Let's really talk NIT, for realsies yo!

DuffMan

Well-Known Member
I think we have a realistic shot at this, and we are close enough to the end of the season that we have a real clear path to victory. As I look at the recent history of the NIT there appears to be some good and bad news. First the bad…

Obviously the highest seeds in the NIT typically go to the first couple of teams the NCAA tournament left out, teams for whom the bubble has burst and barring a miracle that isn’t going to be Iowa. The bad news is the rest of the slots tend to go to mid majors and teams from one bid leagues who had excellent records but didn’t seal the deal at conference tournament time. They tend to select those teams OVER teams from major conferences with slightly above .500 records (Iowa).

The last 4 major conference teams in last years NIT were including thier seeds and records were: (4) NW: 20-14 (7-11), (5) Neb: 19-13 (7-9), (4) Cal: 18-15 (10-8), and (5) Miss 20-14 (7-9). Again that’s more bad news for Iowa. While we can certainly post a similar conference record to those schools our OOC play included a couple of very bad losses, losses that could be the difference between an 18-13 record versus 16-15. Those (18-13 and 16-15) and two totally different teams for selection comities, at least on paper.

Now for some good news….

Iowa has a very real shot to finish 7th in what has been widely publicized as the best basketball conference in America. This is a very significant stat, especially given that the B10 is almost a lock to take 6 teams dancing. There is ZERO chance the NIT doesn’t select AT LEAST one B10 team, and the team sitting in 7th place has got to feel pretty good about their chances. Let’s look at what needs to happen for Iowa to finish 7th.

First things first Iowa MUST take care of business to close out the season. Thankfully the schedule sets up very nicely to do that. We are currently 14-13 (6-8). We have four remaining games, Wisky (who we’ve beaten once), free falling Illannoy, Nebraska, and NW. I think Iowa has a very good shot to split those four and finish 16-15 (8-10) and in 7th place in the B10. That with a solid B10 tournament (winning one game minimum) MIGHT be enough to get the Hawks into a legitimate post season tournament. What about the other B10 teams competing with Iowa for that NIT bid?

Iowa’s strongest competition for an NIT bid is probably NW (provided they don’t find a way to sneak into the NCAA). Currently Iowa and NW are both at 6-8 and sitting in a tie for 7th. If those two teams finish tied I have no doubts the NIT would select NW over Iowa. That said the remaining schedule really sets up well for Iowa. Northwestern closes out the season facing Michigan (loss), PSU (win), and OSU (loss). Their final game of the season is against Iowa, in Carver Hawkeye Arena. Clearly we all remember what happened the last time those two teams faced, and I don’t think NW has forgotten how to play a 1-3-1 since that game, BUT the reality is if Iowa finds a way to beat NW to close out the season the Kitty Cats are going to finish 17-13 (7-11) one game behind Iowa. If that happens I like Iowa’s chances. How about the rest of the B10?

On paper Minnesota looks like it’s a clear favorite over Iowa as they are currently 18-13 on the year. However when you take a deeper look they have some real problems. First and foremost is their current 5-9 league record. Second is their upcoming schedule. They play MSU, Indiana, Wisc, and Nebraska. Granted they get MSU and Indiana at home, but it’s not unrealistic to think they go 1-3 over that stretch. If that happens I can’t see the NIT taking Minnesota and their 6-12 B10 record over Iowa even if they have 19 wins..

Illannoys problem is similar to Minnesota’s. They are currently 16-11 overall but just 5-9 in the league. That 16-11 looks pretty good, but they finish with games @ OSU and @ WIsc, and games at home versus scUM and Iowa. To me that also looks like 1-3, and with the way they have been playing 0-4 isn’t out of the question. Again I see no way the NIT takes Ill at 17-14 (6-12) over a 16-15 (8-10) Iowa team.

The long and short is if Iowa can manage one win against the three game stretch versus Wisky, Ill, and Nebby, then the season finale at Carver might just be for the Hawkeyes first post season birth bince that guy with great hair was here.
 
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At this point I do not like Iowa's chances for a NIT bid and a 2-2 finish will not get the job done. IMO, the only way Iowa gets on the bubble for an NIT bid is to finish 3-1 and win 1 game in the BTT for a 18-14 record. Anything above that and I think Iowa could get into NCAA bubble discussions and anything below that puts Iowa into one of the other 2 post season tournaments.
 
At this point I do not like Iowa's chances for a NIT bid and a 2-2 finish will not get the job done. IMO, the only way Iowa gets on the bubble for an NIT bid is to finish 3-1 and win 1 game in the BTT for a 18-14 record. Anything above that and I think Iowa could get into NCAA bubble discussions and anything below that puts Iowa into one of the other 2 post season tournaments.

The NIT will take a least one (and maybe 2) B10 teams this year. If Iowa finishes the year alone in 7th place in the B10 who does the NIT pass over Iowa to take?
 
If Iowa can get themselves eligible, I am confident the NIT will find a way to get us in. McCaffrey is a popular coach in the media, Gatens is a great story, Iowa fans (hopefully) would pack (ok 10K) for a home game and it could set up a nice Iowa-UNI matchup in the first round. That game could come closer to 12K for attendance.

Possible redemption against the Fighting Camels if they cross our paths in later rounds.
 
If Iowa can get themselves eligible, I am confident the NIT will find a way to get us in. McCaffrey is a popular coach in the media, Gatens is a great story, Iowa fans (hopefully) would pack (ok 10K) for a home game and it could set up a nice Iowa-UNI matchup in the first round. That game could come closer to 12K for attendance.

Possible redemption against the Fighting Camels if they cross our paths in later rounds.

From nothing to play for to confident of an NIT berth if we are eligible in less than a week. What a 180!!!
 
One important point about your analysis is that last year only 65 teams made the NCAA and this year there will be 68. This means 3 more teams will go to the NCAA that would have previously been in the NIT. Thus less competition.

I think between the NCAA and NIT that 8 teams will get in from the Big Ten at least. Either 7 in the dance and 1 in NIT or 6 in the dance and 2 in the NIT. Right now the only teams we would be picked ahead of are Nebraska and Penn State and maybe Minnesota (since we beat them twice). Need to jump ahead of Ill to get there.
 
The NIT will take a least one (and maybe 2) B10 teams this year. If Iowa finishes the year alone in 7th place in the B10 who does the NIT pass over Iowa to take?

First of all a 2-2 finish I don't think puts Iowa alone in 7th place, a 3-1 record will (possibly higher). Secondly the Mid Majors are down this year and the B1G getting more than 1 team in the NIT may come down to how many of the regular season champs win their conference tournaments (which you mention). The other factor maybe Northwestern getting a NCAA invite as they have to high of an RPI for the NIT to pass over them. Minnesota or Illinois are not out of it yet and obviously Iowa needs Purdue to get into the Big Dance. Minnesota could be the one to burst Iowa's NIT bubble if they were to defeat Iowa in the 7/8 game of the BTT.
 
I think it really boils down to this: IF the team takes each game (including BTT) as "win, and NCAA is still possible" to heart, we could see an 18-13 or 17-14 record heading into BTT. At THAT point, assuming we play as well as we did against Indiana last night...

I won't assume anything, of course. But to see Gatens play, IN AN IOWA UNIFORM, AFTER the conclusion of the BTT (be it CBI/NIT/etc., or the very outside shot at NCAA) would be gratifying.
 
From nothing to play for to confident of an NIT berth if we are eligible in less than a week. What a 180!!!

Yeah, "if" we are eligible, I think the NIT picks us. I am not stating that I am confident of that outcome, but reading for retention is not a strength of yours apparently.

Olaseni played again and last week you and your boy band ripped me for even suggesting he could help the team. What a 180!!!!!!
 
First of all a 2-2 finish I don't think puts Iowa alone in 7th place, a 3-1 record will (possibly higher). Secondly the Mid Majors are down this year and the B1G getting more than 1 team in the NIT may come down to how many of the regular season champs win their conference tournaments (which you mention). The other factor maybe Northwestern getting a NCAA invite as they have to high of an RPI for the NIT to pass over them. Minnesota or Illinois are not out of it yet and obviously Iowa needs Purdue to get into the Big Dance. Minnesota could be the one to burst Iowa's NIT bubble if they were to defeat Iowa in the 7/8 game of the BTT.

<<...may come down to how many of the regular season champs win their conference tournaments...>>

This may be the biggest "wild card". As long as the Mid-Major conference tournaments hold form, PLUS having the 2nd/3rd/4th place teams in said conferences losing early in their conference tournaments, it leaves the NCAA more wide open, and MAY open up the NIT for teams like Iowa.

But if Mid-Major regular season winners drop like flies come conference tourney time, we'll all be filling out CBI/other brackets instead.

NIT would be HUGE for Gatens, Fran and this program. Advancing to a 2nd/3rd/4th game in NIT would be MEGAhuge. Of course, running the table in BTT would be the ultimate, excepting, of course, our first-round match-up against Duke/UNC/Kentucky that we would likely get...
 
The NIT will take a least one (and maybe 2) B10 teams this year. If Iowa finishes the year alone in 7th place in the B10 who does the NIT pass over Iowa to take?
First of all a 2-2 finish I don't think puts Iowa alone in 7th place, .

The only team w a real shot at competing with Iowa for a 7th place finish is NW. I posted NW's schedule above, try and find 3 wins in it, I double dog dare you.
 
Yeah, "if" we are eligible, I think the NIT picks us. I am not stating that I am confident of that outcome, but reading for retention is not a strength of yours apparently.

Olaseni played again and last week you and your boy band ripped me for even suggesting he could help the team. What a 180!!!!!!

Ive said all along that practice reps are going to be more beneficial for Gabe than getting thrown to the wolves and have him go 100 MPH and not really know what the hell hes doing. I still have that opinion...its not his fault that we had 2 guys out with injuries and McCabe was picking up about a foul a minute. You have to play guys that arent ready when you dont have a lot of depth.

Tell me how the 1 minute, 3 fouls, 1 turnover and 0 shot attempts he got yesterday are going to "help him down the road", which is your reasoning for getting him PT.

Quit trying to hijack Duff's thread. :eek:
 
i say we just win the BTT and then get into the BIG DANCE! anyone agree? then we wont be discussing this!

We have shown that we can beat Wiscy, Indiana, Michigan. We don't know about Illinois. We can not, at this point, say we can play with MSU or OSU, and in spite of close games, Purdue has shown they can hold us off twice. And frankly, Michigan beating OSU makes me think we would have to be 100% healthy, turnover-free AND have Michigan shoot poorly for us to beat them on a neutral court.

IF we don't have to play OSU or MSU, I would say we "can" play with anybody in the conference, at least at home, and wins in Kohl and Minny bear out that we are "good enough" to make noise in BTT. But unless/until I see MSU and OSU go down early in BTT, I have a hard time picturing us cutting down the nets there.
 
I've quit trying to predict future wins and losses with this team. I knew this season would be one of incredibly awesome highs (beat Wisconsin, Mich. Indiana) and soul crushing lows. (Campbell Camels??)
I'm just gonna sit back and enjoy the ride. If it includes NIT, then that would be another high.
If not, I will dream about a 7 foot post presence and the BIG DANCE possibilities for next year.
 
Does the NIT look at records in total or how a team is playing at the end of the year vs. at the start of the year? Don't know their criteria, but if Iowa goes 2-2 to close out the year, or somehow finishes 3-1, the case is made for them finishing strong, offsetting their tepid non-conference mark.
 
There is exactly 1 way Iowa makes the NCAA -- win the BTT.

The minimum for Iowa to make the NIT is 3-1 regular finish + 1-1 BTT. It has to show it can string a few wins together and beat the type of competition it will face in the NIT.

The following is from NIT-ology

It is the list of all the teams that are in the discussion for the NIT but considered OUT
(I've put them in order of RPI (from realtimerpi.com, as of 2/18/12).)

Duquesne=80, Denver=89, loyola marymount=92, Princeton=96, Maryland=97, ohio=99, mercer=101, texas Christian=102, st. Bonaventure=103, villanova=104, Tennessee=106, Georgia=107, yale=110, Tulsa=111, pennsylvania=112, Oklahoma=113, lamar=115, Butler=116, Fairfield=118, robert morris=120, Lehigh=122, illinois st.=123, Ucla=125.

As you can see, there are some very attractive teams on that list that will all be considered before Iowa.

For shiggles and gits, Nebraska, Penn State, Vermont and St John's are NOT even in the discussion to be on the bubble of the NIT but their respective RPI's are 128, 130, 138 & 141. Iowa is 142!

Now, all these rankings are before the Indiana W but the "realsies" is, Iowa is NOT going to make the NIT this year.
 

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