People that really understand football understand you are measured by who you actually beat…not just win totals.
Fire Kirk
- Thread starter jawdoc
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BigD
Well-Known Member
Yep, keep Kirk for twenty more years so we can be a pipeline for NFL punters. ROFLMFingAO!!!!!!!!!
BigD
Well-Known Member
Miller & Williams: Iowa trounced by Vols in bowl game
Jon Miller & Chris Williams discuss storylines from Iowa's 35-0 loss to Tennessee in the Citrus Bowl. Does it actually mean anything? Talking quarterbacks, t...
youtu.be
Northside Hawk
Well-Known Member
If that type of coach comes to Iowa, football or basketball, he will never stay long. Examples are Nick Saban at MSU, Bill Self at Illinois, Eric Musselman at Nevada, Chris Beard at Texas Tech, Urban Meyer at Utah, eventually maybe Brohm at Purdue. Hire a destination coach and you get what you get.
This is not defeatist thinking, it's reality. Would love to see a coach turn Iowa into Alabama or Georgia, even if only for a year or two. And that's about how long it would last.
okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
Don't forget when North Mexico lured away our very own Coach Alford with a $25k per annum pay raise.
hawkeye12345
Well-Known Member
Alfraud was getting fired after that season, it wasn't that NM lured him away it was that he knew the writing was on the wall and was looking for any offer. Remember the Tyler Smith transfer? That was the nail in his coffin.
Those of you that consistently post on here about how lowly Iowa is and how the program couldn't possibly lure away any high caliber coaches are sadly mistaken (as usual). Iowa HAD Bob Stoops but Bowlsby refused to pull the trigger...it's a well told story. You know, the guy who won a national championship and was a Hawkeye legacy...yeah we could have had that guy instead of Ferentz. And possibly HIS family too. You know, the guys that are actually coaching winning programs throughout the country and aren't getting mocked by commentators and radio programs throughout the country.
So stop thinking small and worrying about tomorrow...Michigan sure as hell isn't. They're going to win a Natty and then lose it in two years after the investigations but nobody cares.
Iowa City is just as nice of a campus, facilities, fan support and finances as any other major D1 program. Have any of you been to Clemson, SC or Columbia, MO or Louisville, KY or any college town lately not named Iowa City? They are really no different than IC but their fans sure as hell don't always play the, 'oh, we're poor little insert college town and can't attract top talent or coaching. It's total BS.
Iowa pays top 5 coaching salaries. Iowa has homegrown talent in our backyard. Iowa has the facilities and fan support that any other major D1 program enjoys.
My point? Stop being happy with a sub-.600 winning % coach and start thinking what we can accomplish.
I think we all know the infamous press conference question where Brian Ferentz was asked about switching things up at QB and he responded, "why? What's the upside?"
That line and that moment will live in a dark part of my brain for a long time hahaha. And there have been a few painful moments this year when I've heard my psyche whisper it back over and over again in my mind. It's all I could think about while watching this bowl game. And I don't mean to take things out on Deacon Hill, that's not my point. But something has been so sick and broken in our coaching staff for a long time. When we finally put Lainez in at the end and he haphazardly scrambled for first downs on about 4 straight plays... I realized that I knew it was going to happen exactly like that. Deep down, I think every Iowa fan knew that the moment we put in Labas or Lainez (or any hypothetical younger, reasonably talented underclassmen QB), they were going to show us a spark. How could they not?
It's frustrating that some combination of Kirk and Brian believes in their soul that the idea of benching your QB in favor of a younger gun is a sign of complete failure. And they would 100% rather manage the statistically worst offense in the history of the modern sport for multiple years running than cave in to the risk of changing it up.
And the other "logical" takeaway for me, as I reflect on these years and the end of the BF era as offensive coordinator, is that BF (both Brian and Kirk actually), own zero accountability for the fact that we don't have capable players. And we've heard it all in press conferences, talking about injuries, back luck, etc. Deep down in his gut, BF did not think that benching Deacon Hill was an option. Why? Because there is no one else on the roster who is even close to being capable of stepping in. And that, is why he is out of the job. Because on one hand, we know he is flat out wrong and wildly ignorant. But even if he was right, the roster/talent/depthchart is his responsibility. And he failed. Goodnight, you crazy goddamn season of Iowa Hawkeye Football.
That line and that moment will live in a dark part of my brain for a long time hahaha. And there have been a few painful moments this year when I've heard my psyche whisper it back over and over again in my mind. It's all I could think about while watching this bowl game. And I don't mean to take things out on Deacon Hill, that's not my point. But something has been so sick and broken in our coaching staff for a long time. When we finally put Lainez in at the end and he haphazardly scrambled for first downs on about 4 straight plays... I realized that I knew it was going to happen exactly like that. Deep down, I think every Iowa fan knew that the moment we put in Labas or Lainez (or any hypothetical younger, reasonably talented underclassmen QB), they were going to show us a spark. How could they not?
It's frustrating that some combination of Kirk and Brian believes in their soul that the idea of benching your QB in favor of a younger gun is a sign of complete failure. And they would 100% rather manage the statistically worst offense in the history of the modern sport for multiple years running than cave in to the risk of changing it up.
And the other "logical" takeaway for me, as I reflect on these years and the end of the BF era as offensive coordinator, is that BF (both Brian and Kirk actually), own zero accountability for the fact that we don't have capable players. And we've heard it all in press conferences, talking about injuries, back luck, etc. Deep down in his gut, BF did not think that benching Deacon Hill was an option. Why? Because there is no one else on the roster who is even close to being capable of stepping in. And that, is why he is out of the job. Because on one hand, we know he is flat out wrong and wildly ignorant. But even if he was right, the roster/talent/depthchart is his responsibility. And he failed. Goodnight, you crazy goddamn season of Iowa Hawkeye Football.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
This is true, but what KF has done is absolutely dominate Iowa's rivals the last decade. Minny (except for the refs cheating this year), ISU, and Nebbie have been owned by Iowa. Even the Wisky rivalry has evened out a bit the last few years. Yes, these teams are average or worse by national standards, but part of the reason they are is that Iowa hangs a loss on each one of them nearly every year.
Yes, Iowa has not fared well against the Big 3 from the East of late. But, prior to the BF as the QB coach era, things were not quite so lopsided.
That said, if your measuring stick is keeping up with OSU and Michigan, then break out your checkbook and start donating serious cash. Because without your life savings and a lot of other fans' life savings, Iowa does not have the resources to keep up with that arm's race anymore than it has for the last 40 years. Iowa is fortunate to be where it is given NIL disparity and its limited recruiting base. Reality.
Bigtenchamp
Well-Known Member
no one is expecting Iowa to compete regularly like OSU and Michigan.
It's more like 11-11 records vs Northwestern and losing to teams that we should never lose to
Or having an inept to poor offense 8 out of 10 years.
You are doing what other defeatists do… talk n extremes. The answer isn’t one or the other. And i’d settle for hayden fry again. There are droves of great, young coaches looking for stability. Not all leave at the first sign of success. If they do, hire another one. I get tired of hearing the limitations of Iowa and the midwest. To many, this is a hidden secret. And iowa has tons of resources. Iowa football has existed for many years an it will continue to. I’m very confident in that. And that’s regardless of what Kirk ferentz does and long after he’s gone
hawkinn3
Well-Known Member
Maybe not beat, but I expect us to compete. Remember when ranked teams playing at Kinnick was always a meat grinder? Not now, we get destroyed by good teams.
HuckFinn
Well-Known Member
Yup
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
Hayden Fry again? Kirk Ferentz has achieved more than Coach Fry and has this program playing at a high level. Both are amazing coaches and have been great to this state. But, going back to Fry is taking the program back to yo-yo win/loss totals. Like it or not, the last 9 years of Iowa football have been the best stretch in nearly everyone's lifetime. Just do the math.
Bigtenchamp
Well-Known Member
In my mind Fry is pretty similar success wise to Ferentz.... entertainment quality was much much better.
Ferentz best stretch however was 2002-2004... 3 straight #8 AP finishes.
I was more of a believer back then.
But he lost me in the stretch of around 10 years after when we averaged about 6 - 6.5 wins with too many losses against mediocre and poor competition.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
KF went through a stretch where the team was down in the early part of the last decade, but man, have you been watching of late? Over the last 10 years, Iowa is ranked 13th in the country for overall wins, averaging almost 9 per season. I know, I know, "but its the Big Ten West." So what? A win is a win, and I like it when Iowa wins and do not like it when they lose.
13th!!!! For a small population state in the upper midwest school with another P5 in the state? NTS
For the heck of it I looked at the previous 10 year win/loss records before Fry and the 10 years before Ferentz.
10 years before Fry Iowa was 21-72
10 years before Ferentz Iowa was 66-49
My point is Fry took over a dumpster fire of program and brought it to life. Ferentz didn't inherit near the mess Fry did.
Also, during the Fry era there were approximately 19 to 20 bowl games per year. During the Ferentz era, there are approximately 32 to 40 bowl games per year.
Today you need 6 wins to get in and teams play at least 12 games a year versus 11 when Fry coached. While not impossible, it was more difficult to get a bowl bid with 6 wins during Fry's tenure.
Fry was at a different level than Ferentz and as Bigtenchamp pointed out, more entertaining for sure under Fry. I was at Kinnick often from 1979 through 1990. It was fun to put it mildly.
BigD
Well-Known Member
Are you seriously going to be happy finishing in sixth, seventh, eighth place or worse every year from here on out???
How can you seriously look at what just happened this year. Total embarrassment in the national media. Everyone is talking about it on You Tube podcasts and other social media. Out scored by over ninety points to ZERO. Even die heart fans are finally waking up.
If nothing else this season exposed what Kirk has been getting away with. Just beat the pussies of the West, Iowa State, and three other bottom dwellers and wha la eight or nine wins a year.
Wins are not everything (see this season). You need to put a cherry on top of a great season and we didn’t. A enormous size cow came along and shit on our desert plate. Twenty effing years without a conference title.
Kirk has a chance to make a difference finally. We know our defense is good enough to change things at Iowa. If the old man will just let go of his control freak mindset and bring in OC who can bring in top QB’s and wide receivers then the arms race is on. We are soon going to cross over the $100 to $120 million a year from just the Big Ten Channel alone. Time to get a real OC and time to go shopping at high end retailers. Our money is green just like every one else’s.
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Northside Hawk
Well-Known Member
Well looks like you stepped in it again. Iowa has tons of resources? They are at a size and/or climate disadvantage vs most schools in their conference, let alone schools in Texas, Alabama, Georgia and Florida. YOU try to entice the amount of talent some of those schools have in their backyards to come up here. I love Hayden and Kirk, and what they have been able to build and sustain for closing in on a half century in a cold weather state with a small population base is nothing short of remarkable.
Many of the great young coaches you speak of come from the very programs you rail at Kirk for playing every September. Why would you want one of them?
Name me one coach who has taken a decent program and elevated them to elite blue blood status and stayed there without moving up. One. Dabo Swinney possibly. Maybe Mark Few in basketball.
I love both Hayden and Kirk, but if you rip Kirk for scheduling soft and playing boring football, you also have to acknowledge that Hayden also scheduled soft and once gave up 56 points in one half (1995 vs Ohio State)
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