How Can A Team Be So Inept On Defense?

[HawkGold]

Lol. I Literally stated three reasons why Iowa was so inept in defense. Athleticism is most certainly one of them. Very easy to see when you watch Iowa play. Lack of athleticism can be made up for by effort and positioning, we don’t have either of those either.

I can be improved. You can't make 4 or 5 slow guys play consistently good tight D on 4 or 5 faster guys. If you play smart you can be competitive. You aren't going to win championships or get past the 1st or 2nd NCAA rounds if you even get to Dance.

Iowa has got to be about the slowest P5 team in overall speed. If not the slowest, not far from it.

 

[HawkGold]

What is funny about Fran's Iowa teams is that the way to beat speed is to slow it down and get really good in the half court.

Oxymoron.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

More successful? Yes. Highly successful? No. As I keep mentioning, some of you need to watch HS basketball in other states up close. The speed differential is amazing.

JW looks good and I have no qualms about him being good. However, he just doesn't play against speed much in HS. He'll have an adjustment to make from having the game flow to him rather than being a part of the flow of the game.

What is your point. Many of Iowa's players come from other states. Probably most.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

Lol. I Literally stated three reasons why Iowa was so inept in defense. Athleticism is most certainly one of them. Very easy to see when you watch Iowa play. Lack of athleticism can be made up for by effort and positioning, we don’t have either of those either.

It's not lack of athleticism. It's a lack of understanding how to play correctly. You can have the most athletic person you can find, if they don't understand correct positioning, rotation, keeping hands up in a zone, which players to close out on a 3, it will look like they play slow or not very athletic.

Herschel Walker was on the 2 man 1992 Olympic bobsled team after his successful college career. He was ripped and one of the most athletic individuals around at the time. So why didn't his bobsled team dominate, because, they lacked the fundamentals of bobsledding that were needed to be successful. They had one of the best athletes in Walker pushing that sled, the best they got was 7th place.

Point is sometimes it's not the athleticism.

 

[HawkGold]

What is your point. Many of Iowa's players come from other states. Probably most.

From other states or not, they are SLOW. A number of Iowa fans don't seem to recognize this.

7 of 16 are from Iowa BTW, which isn't the point, except that Iowa born players don't get exposed to a lot of speed.

On this subject, I doubt you've ever seen many Iowa teams in the bast 50 years that had that many Iowa players AND was a good team. Last years team obviously had Jok and the year before had Jok and Uthoff.

2005 had 8. There have been some good players out of Iowa.

We just don't have many now that a lot of other teams wanted a lot.

J W is coming in.

 

[PCHawk]

Garza and Cook both get beat like a drum on defense and they are at opposite ends of the spectrum in athleticism. Woody is at the same end as Garza and he was a great defender. Athleticism definitely plays a part in it. But I would say it's a small one. Cook and Wagner prove that the most.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

Garza and Cook both get beat like a drum on defense and they are at opposite ends of the spectrum in athleticism. Woody is at the same end as Garza and he was a great defender. Athleticism definitely plays a part in it. But I would say it's a small one. Cook and Wagner prove that the most.

Yea, this whole discussion is getting pretty silly. If your team sucks, it automatically points to recruiting and the athleticism. Has nothing to do with the players not doing what they should be doing. NOTHING!

They act like this is a team full of a bunch of Jon Lickliters, Josh Ogelsby's or Kent MacClausland's and it's not. Good point about Woodbury. Slow and can't jump but was a man on the D end disrupting things. He actually ran the floor well so wasn't that slow, but could be slow to react in the half court.

 

[ssckelley]

So don't you mean he's not a D1 basketball player then? It doesn't matter what position he plays on defense.

After last nights game are you still holding on to this position on JB? Even Fran is starting to bench him.

He can play at the D1 level but should never be asked to guard the point.

 

[PCHawk]

After last nights game are you still holding on to this position on JB? Even Fran is starting to bench him.

He can play at the D1 level but should never be asked to guard the point.

One game doesn't change my opinion of someone. If he shouldn't guard a point guard, why does he? He doesn't have to you know.

 

[SidFarkas]

One game doesn't change my opinion of someone. If he shouldn't guard a point guard, why does he? He doesn't have to you know.

JBO can’t or won’t defend - period.
A Point guard or Combo, bad foot or not.
He got torched off the dribble, posted and has no close out technique or desire for two years now. Watch him on 50/50 balls - he won’t be diving on the floor winning the 50.

Many games are an overall chart negative from him, because he gives up as many points or more than he scores.

Our coaching staff does not teach proper individual or team man principles. So, as many have stated, things won’t change for 18-19 unless there are staff, philosophical and player physical and quickness upgrades.

 

[lightning1]

Yea, this whole discussion is getting pretty silly. If your team sucks, it automatically points to recruiting and the athleticism. Has nothing to do with the players not doing what they should be doing. NOTHING!

They act like this is a team full of a bunch of Jon Lickliters, Josh Ogelsby's or Kent MacClausland's and it's not. Good point about Woodbury. Slow and can't jump but was a man on the D end disrupting things. He actually ran the floor well so wasn't that slow, but could be slow to react in the half court.

It's a combination of both, in Iowa's case. We don't play with effort on the defensive end. We don't play defense correctly. And, we lack lateral athleticism and over all foot speed.
2 of the 3 things can be corrected. That doesn't mean they will be. It means they can be. Not much can be done about the slow feet of Bohannon, Ellingson, Moss, Baer, Nunge and Garza.

 

[smitharooney]

Considering pound for pound from what I have seen we only have 3 players on this entire roster who have a decent first step.......Uhl, Dailey and Wagner. 2 of the 3 hardly play, the other one doesn't get to play enough

 

[ssckelley]

One game doesn't change my opinion of someone.

You are right, one game shouldn't change anyone's opinion but an ENTIRE season should and in JB's case we have 2 years worth of games.

[QUOTEIf he shouldn't guard a point guard, why does he? He doesn't have to you know.[/QUOTE]

Since CW left there are not many options.

 

[HawkeyeWalker]

Agreed. Was going to add, effort can help minimize the other two things, and positioning can minimize the lack of athleticism.

I still believe positioning (coaching) is the biggest issue. Jbo should not guard the quickest player(usually the point), but better positiin/awareness would/should make up for it with help.

Every single player overhedges/overhelps on everything except for guard penetration.

It's crazy.

And that F'n "Center hedge to the quick guard" defense is the dumbest thing in D1 basketball.

 

[tksirius]

And that F'n "Center hedge to the quick guard" defense is the dumbest thing in D1 basketball.

Amen, Sweet Baby Jesus!!

 

[HawkeyeWalker]

Considering pound for pound from what I have seen we only have 3 players on this entire roster who have a decent first step.......Uhl, Dailey and Wagner. 2 of the 3 hardly play, the other one doesn't get to play enough

Dailey, yes. Cook and Moss also. Not so sure on Uhl and Wagner. Uhls issue is between his ears and utter lack of confidence, he got to the point where he didn't look at the basket to score and didn't even consider shooting...

We have 2, maybe 3 players who get significant minutes that are zero threat to shoot/score if not within 3 feet of the basket, and sometimes not even then. When 2 of them are on the floor at the same time...pretty easy to defend.

Unless your Isaac Haas, it's unacceptable to not be able to have a decent 8-12 foot shot, at this level.

 

[HawkeyeWalker]

It's a combination of both, in Iowa's case. We don't play with effort on the defensive end. We don't play defense correctly. And, we lack lateral athleticism and over all foot speed.
2 of the 3 things can be corrected. That doesn't mean they will be. It means they can be. Not much can be done about the slow feet of Bohannon, Ellingson, Moss, Baer, Nunge and Garza.

Agreed except 1. Moss could be an excellent defender, with desire and coaching. He's athletic enough and pretty quick. I also believe Garza and Nunge could become good defenders, they'll never be quick but position and awareness would be enough(see Adam Woodbury). If Garza can get even close to what Woody was defensively, he'll be great.

 

[dahlhawk]

Seriously. Stop and think about it. How can a team be that bad in all aspects of playing defense? All these guys have played organized basketball and must have had decent coaches somewhere along the line. They don't talk at all which is one of the first issues.

How can a team be so lost playing both man then closing out on shooters playing a zone. You would think they would at least get half ass decent with one or the other. Both? Are they not physical enough? Why can't they play tighter? If I was Fran I'd tell them to use their fouls. Heck, they go so deep. What is the point of going deep if you don't play aggressive enough. Screw it at this point. Be physical. They are so soft on defense.

Really, how can they be that inept on defense? Shocking if you really think about it.

Moss got his first foul in the last 2 minutes of the game. Not Kidding!

 

[DDThompson]

Moss got his first foul in the last 2 minutes of the game. Not Kidding!

Well there is that 2-foul first half Fran DQ rule to worry about. But most coaches do that.

 

[DDThompson]

From other states or not, they are SLOW. A number of Iowa fans don't seem to recognize this.

7 of 16 are from Iowa BTW, which isn't the point, except that Iowa born players don't get exposed to a lot of speed.

On this subject, I doubt you've ever seen many Iowa teams in the bast 50 years that had that many Iowa players AND was a good team. Last years team obviously had Jok and the year before had Jok and Uthoff.

2005 had 8. There have been some good players out of Iowa.

We just don't have many now that a lot of other teams wanted a lot.

J W is coming in.

“Which isn’t the point” sure seems to be the entire point of this