Ree4
Well-Known Member
Both.
Hawkeyes Past, Present, Future Share Feelings on Racial Injustice
- Thread starter RobHowe
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I never said targeting is right, I was saying it is reality. We can bitch about it all we want but a lot of it is just human nature, which was the nature of my post.
Yeah, sorry, not sure what that means.Rather than spending an hour trying to explain it, of which there are plenty of places to look online (including this thread), I'll post how I feel instead:
kicker22
Well-Known Member
I bought a 98' Mustang immediately after I graduated high school. I got pulled over a lot, i mean a lot in that car and when I did it was never about "the car" but rather about what I was doing with the car. Sports car or not, my actions brought about the attention I received from law enforcement while behind the wheel. It was a "target" that i put on my back.
My argument comes form the use of the word "target". There are always exceptions, but in the context of this thread we're talking about black individuals that are doing nothing wrong or out of the ordinary that are being pulled over. So if they are in fact a "target" and have done absolutely nothing wrong to either warrant being pulled over or to further draw attention to themselves then they are being deliberately sought out. "Targets" are already in the cross hairs, so to speak, so I think it's unfair to say that they're deliberately bringing this attention on themselves. The law does not allow that defense in sexual assault cases and I don't think its fair to imply that they're doing anything different than anyone else. Obviously this is in defense of anyone, black or white, that has been pulled over "on a hunch".
kicker22
Well-Known Member
Then I misinterpreted your post. I just hate the use of the word "target" in this context.
Yea I think both you and Ree4 misunderstood it. All he said was police have things they look for. He never commented his opinion on whether it's right or wrong. Judging from his own experience with it, I assume he thinks its it's wrong.
None of this point is to belittle how bad the relationship is between black people and cops. I know that a lot of people would say "we don't need to hear examples of white people getting abused by cops because it happens more to black people" and it's a very true point. But if one black person hears an example of how a white person got abused by a cop and it makes them feel even a little better that it doesn't just happen to them, then isn't that a good thing?
To be clear, I do not agree with targeting, profiling, surveillance, monitoring, etc based on race, gender, religion or sexual orientation.
kicker22
Well-Known Member
Like I said earlier I totally misread it. I went back and reread it and totally understand the context from where you came from.
That's already here. Next is facial recognition from a drone. George Orwell was a visionary.
For a minute there I thought it was because she just left church ... but this was pre-COVID.
Ree4
Well-Known Member
Good address of the protest by Iowa City Mayor:
https://www.kcrg.com/2020/06/04/iowa-city-mayor-addresses-protests-in-the-city/
https://www.kcrg.com/2020/06/04/iowa-city-mayor-addresses-protests-in-the-city/
Well I guess they did not listen to him. They just closed down I-80 through Iowa City. So much for safety, protesters on the highway. Hopefully nobody gets run over or causes any chain reaction rear ends with vehicles.
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Ree4
Well-Known Member
The protest went perfectly last night IMO. They closed down the interstate and the Mayor along with State Troopers escorted the protesters. Very peaceful. Think the Mayor was still there at 11 pm.
okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
I must respectfully disagree. Interstate 80 is probably the single most important east-west thoroughfare in the United States and it has massive truck traffic. There are massive shortages of various commodities from The Germ. There are supply chain choke points. Truckers are the backbone of getting products and supplies to market. They have to get stuff to a certain place by a certain time and they are typically paid by the mile. Intentionally blocking the interstate is stealing from truck drivers. Plain and simple. They run on tight margins and have to idle and burn gas and their time on the road is their most precious commodity.
We as a society cannot tolerate reaching the point where we say a protest that closes a major interstate went "perfectly." That is disgusting. An uncle who played a significant role in raising my brother and me died over the weekend and I was going to drive up to NY to pick up my brother and then drive to Iowa. I watched it on Facebook because I wasn't going to risk doubling my drive time and risk being the guy pulled out of my car for the crime of daring to pass through some area of "peaceful" or "mostly peaceful" protests.
Ree4
Well-Known Member
So you'd prefer that they gas/smoke and flashbang the protesters to prevent it like what happened the night before? Or divert a few trucks for a few hours. I thought it was dumb for the protesters to feel like they had to block the interstate as well, it was inevitable. They likely would have tried day after day. Hopefully they feel they accomplished their goal and don't do it again.
The truckers don't have a constitutional right to the road but the protesters do have a right to assemble.
iBlocking traffic is a revolutionary act. It literally forces people to stop. It forces the whole system to stop, even if just for a few minutes and in a limited geographical area.
As somebody who lives here, I'd prefer to avoid violence and escalation between the people and the police. How about you recommend all the bangin' and gassin' in your neck of the woods.
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okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
There is no constitutional right to protest on an interstate. That is absurd. The government can impose time, place and manner restrictions on speech. Entering an interstate as a pedestrian is prohibited.
My neck of the woods is fine. People have protested and the cops used some teargas to keep the established perimeter, but nothing of substance has happened. The police established and communicated clear boundaries and rules. Hopefully your idea of appeasement works because we as a society cannot tolerate the stopping of the interstate on a daily basis.
Ree4
Well-Known Member
The government, as you refer to them, are the ones who closed the interstate.
"If we are to bring about real change—political, economic, social, and ecological change—then a lot more people will need to be inconvenienced. A lot more people will need to be made angry. A lot more cars will need to be stopped. A lot more commerce will need to be slowed. And a lot more people will need to wake up from the dream of business as usual."
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-radical-act-of-blocking-traffic_b_59c57aeee4b0b7022a646a70
Again, not saying I necessarily agree with it, but the folks out there protesting do. I'd rather have mild disruption to industries that socialize the costs of their business using interstates while privatizing the profits than people getting tear gassed and flashbanged.
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okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
Yes, to appease a mob. And let us hope the appeasement works. Sometimes, if you bow to someone demanding appeasement, they will take that small victory and be happy. Other times, well. I hope you're right.
Ree4
Well-Known Member
I hope they do take it as a victory and are happy, but I'm not predicting that they will. Just hoping.
Edited to add more to my previous post.
SpiderRico
Well-Known Member
I'm just going to put this out there and you all can make of it what you will.....
In this country, we have a system of checks and balances set up. People act as though rogue cops or police in general aren't accountable to anyone. That's just flat out wrong. In this country, mayors (sometimes city councils, but mostly mayors) are the direct elected body that is entrusted with the responsibility and accountability of a city's police force.
Throughout most of America, the majority of police brutality against people of color is occurring in our major cities. And for years, if not decades, those cities have been run by Democrat mayors. If Democrats are supposed to be the "champion" of civil rights, the "champion" of the black community, why aren't they doing more to stop this? They come out and speak in platitudes and act shocked and horrified every time this happens, yet they enact no policy changes, they don't crack down on the police departments they are supposed to be accountable for. Why is that?
Could it be for the same reason everything in politics is decided? In other words....money? The police unions contribute FAR more to a mayoral election/re-election campaign than any black voter or block of black voters....so guess who is going to get the short end everytime? Yep, you guessed it.
Until this cycle is broken....whether thru some sort of citizen review board or some other mechanism that removes the influence of money and politics from the policing of our streets, this is never going to be solved. You're going to continue to have police unions donating millions of dollars collectively to mayoral campaigns, those mayors who get elected with that money are going to keep looking the other way, and around and around we go.
I'll be interested to see over the coming weeks and months what changes that are made to allow citizens more of a direct say or a direct oversight of the very police who are sworn to protect them.
In this country, we have a system of checks and balances set up. People act as though rogue cops or police in general aren't accountable to anyone. That's just flat out wrong. In this country, mayors (sometimes city councils, but mostly mayors) are the direct elected body that is entrusted with the responsibility and accountability of a city's police force.
Throughout most of America, the majority of police brutality against people of color is occurring in our major cities. And for years, if not decades, those cities have been run by Democrat mayors. If Democrats are supposed to be the "champion" of civil rights, the "champion" of the black community, why aren't they doing more to stop this? They come out and speak in platitudes and act shocked and horrified every time this happens, yet they enact no policy changes, they don't crack down on the police departments they are supposed to be accountable for. Why is that?
Could it be for the same reason everything in politics is decided? In other words....money? The police unions contribute FAR more to a mayoral election/re-election campaign than any black voter or block of black voters....so guess who is going to get the short end everytime? Yep, you guessed it.
Until this cycle is broken....whether thru some sort of citizen review board or some other mechanism that removes the influence of money and politics from the policing of our streets, this is never going to be solved. You're going to continue to have police unions donating millions of dollars collectively to mayoral campaigns, those mayors who get elected with that money are going to keep looking the other way, and around and around we go.
I'll be interested to see over the coming weeks and months what changes that are made to allow citizens more of a direct say or a direct oversight of the very police who are sworn to protect them.
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