn't go to the limit to keep Uthoff away from Iowa. It is common practice to refuse to allow another player to sign in conference. The issue is that he wouldn't let him talk to anyone in the ACC and other places. I think Bo did this because he's a jerk, not because he was afraid Uthoff would be an amazing player elsewhere.

I'm not saying he's not a decent player. Like I said, he's average. He's probably never going to play 25+ mpg, and he'll never get all B1G honors. Just look at the college game right now. Your team won't go very far if Jarrod Uthoff is one of your top 3 players.

 

[Tmoney12]

Iowa wasn't ranked last season and had no chance at winning the NCAA Tournament. Both happened this season.

You did a very good job of making my case for me on player development. Fran's first real class contained Marble and he made all conference twice...didn't look all conference as a freshman. His 2nd real class contained White and he will likely make all conference twice. If we have 1 all conference player in every class we'll be fine.

Well, I'll see your Marble developing, and raise you Basabe regressing every single year he was at Iowa.

I'll call it a push.

Michigan, MSU, Wisconsin, and OSU are going to have 2-3 all B1G players every year, not every class. Iowa is constantly in the middle of the pack as far as B1G recruiting goes; even when we had a top 25 class, it was 5th or 6th in the conference. Surrounding schools like Nebraska, Minnesota, and Illinois all have excellent recruiters at the helm, and the Blue Bloods of the B1G show no signs of slowing down. If you think the current trajectory of Iowa basketball trends towards future success, I disagree, unless your standard of success is 9-9, 20 wins, and an occasional quick exit from the tournament.

 

[TheCoolNewGuy]

If you're going to pull out the stat that he's 0 for 20 on signing kids that didn't sign then I'm going to counter with he's 3 for 3 on signing players that did sign.

Not only this, but we won every single game this season that we were leading at the end of regulation. I think that stat is pretty telling of Fran's late-game coaching abilities!

 

[jackl]

Iowa wasn't ranked last season and had no chance at winning the NCAA Tournament. Both happened this season.

You did a very good job of making my case for me on player development. Fran's first real class contained Marble and he made all conference twice...didn't look all conference as a freshman. His 2nd real class contained White and he will likely make all conference twice. If we have 1 all conference player in every class we'll be fine.

While Marble was in Fran's first class,he didn't recruit him so using him as an example is inaccurate. Now you have just White.

 

[WindsorHawk]

Well, I'll see your Marble developing, and raise you Basabe regressing every single year he was at Iowa.

I'll call it a push.

Michigan, MSU, Wisconsin, and OSU are going to have 2-3 all B1G players every year, not every class. Iowa is constantly in the middle of the pack as far as B1G recruiting goes; even when we had a top 25 class, it was 5th or 6th in the conference. Surrounding schools like Nebraska, Minnesota, and Illinois all have excellent recruiters at the helm, and the Blue Bloods of the B1G show no signs of slowing down. If you think the current trajectory of Iowa basketball trends towards future success, I disagree, unless your standard of success is 9-9, 20 wins, and an occasional quick exit from the tournament.

Basabe was great this year until he got sick...still the reason for the late season slide IMO. I'm not calling it a push.

This was Fran's first true senior class and he had 2 all B1G players. So Iowa's right there with the 4 teams you mentioned if that's your basis for comparison. Since it was Fran's 1st true senior class it remains to be seen if Iowa has 2 or 3 every year. Uthoff, Gesell, Woodbury or Jok could possibly be all conference along with White...see LeVert this year.

I think I will just stay out of this. You're doing a great job of making my case for me...while contradicting yourself from post to post.

 

[WindsorHawk]

While Marble was in Fran's first class,he didn't recruit him so using him as an example is inaccurate. Now you have just White.

We're talking player development. You're trying to say Lickliter gets credit for how Marble developed because he first got him to commit? You must admit that defies logic.

Side Note - Fran had to recruit Marble after Lick go the boot. This has been confirmed in countless interviews by both Fran and Marble. He is still a Fran recruit...even thought it's not relevant to this conversation.

 

[meaning]

So all that evaluation that was done prior to that was thrown out the window and it was gleaned that he wouldn't be a starter from one scrimmage in the offseason? That doesn't seem logical.

I don't think Fran or the rest of the staff made any evaluation/decisions from a pick up game ... but, it is certainly possible that the recruit saw how he stacked up against the players with whom he would compete for minutes, and made a decision accordingly.

Or, perhaps he just didn't receive the assurance that he could/would start - and that may have been important to him.

 

[ohhawk]

Yeah, if you can't get in done in your first 4 years at the helm you're destined for failure.......................

* Mike Krzyzewski - first 4 years at Duke.....17-13, 10-17, 11-17, 24-10

* Dean Smith - first 4 years at North Carolina......never had more than 16 wins in any season during those 4 years

* Lute Olson - first 4 years at Iowa.......finished 7th, 5th, 4th, and 8th respectively in the Big 10. Only 12 overall wins in his 4th year.

 

[WindsorHawk]

Yeah, if you can't get in done in your first 4 years at the helm you're destined for failure.......................

* Mike Krzyzewski - first 4 years at Duke.....17-13, 10-17, 11-17, 24-10

* Dean Smith - first 4 years at North Carolina......never had more than 16 wins in any season during those 4 years

* Lute Olson - first 4 years at Iowa.......finished 7th, 5th, 4th, and 8th respectively in the Big 10. Only 12 overall wins in his 4th year.

Good post.

 

[1977Hawkeye]

We're talking player development. You're trying to say Lickliter gets credit for how Marble developed because he first got him to commit? You must admit that defies logic.

Side Note - Fran had to recruit Marble after Lick go the boot. This has been confirmed in countless interviews by both Fran and Marble. He is still a Fran recruit...even thought it's not relevant to this conversation.

Yeah, Marble committed to play for Lick, so he was a Lick recruit initially. Fran had to re-recruit Marble, though, and develop him as a player, so Fran gets credit for those things. As for which coach to give credit to for landing Marble, I say a little of both.

 

[doclee]

You are right on oh hawk. Of course, the usual suspects will not respond to your post because it does not fit well with their bias. I would add this point: Do you guys realize how many good basketball players are available, regardless of their ranking or what teams may be chasing them? I am always amazed at watching Iowa play some unknown team and seeing a player who is top shelf. The amount of talent out there is a virtual gold mine. Fran will get more than his share...not to worry.

 

[InGoodCo]

Iowa's recruiting has been pretty great under Fran so far and I have 0 complaints. We missed on some top targets this year, but have got more than our share over the first 4 years and a solid base for 2015 and 2016. I love the program under him and I expect it to continue the upward ascend it's been on since day 1. The only story I find old is Iowa fans ******** about the best thing to happen to our program since Mr. Davis.

 

[BryceC]

Lute, smith, and K were all over 30 years ago... I don't disagree with the sentiment but the examples are hardly relevant at this point.

 

[clicheusername3]

Iowa wasn't ranked last season and had no chance at winning the NCAA Tournament. Both happened this season.

You did a very good job of making my case for me on player development. Fran's first real class contained Marble and he made all conference twice...didn't look all conference as a freshman. His 2nd real class contained White and he will likely make all conference twice. If we have 1 all conference player in every class we'll be fine.

Every time you post this I laugh. Thanx.

 

[Hawknigh]

That's why I was so bothered over the late season slide, and getting bounced in the play-in game. If Iowa keeps playing well, gets a 4 seed, goes to the Sweet 16 or beyond, does Fran land Atwood/Huff, and whoever else? And hence making next year and beyond better than they likely will be, keeping momentum going? I guess we'll never know the answer to that.

I just feel Iowa missed a great chance this year to make itself a hotter commodity in the eyes of recruits by melting down on the court. But not even making it to the "second" round, I wonder if that was even any better than being in the NIT. Sure could have used a tournament run to add a little more recruiting mojo.

NIT run >>> NCAA first round loss. Unfortunately, it can only been seen as such in retrospect.

NCAA first round loss >>> NIT first round loss!

 

[LawVHawk]

Yeah, Marble committed to play for Lick, so he was a Lick recruit initially. Fran had to re-recruit Marble, though, and develop him as a player, so Fran gets credit for those things. As for which coach to give credit to for landing Marble, I say a little of both.

A little both, and a whole lot to his old man, who played for the school (and apparently cheated in a game.)

 

[Cydkar]

The only people who were high on Atwood were people on message boards. To Jon's other point...expectations are a bit high for a team that has been at the bottom of the proverbial barrel for nearly a decade. We all need a dose of humility and to take off the black and gold glasses for a second.

I do think that Fran will get some good recruits in - it IS a numbers game and if you get that one 4* or 5* to sign up, it can change everything. This ain't football...

Fran offered him...

 

[clicheusername3]

Fran offered him...

And wasn't Atwood the #1 JUCO in the nation? Dickerson was like #10 I believe so maybe everyone better lower their expectations once again.