Iowa Extends Contract of Fran McCaffery

[HaydenHawk56]

I have the same opinion I had before the game. That one game would mean nothing to me on whether or not I think he deserves an extension. People say this is his ceiling and we can't beat a team full of athletes, but we beat teams full of athletes all the time and the regular season is about as high of a ceiling as you can get so the only ceiling that isn't good enough is the one in a tournament where you have to win a random game. I have a hard time saying it's impossible for Fran to win one random game. Hell, Davis never made it out of the round of 32 with his own recruits until his last year. I would assume people all thought it was his ceiling too. It wasn't because he finally won one random game.

But Mr. Davis did show that he could get passed the first weekend, even if it was Raveling's recruits. You had reason to believe. In a 11 years of Fran ball, we still have no reason to believe we will get passed the first weekend.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

Total agree with everything you said except the last sentence. Yes, Iowa has not ever been a blue blood school, but the best players in the nation would go to coldest regions of hell to play for a great coach. Fran is a good offensive minded coach but couldn’t teach defense or recruit highly defensive players to save his own life.

Yes he beats the hell out of Lickliter, but my dead grandma could beat the hell out of Lickliter. Now does that special coach exits that could come to Iowa and recruit the blue blood, well we will never know because winning at that kind of level is not in the blood stream of the powers that be at Iowa.

Lack of recruiting and coaching defense is Fran’s fault.

Looking ahead next year is going to be UGLY. Lack of team speed all the way around. Hell Fran was desperately putting in his quickest players in the second half against Oregon and we still looked like we wearing cement shoes.

Bottom third of the conference finish next year, if lucky not last place. Seriously, who will we finish above? Some of our best reserves are injury prone. Take out Nudge and CJ with injuries and this could get as ugly as it gets. We will need them both in good health just to finish in tenth place, especially if Weezy moves on. If Weezy comes back and those other two stay healthy then maybe we finish in lower middle of the conference or ninth place at best. Someone like Perkins would have to absolutely blow up for that to change.

Lack of effing defense, I said it on here a few games before the end of the regular season and I will stand by it. It is and has been killing this program. You have to play both ends of the floor especially in the tournament, or your team is going to be sitting their ass at home watching the tournament from their couch.

I agree, I don't get this myth that Iowa is going to be a track team next year. Like you said, if they did, our "fast guys" would have been able to keep up with Oregon. 1 off season is not going to turn them into the Flash without an influx of proper transfer portal talent.

 

[BigD]

WE GOT A BAD DRAW!!!!

ROFLMAO!!!!
OMG!!!
What’s even funnier is people took your comment seriously.

I loved your baseball analogy a few post later, lol. Big fat hanging curve ball, BAM over the wall and vines in wrigley, bring in the next pitcher please???? Lol

We got a bad draw when Oregon didn’t get Covid. Lol

 

[PCHawk]

But Mr. Davis did show that he could get passed the first weekend, even if it was Raveling's recruits. You had reason to believe. In a 11 years of Fran ball, we still have no reason to believe we will get passed the first weekend.

I guess if you thought Raveling would come back and help field a team again there was reason to believe.

 

[PCHawk]

Total agree with everything you said except the last sentence. Yes, Iowa has not ever been a blue blood school, but the best players in the nation would go to coldest regions of hell to play for a great coach. Fran is a good offensive minded coach but couldn’t teach defense or recruit highly defensive players to save his own life.

Yes he beats the hell out of Lickliter, but my dead grandma could beat the hell out of Lickliter. Now does that special coach exits that could come to Iowa and recruit the blue blood, well we will never know because winning at that kind of level is not in the blood stream of the powers that be at Iowa.

Lack of recruiting and coaching defense is Fran’s fault.

Looking ahead next year is going to be UGLY. Lack of team speed all the way around. Hell Fran was desperately putting in his quickest players in the second half against Oregon and we still looked like we wearing cement shoes.

Bottom third of the conference finish next year, if lucky not last place. Seriously, who will we finish above? Some of our best reserves are injury prone. Take out Nudge and CJ with injuries and this could get as ugly as it gets. We will need them both in good health just to finish in tenth place, especially if Weezy moves on. If Weezy comes back and those other two stay healthy then maybe we finish in lower middle of the conference or ninth place at best. Someone like Perkins would have to absolutely blow up for that to change.

Lack of effing defense, I said it on here a few games before the end of the regular season and I will stand by it. It is and has been killing this program. You have to play both ends of the floor especially in the tournament, or your team is going to be sitting their ass at home watching the tournament from their couch.

Holy cow that's a negative post. Minnesota, Nebraska, and Penn State are going to be awful. The only thing worse than you prediction on where we finish next year is the part where you agreed with Fry. "If you take away Garza's points and replace them with an average player's points" makes no sense at all. I guess that average player is going to shoot the same amount of shots as Garza too? That's weird.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

I guess if you thought Raveling would come back and help field a team again there was reason to believe.

My point, PC is the Mr. Davis was able to coach a team to an Elite 8 or a Sweet 16. He was able to get the job done with those players. Raveling could not get it done with those guys, but Mr. Davis could.

I get your point to that Mr. Davis did not recruit like Raveling and thus it made things harder to repeat that success. But, he did get them back to the Sweet 16 in his last year. He practically had them in the tournament most years (9 out of 13).

With Fran's best team, they were eliminated in the 2nd round. 11 years of data and that is the ceiling.

Mr. Davis>Fran

 

[PCHawk]

My point, PC is the Mr. Davis was able to coach a team to an Elite 8 or a Sweet 16. He was able to get the job done with those players. Raveling could not get it done with those guys, but Mr. Davis could.

I get your point to that Mr. Davis did not recruit like Raveling and thus it made things harder to repeat that success. But, he did get them back to the Sweet 16 in his last year. He practically had them in the tournament most years (9 out of 13).

With Fran's best team, they were eliminated in the 2nd round. 11 years of data and that is the ceiling.

Mr. Davis>Fran

If Fran makes the tournament the next 2 years, it will be 8 out of 13 and 8 out of the last 11. Compared to 9 out of 13 and 7 out of the last 11. Davis under achieved with with team full of NBA guys. They were so good that their under achieving was still good enough to make the Elite 8 and sweet 16. Any slightly above average coach in the nation would equal that mark.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

ROFLMAO!!!!
OMG!!!
What’s even funnier is people took your comment seriously.

I loved your baseball analogy a few post later, lol. Big fat hanging curve ball, BAM over the wall and vines in wrigley, bring in the next pitcher please???? Lol

We got a bad draw when Oregon didn’t get Covid. Lol

I will say this though. When the pairings came out and I saw Iowa's potential 2nd and 3rd round opponents, I started a thread saying Iowa got a bad draw. Before Iowa's name came up I was praying to my wife that we did not get that region.

The reason I said this was because they would have to potentially face a major conference champion in the 2nd game.....and a number of talking heads were saying Oregon was the most under-seated team in the tournament. Then they would have to face a potential blue blood in Kansas (which ended up getting its ass kicked big time) all before playing Gonzaga.

Iowa did get a bad break when Oregon did not have to play their first game. I still say they should have had a replacement team for them to play, even if that meant delaying that game a day or so. Iowa would have had to wait a little longer and see the outcome.

That said, if Iowa was a true 2 seed, they still should have been more than up for the challenge. But they probably were not really a 2 just like Illinois was probably not really a 1.

Still, it was a game the Iowa program/Fran needed to win and they did not get the job done.

But, it could also be said the damage for this team was likely already done before a tournament game was ever played. Meaning, this staff's failure to recruit/land a top shelf point guard hampered this team's ability to have a long run.

A big missed opportunity with a generational player on your team. Ultimately, I still think it comes down to the limitations of recruiting on this staff with key positions and poor defensive fundamentals.

I admit, even with all of that, I still predicted Iowa to win (barely) because I thought perhaps Garza and others were going to will themselves to a victory. LOL wrong there....but Garza did everything he could and I believe him when he says that because we all saw what he did to Oregon.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

If Fran makes the tournament the next 2 years, it will be 8 out of 13 and 8 out of the last 11. Compared to 9 out of 13 and 7 out of the last 11. Davis under achieved with with team full of NBA guys. They were so good that their under achieving was still good enough to make the Elite 8 and sweet 16. Any slightly above average coach in the nation would equal that mark.

Still, Raveling could not do it with them, but Davis did. I agree, Fran is meeting the mark with NCAA appearances. I agree there and that is why I'm for not having let go at this time.

My problem with Fran is he has zero top end success like Lute, Davis, Miller, etc had. To me, this missed opportunity with Garza on the team could come back to haunt Fran if this is the start of the air being let out of the tire.

 

[BigD]

I will say this though. When the pairings came out and I saw Iowa's potential 2nd and 3rd round opponents, I started a thread saying Iowa got a bad draw. Before Iowa's name came up I was praying to my wife that we did not get that region.

The reason I said this was because they would have to potentially face a major conference champion in the 2nd game.....and a number of talking heads were saying Oregon was the most under-seated team in the tournament. Then they would have to face a potential blue blood in Kansas (which ended up getting its ass kicked big time) all before playing Gonzaga.

Iowa did get a bad break when Oregon did not have to play their first game. I still say they should have had a replacement team for them to play, even if that meant delaying that game a day or so. Iowa would have had to wait a little longer and see the outcome.

That said, if Iowa was a true 2 seed, they still should have been more than up for the challenge. But they probably were not really a 2 just like Illinois was probably not really a 1.

Still, it was a game the Iowa program/Fran needed to win and they did not get the job done.

But, it could also be said the damage for this team was likely already done before a tournament game was ever played. Meaning, this staff's failure to recruit/land a top shelf point guard hampered this team's ability to have a long run.

A big missed opportunity with a generational player on your team. Ultimately, I still think it comes down to the limitations of recruiting on this staff with key positions and poor defensive fundamentals.

I admit, even with all of that, I still predicted Iowa to win (barely) because I thought perhaps Garza and others were going to will themselves to a victory. LOL wrong there....but Garza did everything he could and I believe him when he says that because we all saw what he did to Oregon.

I agree that our pathway was tough, but I really don’t think that’s the problem here. When you play the same teams over and over again like you do in a conference then you get a feel for the opponents, their skills, their tendencies and it can kind of average things out a little. That can also work against you also. It was no secret that if you got in Jbo’s jersey you could pretty much totally neutralize him offensively. It’s also well known that even if you leave Toussaint open on the perimeter he is likely not going to shoot the long ball and if he did he is very inconsistent. CJ? I am not sure what to make of him. There were games where he just seemed to disappear. His height game him a little advantage defensively but it was a good thing because he got burned several times due to being out of position. How much his injury played into that, I don’t know.

When playing a team for the first time like you do in a tournament then that familiarity isn’t there and so quickness both offensively and defensively is vital. There is an old highway sign you see once in a while “speed kills”. Well that certainly is true in basketball as we all just witnessed. Sometimes it not just speed as much as it is quickness. Reactionary quickness on defense can make a huge difference in total defense and can be the difference between breaking down a defense and getting easy slam dunks or the opposite and struggling to run your offense.

 

[PCHawk]

Still, Raveling could not do it with them, but Davis did. I agree, Fran is meeting the mark with NCAA appearances. I agree there and that is why I'm for not having let go at this time.

My problem with Fran is he has zero top end success like Lute, Davis, Miller, etc had. To me, this missed opportunity with Garza on the team could come back to haunt Fran if this is the start of the air being let out of the tire.

Raveling didn't stay long enough to have a chance to do it. I don't like Fran's top end success either. But I'm more concerned with regular seasons than the randomness of tournaments when it comes to evaluating a coach.

 

[PCHawk]

I will say this though. When the pairings came out and I saw Iowa's potential 2nd and 3rd round opponents, I started a thread saying Iowa got a bad draw. Before Iowa's name came up I was praying to my wife that we did not get that region.

The reason I said this was because they would have to potentially face a major conference champion in the 2nd game.....and a number of talking heads were saying Oregon was the most under-seated team in the tournament. Then they would have to face a potential blue blood in Kansas (which ended up getting its ass kicked big time) all before playing Gonzaga.

Iowa did get a bad break when Oregon did not have to play their first game. I still say they should have had a replacement team for them to play, even if that meant delaying that game a day or so. Iowa would have had to wait a little longer and see the outcome.

That said, if Iowa was a true 2 seed, they still should have been more than up for the challenge. But they probably were not really a 2 just like Illinois was probably not really a 1.

Still, it was a game the Iowa program/Fran needed to win and they did not get the job done.

But, it could also be said the damage for this team was likely already done before a tournament game was ever played. Meaning, this staff's failure to recruit/land a top shelf point guard hampered this team's ability to have a long run.

A big missed opportunity with a generational player on your team. Ultimately, I still think it comes down to the limitations of recruiting on this staff with key positions and poor defensive fundamentals.

I admit, even with all of that, I still predicted Iowa to win (barely) because I thought perhaps Garza and others were going to will themselves to a victory. LOL wrong there....but Garza did everything he could and I believe him when he says that because we all saw what he did to Oregon.

If stupid Livers didn't get hurt, Michigan beats Ohio State and we get Oral Roberts and Florida to get to the sweet 16.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

Raveling didn't stay long enough to have a chance to do it. I don't like Fran's top end success either. But I'm more concerned with regular seasons than the randomness of tournaments when it comes to evaluating a coach.

Fair enough. But I do think Fran has done enough in the regular season to warrant sticking around....he has had Iowa tourney bound at a decent clip. So we can find common ground there as well I think.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

If stupid Livers didn't get hurt, Michigan beats Ohio State and we get Oral Roberts and Florida to get to the sweet 16.

I would agree we would have had a much favorable path there. No question about it. Always seems to be something one way or another that hurts our chances come tourney time (self-inflicted and random events).

 

[PCHawk]

Fair enough. But I do think Fran has done enough in the regular season to warrant sticking around....he has had Iowa tourney bound at a decent clip. So we can find common ground there as well I think.

The more often you're there the better chance you have to get in. Iowa's record in the first round is equally as good as its record in the second round is bad. Pretty crazy both ways actually.

 

[Northside Hawk]

But Mr. Davis did show that he could get passed the first weekend, even if it was Raveling's recruits. You had reason to believe. In a 11 years of Fran ball, we still have no reason to believe we will get passed the first weekend.

He almost didn't do that in 1987, even with Raveling's recruits. UTEP had us down seven with seven minutes to go.

 

[Knight78]

The one huge factor in favor of Mr. Davis was the style of play he coached. It was so radically different than anything else at that time that it was difficult for opposing coaches to scheme against. The full court press / mass substitution style was in its infancy then. It could make good players shine and could hide lesser players. When Mr. Davis got to Iowa, we had a lot of good players. Paul Westhead was at Loyola Marymount at about the same time (early '80s) and had a LOT of success playing that style with better athletes that Mr. Davis had.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

He almost didn't do that in 1987, even with Raveling's recruits. UTEP had us down seven with seven minutes to go.

Those were some hard fought wins over UTEP and Oklahoma the following round. But, in the end, he got them to the Elite 8......and a 2nd half press away from a Final Four.

 

[Motigerhawk]

I hate Louisville and I hate UNLV. Yes, I do hold a couple grudges.

 

[okeefe4prez]

I hate Louisville and I hate UNLV. Yes, I do hold a couple grudges.

The UNLV game in the tournament sucked, no doubt about it. But I remember watching the 1989 game against them. My dad was furious. Vitale was one of the guys calling the game and his "enthusiasm" for UNLV was just absolutely disgusting to hear if you were a Hawks fan. But what got my dad worked up was that UNLV had Larry Johnson, Stacey Augmon and Greg Anthony on the same team. They were just ridiculous. His tirade against Tarkanian was one for the ages. My old man knew that something wasn't right with that squad and lo and behold, Tarkanian got caught cheating.

Here's a video of the game in its entirety, along with commercials and an ABC news special report on Romania and the Panama invasion to go after Noriega. Ahh, the olden days.

1990 Reg Season: UNLV v Iowa (Duel In The Desert)

www.youtube.com