John Miller Keep up the good fight!

Playing his son is not the only problem - it just sheds light on the bigger issue with Lick. His distribution of PT has never made any sense from day one. One game a guy is playing 30 minutes a game and the next game he cant get off the bench. If someone can explain to me his sub pattern in general then i wont have such a problem with his son going from playing 7 minutes (about the right amount) to 24 minutes.

The Lick apologists are saying there are no other options so Lil Lick should be playing the minimum since he is a last resort. 24 minutes on the road is not typical of a last resort type player.
 
JonDMiller said:
No influence at all. I loved what Rob wrote because I agreed with every bit of it. I wrote something much stronger than what I posted, on Saturday (still have the draft in my admin)...and went in and edited after thinking of giving Lick the benefit of the doubt as I wondered if he was trying to send Payne some kind of message.

After talking with a few people this week, they don't know why he is doing what he is doing...so I am losing faith.
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Fair enough. I protest only because it is simply unfathomable to me.

Perhaps I am merely several stages behind you in the coping process and will eventually catch up to you, but I don't think so. If I do, I will be the first to admit it, but for now, I just think you are flat out wrong about this. There is just no way that this is true.
 
If Papa Lick thinks Lil Lick deserves more minutes because of the way he has been playing then heck, send me a jersey coach because I am pretty sure I could squeeze out a year or two of eligibility from the NCAA ... The ship is sinking folks ... Fortunately, most fans have jumped off because they know how this one is gonna end ... 10 years of Boy Wonder started it all ... Fans disappeared ... Slowly ... Now Lick has taken Iowa basketball to a new level of mediocrity ... This is year No. 3 folks ... The program is NOT in better shape than when he arrived ... No matter how you slice it and dice it the program is his and it is in the shape it is in because of HIS decisions ... Time to move in another direction ... And time to do it now before Iowa basketball is in such bad shape that even a juco coach might have to think twice about coming here ...
 
busabus114 said:
The Lick apologists are saying there are no other options...
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I just wanted to highlight this comment as it demonstrates that I now have credentials as both a "hater" and an "apologist." I'd like to see someone else who can accomplish that.

Of course, the rational explanation--and therefore not the one likely to be favored by most message board denizens--is that not everything is black and white, and objectivity and reason should intervene from time to time.

Therefore, I'm proud to be the first documented member of "the hater/apologist club."

:)
 
FreddyBrown said:
I just wanted to highlight this comment as it demonstrates that I now have credentials as both a "hater" and an "apologist." I'd like to see someone else who can accomplish that.

Of course, the rational explanation--and therefore not the one likely to be favored by most message board denizens--is that not everything is black and white, and objectivity and reason should intervene from time to time.

Therefore, I'm proud to be the first documented member of "the hater/apologist club."

:)
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Maybe I am in that exclusive club also. My problem with lick is less that he is playing lil lick so many minutes, but that some how, he has lost 3 pgs in 3 years(Freeman,Peterson,Kelly) and fell short on recruiting 2(Russell,Armstead) which leaves lil lick as our backup pg. That is inexcusable. Sure, you could make a case that it is bad luck(kelly),but at some point I dismiss bad luck and blame bad personnel management by the coach. I think he rides these guys so hard,and takes so much of the fun outta the game for them...they get fed up and leave. I think at minimum, he should have found a way to keep peterson at Iowa...and had a backup plan for losing Armstead,who we spent tons of effort on, and he did not even deign to visit? That is either totally misreading the kid,or deluding themselves...either way ,a huge waste that might have cost us Peterson. I think Kelly could have been retained if he liked playing for lick,period.

All of this has left Lick in an untenable situation with his son as backup pg. I doubt he planned it this way, but his own shortcomings have ended up putting his son in a really tough spot. Just a shame.
 
JonDMiller said:
The thing about no other options..we've been here before with Lick...last year, his first year...and he said that the kids should want to be able to play 40 minutes...that there are 6 breaks per half with which to rest...so we never heard about resting players for stretch drives in recent years....we are only hearing about that now, this year...and the difference is he has a kid who is eligible to play.

I really hope its not favoritism...he'd be nuts to do that...but he has opened a shadow of doubt with the minute distribution on Saturday
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Cully can't go 40 minutes. He is not in good enough shape. That is just a fact. He is ineffective when he gets tired. What really chaps me is why is he not in better shape?
 
busabus114 said:
Playing his son is not the only problem - it just sheds light on the bigger issue with Lick. His distribution of PT has never made any sense from day one. One game a guy is playing 30 minutes a game and the next game he cant get off the bench. If someone can explain to me his sub pattern in general then i wont have such a problem with his son going from playing 7 minutes (about the right amount) to 24 minutes.

The Lick apologists are saying there are no other options so Lil Lick should be playing the minimum since he is a last resort. 24 minutes on the road is not typical of a last resort type player.
Click to expand...

Good post here, those are my feelings as well. I don't understand the inconsistent PT for the players, just doesn't make sense. How can these guys continue to improve if they can't get comfortable in game situations? I don't know anymore, I guess I don't care much right now.
 
Hooper said:
Tell me who you would play instead of John? What are the options? Kick em when they are down I guess.
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The more I read of this the more I think those who are actually giving it much thought--i.e., Jon--must be focused on the question of whether John L should be taking minutes away from anyone other than Cully when he needs to rest or needs a "teaching moment" on the bench (which, IMO, is not infrequently needed for him). I can see some reason in that argument. There are times, though, when a coach needs the flexibility to go guard-heavy or bigs-heavy depending on the opposition and the situation in the game. So I can see how Lick (or any coach) might want to play another true guard alongside Cully at times for legitimate strategic reasons. The underlying problem, for which I don't give Lick a pass, is that John is basically his only option for doing that apart from another walkon who is a completely unknown commodity to us.

If, as Jon implies, Lick is causing concern or confusion among others on the roster by when and how much he plays John, then maybe Lick needs to do a better job of communicating with his team about what he's doing and why. Also, at some point John's performance could be such that as a practical matter he really doesn't provide coach a usable option at guard.

Given the occasional need for another true guard to log some minutes, I don't think one game of what many see as an excessive number of minutes is enough to say that Lick's flipped out and the ship is sinking.

The ship may, in fact, be sinking, but if it is, IMO it's for reasons unrelated to some bias by the Coach in favor of his son.
 
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Hooper said:
Tell me who you would play instead of John? What are the options? Kick em when they are down I guess.
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Hooper, in this case, it's not about playing John.
It's playing John for 24 minutes.
And it's hearing your coach saying John should have gotten more PT vs OSU.

Lick said players at this level should be able to go 40 with the TV timeouts. If that's case, how is John getting 24 minutes?

That stuff makes my head spin.
 
storminspank said:
Hooper, in this case, it's not about playing John.
It's playing John for 24 minutes.
And it's hearing your coach saying John should have gotten more PT vs OSU.

Lick said players at this level should be able to go 40 with the TV timeouts. If that's case, how is John getting 24 minutes?

That stuff makes my head spin.
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I agree with Spank. I get that John needs to play here and there to spell people. Given the situation Tucker put them in, I have no problem with that. IT's the 24 minute stuff, and its the stuff where it seems like going to the bench isn't doled out equally
 
When Lick first arrived, he did say the players shouldn't get tired, they should be able to go the entire 40 minutes. I attribute the change in strategy to a realization that the Big 10 style of play is tougher physically than the midmajors, and to the Tom Davis influence.
 
The most disappointing aspect of this topic, is that its up for discussion. Lil John would have barely made the grey shirts at one time. Now we have to discuss how many minutes he plays. This just goes to show how far we have fallen and gives a little perspective on the state of the bb program.
 
JonDMiller said:
The thing about no other options..we've been here before with Lick...last year, his first year...and he said that the kids should want to be able to play 40 minutes...that there are 6 breaks per half with which to rest...so we never heard about resting players for stretch drives in recent years....we are only hearing about that now, this year...and the difference is he has a kid who is eligible to play.

I really hope its not favoritism...he'd be nuts to do that...but he has opened a shadow of doubt with the minute distribution on Saturday
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It could be the difference between the starter being a sophmore verses a true freshman. Don't forget most players in Cullys situation are just starting to adjust to the physicality of D1 BBall let alone playing 40 minuites a game.

To think last years players are better able to hanlde high minute loads is possible.
 
Open Tryouts!

Lick wouldnt even get a second look from a real coach.

He is only there because of his dad.
 
JonDMiller said:
I agree with Spank. I get that John needs to play here and there to spell people. Given the situation Tucker put them in, I have no problem with that. IT's the 24 minute stuff, and its the stuff where it seems like going to the bench isn't doled out equally
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Not to mention that in year three we should not even be in a position where John Lickliter is getting any minutes at all.
 
It is AMAZING how much hand-wringing is going on on this board over one game.

A game where Iowa got the holy **** kicked out of them. 3 days later, no one is complaining about the entire team forgetting to show up, or Fuller picking up 3 fouls in the first 10 minutes, or how Michigan wiped the glass clean on the offensive end, or anything else that went wrong.

Instead...we ***** about how much playing time John Lickliter is receiving. As if his father - and this is the only time I have ever agreed with anything Freddy has said - has any other options.

But I guess John Lickliter is an easy target, since he is the coaches kid, and the team is struggling.
 
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