Jose Reyes batting title...

E

ElleHawks

Well-Known Member
Curious what peoples thoughts are on Reyes pulling himself from the game yesterday after going 1-1 on a bunt single to preserve his slim lead over Braun. Some media are all over him saying he cheated the fans and his team etc. His manager says he was respecting the wishes of a player that had given it his all for an entire season.

I think Reyes has nothing to apologize for. All the bs about people paying money to see him play and being cheated is total garbage.
 
ElleHawks said:
Curious what peoples thoughts are on Reyes pulling himself from the game yesterday after going 1-1 on a bunt single to preserve his slim lead over Braun. Some media are all over him saying he cheated the fans and his team etc. His manager says he was respecting the wishes of a player that had given it his all for an entire season.

I think Reyes has nothing to apologize for. All the bs about people paying money to see him play and being cheated is total garbage.
Click to expand...

He did cheat the fans, and his team. It was a selfish move. He did EXACTLY what a large segment of our own fanbase reams KF for: he was playing not to lose.

Ted Williams could have easily kept a .400 average in 1941 by not playing in a doubleheader on the season's final day. So what does he do? He laces it up and plays anyway, going 6 for 8. That's the kind of finish that people want to see. EARN the batting title, don't wuss out. Which is what Reyes did: wuss out.
 
I would hope I wouldn't do what Reyes did. I agree, lace em up and play it out. I know some have a problem with the fact he laid down a bunt, but that's pickin' nits.
 
Ronco said:
I would hope I wouldn't do what Reyes did. I agree, lace em up and play it out. I know some have a problem with the fact he laid down a bunt, but that's pickin' nits.
Click to expand...

I don't care about the bunt, either. That's part of the game, and one of my favorite aspects, too. A bunt single is one of the more fun plays in baseball, just because of the speed.

But yesterday was just one example of why I would never want Reyes on my favorite team. He is not a leader, and not the kind of player you want to build a team around (the Mets already tried that, and look where they're at now).
 
tm3308 said:
He did cheat the fans, and his team. It was a selfish move. He did EXACTLY what a large segment of our own fanbase reams KF for: he was playing not to lose.

Ted Williams could have easily kept a .400 average in 1941 by not playing in a doubleheader on the season's final day. So what does he do? He laces it up and plays anyway, going 6 for 8. That's the kind of finish that people want to see. EARN the batting title, don't wuss out. Which is what Reyes did: wuss out.
Click to expand...

Trying to win a game, is not comparable in any way shape or form to what Reyes did. Reyes was trying to win an individual award, not a game. When has KF ever put an individual award above a win or loss?
 
deanvogs said:
Trying to win a game, is not comparable in any way shape or form to what Reyes did. Reyes was trying to win an individual award, not a game. When has KF ever put an individual award above a win or loss?
Click to expand...

Regardless, it's the same principle. The fact that he put an individual award above the team is why it's selfish, but the same principle applies. He got one hit, figured he was a lock, and shut it down to keep it that way. The funny thing is, had Braun gone 3 for 4, HE would have won the batting crown. I really wish he would have, just so that Reyes could feel like the idiot that he is.
 
tm3308 said:
Ted Williams could have easily kept a .400 average in 1941 by not playing in a doubleheader on the season's final day. So what does he do? He laces it up and plays anyway, going 6 for 8. That's the kind of finish that people want to see. EARN the batting title, don't wuss out. Which is what Reyes did: wuss out.
Click to expand...

This right here. Only thing to change was Williams was at something like .3997 going into the final day and the league office had told him that they would round up and consider it a .400 season.

Williams said thanks but no thanks, went 6 for 8 in the twinbill and finished at .406.
 
tm3308 said:
Regardless, it's the same principle. The fact that he put an individual award above the team is why it's selfish, but the same principle applies. He got one hit, figured he was a lock, and shut it down to keep it that way. The funny thing is, had Braun gone 3 for 4, HE would have won the batting crown. I really wish he would have, just so that Reyes could feel like the idiot that he is.
Click to expand...

Not the same principal at all, not even close. KF wants to win football games. If that means he thinks he should run 50 time a game he will. If it means he has to go no huddle because they are down he will. If he thinks his best shot of winning is sitting on the ball and going to OT, then that is what he does.

I completely agree what Reyes did was selfish, and a total d0uche bag move. Yet trying to compare a selfish individual act, to a coach who only wants to win (even if it is through a conservative route) is completely off base.
 
He's getting crucified by the New York media, and rightfully so, IMHO. Cheesy to get the hit on a bunt single, then immediately pull himself from the game. That's a big middle finger to the fans, most of whom wouldn't otherwise have come out to CITI Field. He cheated his team, the fans and the game.
 
Jose gave the fans exactly what they came to see.... him win a battling title.

Braun had 161 other games to improve his aveage.
 
I don't think he owed the fans anything.

He did however break an honor code within baseball and I hope the old timers call him on it.

Honestly, I doubt he cares. IMO baseball has been a wreck for 20 years. There is no loyalty on either side...well except for the fans that continue to show up to the park.
 
deanvogs said:
Not the same principal at all, not even close. KF wants to win football games. If that means he thinks he should run 50 time a game he will. If it means he has to go no huddle because they are down he will. If he thinks his best shot of winning is sitting on the ball and going to OT, then that is what he does.

I completely agree what Reyes did was selfish, and a total d0uche bag move. Yet trying to compare a selfish individual act, to a coach who only wants to win (even if it is through a conservative route) is completely off base.
Click to expand...

How is it not the same principle? Do you know what that term means? I know the situations are not the same. And I know that trying to win the game is more important than trying to win a batting title. But Reyes was playing not to lose that title. It IS the same principle. Note that if you're playing not to lose, and you don't lose, you did win the game/award/whatever.

But just like how we let crappy teams like Indiana hang around with us because we've been so conservative, Reyes actually gave Braun the chance to win the title (because he apparently sucks at math). He took the decision out of his own hands and put it in Braun's. Which we have done a lot of in the last 12 years (and don't take this as an indication that I want KF fired. I don't. I want him to be our coach, there are just some things about him that frustrate me from time to time).

Playing not to lose is still playing not lose. No matter how you want to look at it, no matter how the context changes.
 
ibahawkeye said:
Jose gave the fans exactly what they came to see.... him win a battling title.

Braun had 161 other games to improve his aveage.
Click to expand...

That is NOT what fans wanted to see. They wanted to see him actually play it out, not wuss out after going 1 for 1, and putting himself above the team.
 
tm3308 said:
How is it not the same principle? Do you know what that term means? I know the situations are not the same. And I know that trying to win the game is more important than trying to win a batting title. But Reyes was playing not to lose that title. It IS the same principle. Note that if you're playing not to lose, and you don't lose, you did win the game/award/whatever.

But just like how we let crappy teams like Indiana hang around with us because we've been so conservative, Reyes actually gave Braun the chance to win the title (because he apparently sucks at math). He took the decision out of his own hands and put it in Braun's. Which we have done a lot of in the last 12 years (and don't take this as an indication that I want KF fired. I don't. I want him to be our coach, there are just some things about him that frustrate me from time to time).

Playing not to lose is still playing not lose. No matter how you want to look at it, no matter how the context changes.
Click to expand...

Good lord, you are usually such a solid poster......Reyes is worried about winning individual awards with no regard or concern for winning the game. KF only goal is to win the game regardless of individual achievement or awards. They are complete and total opposites.
 
It should have a big old asterisk next to it.

At the same time the media is deservedly crucifying Reyes, they are praising both the Yankees and Phillies for still playing hard when they could have packed it in. Yeah, they didn't throw any of their pitchers for a long time, and some of the starters were sitting when extra innings came in, but they never packed it in and just gave the game to Atlanta or Tampa. As a Cardinal fan I like this since it means they don't have to play a game today, as a baseball fan I love this as it shows there is still some integrity in the game.
 
tm3308 said:
That is NOT what fans wanted to see. They wanted to see him actually play it out, not wuss out after going 1 for 1, and putting himself above the team.
Click to expand...

At the end of the day does it even matter what the fans wanted to see? He plays for his team and himself period. He helped his team on the offensive side more than any other NL player did this year.
 
deanvogs said:
Trying to win a game, is not comparable in any way shape or form to what Reyes did. Reyes was trying to win an individual award, not a game. When has KF ever put an individual award above a win or loss?
Click to expand...

Really, so the Mets are a better team with him on the bench instead of playing shortstop?
 
deanvogs said:
Good lord, you are usually such a solid poster......Reyes is worried about winning individual awards with no regard or concern for winning the game. KF only goal is to win the game regardless of individual achievement or awards. They are complete and total opposites.
Click to expand...

Seriously, do you understand what "principle" means? I KNOW that what they are trying to win are polar opposites. But we tend to "play not to lose", and Reyes was playing not to lose the batting title. Are we trying to win the game, and was Reyes trying to win and individual accolade? Yes. But that doesn't mean that it isn't the same principle.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Share this page

Top