ArvadaHawk
Well-Known Member
Thank you for saying this! I think we all owe KOK a bit of an apology for blaming offensive woes and play calling on him. I'm sure he called wrong plays at the wrong time, from time to time, but the game plan was KF's.
Is this the year we see a Greg Davis offense produce big?
- Thread starter docholihawk
- Start date
Thank you for saying this! I think we all owe KOK a bit of an apology for blaming offensive woes and play calling on him. I'm sure he called wrong plays at the wrong time, from time to time, but the game plan was KF's.
guffus
Well-Known Member
Of course now that I have thought about this some more, the iowa offense was kinda schizophrenic in 2011. It had that big comeback against Pitt using the no-huddle, then was talk Iowa was going to use the no-huddle all the time.
Then Iowa did nothing against a very good Penn State defense and the no-huddle was scrapped the rest of the season, probably because Ferentz pulled the plug.
I wonder if this was the final straw for KOK? When the no-huddle was scrapped in 2011, was that when KOK and KF decided to split up?
The fact Iowa is now back to using the no-huddle, at least in a more managed way probably means something. IS that is some kind of acknowledgement that KOK maybe was at least partly right? Or maybe its all unrelated. I have no idea.
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franstheman
Well-Known Member
This is not the okeefe passing game or else Soup wouldn't have been dumped for Bobby Kennedy. This new offense is more zone passing schemes and horizontal high percentage completions. Not the 5 yard out, naked bootleggin scheme of KOK.
HomerChampless
Well-Known Member
Looks like the offense will win games for Iowa this year. The offense will have to step it up during B1G play (and against Pitt).
WinOneThisCentury
Well-Known Member
I believe this passing offense isn't just a horizontal scheme...routes are based on the defense and both the receiver and the QB need to understand the read. People keep talking about 2012 and all the short routes and why we didn't go down field more. Well, we had a turnstile on the left side of the offensive line after game 6...and JVB seriously had 2.5 seconds to throw it...in most cases. That was why we had such a lack of a vertical passing game. I'm not saying there isn't a strong ball control element to this passing game...but this is really the first year where the protection and the WR talent will be good at the same time. Let's judge the Greg Davis's offense on what we see this year. We did more vertical stuff last year, and I believe that goes way up this year to test people over the top. I think you are going to see us stretch the field more with Smith, Powell, and Willies. Honestly, if the offensive line is as advertised, this could be a very tough offense to defend. Play action should get a lot of safeties taking the one or two steps forward...enough to have them screwed when Smith, Powell, or Willies turn on the jets. Should be fun to watch.
ArvadaHawk
Well-Known Member
I believe the point being made is that KF has shoe-horned GD into a Pro-style, run oriented offense, as opposed to, GD's offense that he had run previously, at UT. There, it was more of a passing offense. KOK was blamed quite often for calling run plays against 100 men fronts, instead of passing. We know now that that was a KF influence.
RocknRollface
Well-Known Member
The concepts are of course going to be different to a degree but KF took it back to play action being the bread and butter. Not whatever was happening in 2012. KF has basically made comments to that effect.
We've still seen plenty of outs and we are still seeing a general absence of throws to the intermediate middle which have the most chance of YAC but also the most chance of being tipped and intercepted. Likewise no middle screens to the backs. Which is really unbelievable in this day and age.
Whatever Davis was trying to do in 2012 with 4/5 wide outs all running patters horizontally and short of the marker is gone.
Its back to what KF believes in, zone running with play action as the counter.
RocknRollface
Well-Known Member
Davis ran a zone read spread at UT and that's what he would run here too if he was free to design the offense as he wanted.
It's probably a good thing Kirk designs the O though, nobody wanted Davis for a reason. He had mediocre results with probably the most offensive talent in college football in the 2000s.
The best would have been to get a real up and coming O coordinator and let him do his thing instead but that's obviously not realistic.
SpecialKHawk
Well-Known Member
And Texas completely turned around their offensive output after Mack let Davis go. Mack really reaped the benefits from that decision ..... Oh wait Mack is now in the TV booth.
People forget that Davis did not run zone read until Vince Young. They actually ran pro style prior with QB's like Simms and backs like Benson. He was able to run a system to match personnel. I do not have the stats in front of me but I would bet Texas was ranked in the top 20 a few times under Davis and that is a whole lot more than what has occurred under KF.
People need to forgot 2012. We had a ton of problems that season. Given injuries, attrition, DL, QB and WR play that amounted to a dumpster fire. Despite all of this we were a couple of plays away from 6-6 but a blessing in many ways to stay home for the holidays with that team.
People forget that Davis did not run zone read until Vince Young. They actually ran pro style prior with QB's like Simms and backs like Benson. He was able to run a system to match personnel. I do not have the stats in front of me but I would bet Texas was ranked in the top 20 a few times under Davis and that is a whole lot more than what has occurred under KF.
People need to forgot 2012. We had a ton of problems that season. Given injuries, attrition, DL, QB and WR play that amounted to a dumpster fire. Despite all of this we were a couple of plays away from 6-6 but a blessing in many ways to stay home for the holidays with that team.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
Correct. In 2010 Texas slipped to #58 in the country in total offense. Before that GD had Texas at #28 (2009), #9 (2008), and #13 (2007) nationally. Keep in mind all of those numbers were POST Vince Young, when Texas had the most deadly offense in college football.
Since GD has left Texas, they have been #54, #40, and #65 in total offense. So to say that GD didn't do an awesome job at Texas is just ignoring all the facts.
Benddontbreak
Well-Known Member
I’d be interested to see how GD would mold the offense around Ryan Boyle or another dual-threat QB. That very well could be the best case scenario for his offensive philosophy.
WinOneThisCentury
Well-Known Member
People hang 2012 on Greg Davis. 2012, after game six and the decimation of the offensive line, was a result of injuries and attrition that destroyed any depth. Remember, that team was 4-2, and without the Central Michigan debacle, would have been 5-1. After the injuries, it was a freeway to JVB on the left side. You can't win in major college football when you have that glaring a weakness that teams game plan all week to exploit. The short, horizontal, ball control passing game was our answer. Unfortunately non of the receivers understood what they were supposed to do half the time (thanks Soup).
2014 is the first year GD has personnel that I think he's wanted. Speed (Smith / Powell / Willies), smart, well coached receivers (thanks Bobby Kennedy), and an offensive line that is going to give him just about anything he wants...play action, 7 step drops, whatever. Let's judge him this year and see what the offense looks like. My guess is it's a top 50 offense...maybe even low 40s.
2014 is the first year GD has personnel that I think he's wanted. Speed (Smith / Powell / Willies), smart, well coached receivers (thanks Bobby Kennedy), and an offensive line that is going to give him just about anything he wants...play action, 7 step drops, whatever. Let's judge him this year and see what the offense looks like. My guess is it's a top 50 offense...maybe even low 40s.
HawksRule98
Banned
Exactly which play makers has Greg Davis brought to campus, and what has been their impact on the offensive side of the ball for the Hawkeyes? I'll hang up and listen.
HawksRule98
Banned
Did you take a nap during games 1-6 that year? The only time the offense was even halfway competent was against CMU, when Weisman had 217 yards in a losing effort, the second time in as many years that Iowa lost a game with a 200 yard rusher. Were you at the dentist during the epic 9-6, coma-inducing effort against Clown U in Week 2? It sure as hell felt like I was. How about the 19 points it took us two OTs to score against MSU? Or the whopping 18 we put on NIU and their awe-inspiring defense?
NCHawker
Well-Known Member
what is zone passing?
RocknRollface
Well-Known Member
True buts its known that Davis had to convince Brown to let him switch to the zone read. Brown was against it. They then continued to use that offense for the remainder of the time Davis was there. Obviously it wasn't just a Vince Young thing.
Who knows to what degree any offensive design belongs to a head coach or coordinator. Its different on every team.
Im guessing the zone read was more Davis than Brown in concept and represented more what he wanted to do than previously.
RocknRollface
Well-Known Member
Texas was a mess all around under Brown his last few years.
Davis departure coincided with a complete nose dive in talent.
Davis had some of if not the best talent in the country for a good chunk of time and did OK with it.
Twoards the end of his time their recruiting had somehow gone into the tank. You just cant compare teams that were amoung the most talented in the country and were churning out lots of pros to ones that had no one even drafted like last year.
.
RocknRollface
Well-Known Member
This is ture, maybe its unfair to lay so much blame on Davis for that mess since things did get considerably better when Campbell left. Those two clearly didn't mesh.
Maybe that was the biggest problem.
I still think its basically going to be the same Iowa offense we've usually seen under Ferentz, hopefull it will be one of the better ones though.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
GD wasn't the problem. He produced not only good, but also elite offenses while at Texas. Coaches before and after can't make that claim, and Texas will always have elite talent. Not only did he produce Elite offenses with Vince Young, he had to convince his coach to change to take advantage of that talent. That tells me he is not only doing his job, but he is doing it well. Can you imagine what a waste of an opportunity if Mack doesn't allow Davis to change offenses, and unleash Vince Young????
Mack was the mess, not Davis. Like all fan bases who throw the OC under the bus (Hawk fans with KOK, Texas fans with GD, and ISU fans with Messingham), it is always funny when they actually figure out that the problems don't change when the OC goes....
