Jarryd Cole's got your back

[EddyP]

Your ignorance is astounding, it truly knows no bounds. Not only did Cole get a big peice of his wrist forearm on the play he also crushed him with the body. It was a very good effort, and a very good foul, but it was not a clean block. It's getting to the point where I feel sorry for you.

"Crushed him with the body"? Yikes. Please tell me you don't officiate anything other than little kids Y games.

 

[DuffMan]

"Crushed him with the body"? Yikes. Please tell me you don't officiate anything other than little kids Y games.

I work over 30 varsity games a year tiger. I also work the most competetive college+ men's leages in the area.

 

[deanvogs]

I work over 30 varsity games a year tiger. I also work the most competetive college+ men's leages in the area.

I have a nephew playing HS BB for Waukee, and have been to almost all of his games over the last 3 years. All I can say is that I don't know if I would brag about officiating BB in the Des Moines area, the quality is certainly less than impressive, going both ways...... That said, maybe you are one of the better ones, as there are occasions that the officiating isn't an issue.

One of the worse officiated games I saw was the Waukee game this year when the Waukee player was under the basket put up a shot. He comes out of the "scrum" (that is all you can call it, as he got murdered under there)....bleeding from the head, blood running down his face, staining his jersey with NO FOUL CALLED. He was the summarily T-ed up for complaining about said no call. Probably the most disgraceful officiating I have ever seen. He had to get stitched up, his jersey covered in his own blood, no foul called, and he get a technical. Did he say something he shouldn't have to the official? Probably....yet with blood streaming down his face, you would think maybe the official would realize he kind of missed a foul, and give him some leeway....

 

[EddyP]

I work over 30 varsity games a year tiger. I also work the most competetive college+ men's leages in the area.

Scary. Look, I get it. You are a ref and always have the refs' backs. I've seen that call go either way and it probably went the way it did because of where they were playing. But to say he crushed him with the body....well, maybe it is time for a trip to the optometrist.

 

[DuffMan]

I have a nephew playing HS BB for Waukee, and have been to almost all of his games over the last 3 years. All I can say is that I don't know if I would brag about officiating BB in the Des Moines area, the quality is certainly less than impressive, going both ways...... That said, maybe you are one of the better ones, as there are occasions that the officiating isn't an issue.

One of the worse officiated games I saw was the Waukee game this year when the Waukee player was under the basket put up a shot. He comes out of the "scrum" (that is all you can call it, as he got murdered under there)....bleeding from the head, blood running down his face, staining his jersey with NO FOUL CALLED. He was the summarily T-ed up for complaining about said no call. Probably the most disgraceful officiating I have ever seen. He had to get stitched up, his jersey covered in his own blood, no foul called, and he get a technical. Did he say something he shouldn't have to the official? Probably....yet with blood streaming down his face, you would think maybe the official would realize he kind of missed a foul, and give him some leeway....

Officials skill level definately varies per individual. I've worked with very good officials, and I've worked with officials who weren't as strong. I'll hesitate to say any official is "bad" because that's disrespecting all the hard work they put in to do a job few want to do.

I've probably logged 3k miles to officiate HS basketball this winter, and a Varsity DH eats up on average 5 hours of my day, time that could be spent at home with my wife or enjoying other things. I do this because I enjoy being part of the game, it's certainly not to get rich.

Regardless of how they performed in your situation the reality is the officials that you had in Waukee are the BEST officials available (relative to all officials in your area). If fans have a problem with that then I suggest they do something productive. Rather than complain about it while thier fat as5es are planted on bleechers or a computer chair get, get into shape, and begin working high school games in your area (note this is not personal slam on you Deanvdogs please don't take it that way). I guarantee you your area is in need of officials to work games at a variety of levels ranging from youth ball to varsity contests.

I mentioned in another thread that officiating basketball is without a doubt the most humbling work experience in my life.

 

[DuffMan]

Scary. Look, I get it. You are a ref and always have the refs' backs. I've seen that call go either way and it probably went the way it did because of where they were playing. But to say he crushed him with the body....well, maybe it is time for a trip to the optometrist.

Nothing could be further from the truth. I have no problem being objective in situations like this. I guarantee you you won't see me defending some of the things Ed Hightower does on a nightly basis.

 

[tm3308]

Nothing could be further from the truth. I have no problem being objective in situations like this. I guarantee you you won't see me defending some of the things Ed Hightower does on a nightly basis.

Not defending Ed Hightower is easy. That's like saying you don't defend Hitler, even though you might be a German (or Austrian, technically).

And in no way did Cole "crush him with the body". There was plenty of contact, but if Cole were to "crush him with the body", Sheehey's a** would have been planted on the hardwood. Seeing as how he was able to pretty easily land on his feet, I'd say it was little more than you're average Big Ten play in the paint.

 

[DuffMan]

If you want to play semantics and pick apart my statement for the word I used to describe the contact then fine, but there can be no debate that Cole created body contact while blocking the shot and that contact caused the offensive players direction and momentum to change.

The offensive player has every right to the rim and if there is body contact with the defender, provided the defender wasn't occupying the space prior to the act of the shot, than it's absolutely a defensive foul.

By the way something is wrong with the "quote" feature on the website.

 

[storminspank]

Come on Spank, coaches do this all the time. He's not saying "That was a terrible call", he's expressing his opinion that he thought the block was clean.

There is a big difference between saying you saw something differently than really banging on an official or a crew which will get you into trouble.

I mean this is a total judgement call. All I can tell you is the way officials are trained we are taught to look at verticality regarding body and arm contact. If a defender is going straigt up in his plane he's fine. If he's running from the FT area to the rim, and knocks the offensive player sideways with his chest while get blocks the ball it's a foul. It might not be a fould in the NBA, but it certainly is in almost any high school and college gym in America.

Not really. At presser after games, when coaches get asked about a call, they always defer to not answer. At Minnesota, when Fran got the T, he was asked twice to talk about what play he was upset about and he looked over to Matt (SID dept) and he was not supposed to answer it.

You don't have coaches talking about bad calls. Not often an occurrence as you illustrated.

 

[deanvogs]

Officials skill level definately varies per individual. I've worked with very good officials, and I've worked with officials who weren't as strong. I'll hesitate to say any official is "bad" because that's disrespecting all the hard work they put in to do a job few want to do.

I've probably logged 3k miles to officiate HS basketball this winter, and a Varsity DH eats up on average 5 hours of my day, time that could be spent at home with my wife or enjoying other things. I do this because I enjoy being part of the game, it's certainly not to get rich.

Regardless of how they performed in your situation the reality is the officials that you had in Waukee are the BEST officials available (relative to all officials in your area). If fans have a problem with that then I suggest they do something productive. Rather than complain about it while thier fat as5es are planted on bleechers or a computer chair get, get into shape, and begin working high school games in your area (note this is not personal slam on you Deanvdogs please don't take it that way). I guarantee you your area is in need of officials to work games at a variety of levels ranging from youth ball to varsity contests.

I mentioned in another thread that officiating basketball is without a doubt the most humbling work experience in my life.

I understand why you might say those fans should get off their a$$es and work high schools games. I also understand that it is probably frustrating to hear people b!tch, moan and whine...especially from the bleachers. Yet you admit that you do it because you enjoy it, and 99% of people just wouldn't enjoy that. As you say, it keeps you away from your family, and I know how little it pays (you aren't getting rich to it anyway). So of course most people aren't going to want to put up with that and do it. While I might complain about the HS officiating, I don't get on them at games, because I do realize it is very difficult work, and I am happy that they choose to put in the time to do the work.

Back to the point at hand though Duff. That is this call on Cole on his block. Sure he got some body, but I would argue that virtually ZERO blocks happen in BB without some sort of contact, and it is the officials judgement on if they should call a foul or not. I think Gatens has been knocked to the ground about 20 different times going into the lane, and has gotten zero fouls called on those it seems. I will be the first to tell you that on many of them he isn't getting fouled in my opinion. Yet he is certainly being contacted much harder than Cole contacted Sheehe.

Was Cole's block a foul? Probably. Yet if it was a no call, It isn't like that is bad no call.

 

[storminspank]

Was Cole's block a foul? Probably. Yet if it was a no call, It isn't like that is bad no call.

This is the answer.

 

[DuffMan]

I don't disagree with any of that. Rules exist in a vaccuum and all on court situations are fluid. We have to interp what we see on the court, apply our knowledge of the rules, and determine what the appropriate course of action is. I wouldn't have a huge problem with this if it were a no call, and I don't have a huge problem with it being a foul.

The first thing everyone has to realize is we get to look at things in slow motion, over and over. An official gets one shot at it and it happens very very fast.

 

[deanvogs]

I don't disagree with any of that. Rules exist in a vaccuum and all on court situations are fluid. We have to interp what we see on the court, apply our knowledge of the rules, and determine what the appropriate course of action is. I wouldn't have a huge problem with this if it were a no call, and I don't have a huge problem with it being a foul.

The first thing everyone has to realize is we get to look at things in slow motion, over and over. An official gets one shot at it and it happens very very fast.

BINGO! I think that is all anyone is trying to say to you Duff, or at least that is what I am trying to say. That is the frustrating part of watching BB and officials. One official down low lets the play go, and another calls the foul. In the end IT IS A JUDGEMENT CALL, no matter how many rules you quote.....

 

[HawkeyeShane]

Free from Tom Kakert's site...

HawkeyeReport.com - Not in Cole's house

 

[DuffMan]

BINGO! I think that is all anyone is trying to say to you Duff, or at least that is what I am trying to say. That is the frustrating part of watching BB and officials. One official down low lets the play go, and another calls the foul. In the end IT IS A JUDGEMENT CALL, no matter how many rules you quote.....

Perhaps that's what some people have been trying to say, but many were saying things like "it was a horrible call" and "it was a clean block".

The reality of the situation is the guys that work high level NCAA basketball games aren't necessarily there because they have the best judgement. Just as important as judgement is the ability to manage a game, to know when you can let guys play, and when you need to tighten things down.

That's the reason Hightower and Valentine routinely get big time assignments. They understand the game, have the ability to controll it, and have the courage to make a hugely unpopular call when it's the right thing to do.

That's the single biggest thing people who don't officiate basketball don't understand.

 

[EddyP]

Perhaps that's what some people have been trying to say, but many were saying things like "it was a horrible call" and "it was a clean block".

The reality of the situation is the guys that work high level NCAA basketball games aren't necessarily there because they have the best judgement. Just as important as judgement is the ability to manage a game, to know when you can let guys play, and when you need to tighten things down.

That's the reason Hightower and Valentine routinely get big time assignments. They understand the game, have the ability to controll it, and have the courage to make a hugely unpopular call when it's the right thing to do.

That's the single biggest thing people who don't officiate basketball don't understand.

Now Duff, just admit that you were all over me because you hate me. Then you backed off the "murdered him with the body" stance. I saw at least 5 blocks in the Purdue/Indiana game tonight that were worse than the Cole "foul".