Did Hightower & Co. cheat us out of Cartwright's heave?

[tweeterhawk]

For those of you saying that we shouldn't worry about Hightower, we did lose in OT by 3. To get to OT you have to be tied. You allow 3 to Iowa at the end of the first half, Iowa isn't tied after regulation, and wins the game. Now I understand that is a lot of contingencies and the flow of the game may have been different with Iowa up 11, but simple math would dictate that being cheated out of 3 points may have been enough to get a win for Iowa. That could have been huge.
On a side note, I've noticed a little bit of a bias in officiating this year. I'm biased towards the Hawks, but it does seem like a majority of the calls go in favor of the team with the better record. Tell me how a player can call a timeout on the floor while scrapping for the ball and he doesn't even have possession? That's blatant!

I don't know whether the additional 3 points at that time in the game would have meant a difference in the ultimate point total. But I certainly think the dynamic would have favored Iowa coming out of halftime knowing you played well towards the end of the first half and hold an 11-point lead.

 

[Section136]

I thought they always say during broadcasts that the light on the backboard is what matters.

 

[GravyJones]

I thought they always say during broadcasts that the light on the backboard is what matters.

It's always been the clock, when it's clearly visible. In the end, it really doesn't matter which you use because they all work in sync. It's more accurate to use the game clock or lights because video can easily be stopped on the frame of the event for officials to see. The audio could be analyzed, but that wouldn't be nearly as easy to convey to the officials.

 

[Section136]

Over 40 minutes, the best team always wins.

Tell that to the 1980 U.S. Olympic Hockey team. Or Rollie Massamino's Villanova Wildcats. Or Valvano's NC State Wolfpack. I could go on and on.

 

[EddyP]

I don't follow, I watched a reply on the telectast that featured the game clock synched with the shot, it appeared to shot the clock at zero with the ball on Bryces finger tips.

I think what he is saying is that according to Spank Hightower used the sound of the buzzer which according to what I posted is the last thing you should use if there is a controversy. If he used the video of the clock that is fine but if he couldn't tell by that he should have used the light(which according to everyone else showed he had released it), and then the horn.

 

[EddyP]

Tell that to the 1980 U.S. Olympic Hockey team. Or Rollie Massamino's Villanova Wildcats. Or Valvano's NC State Wolfpack. I could go on and on.

I think this is what you are trying to say...

 

[Iowafarmgirl]

Tell that to the 1980 U.S. Olympic Hockey team. Or Rollie Massamino's Villanova Wildcats. Or Valvano's NC State Wolfpack. I could go on and on.

Tell them what? My entire point is that you can never say who is best before the game, but only after. Of course we all know the 1980 hockey team was the best...because they proved it after 60 minutes.

Thanks for backing me up on this.

 

[woodyk1]

Hightower has done mainly Big East games this year,until this Michigan game,like he was told to move on by the Big Ten or something,but he had to come back and get his annual screwing of the Hawks in before the year is over. Then last nite he was doing the PU-IU game,and made a home town call on a loose ball scramble where he gave the hometown IU team the timeout,when it clearly should have been a jump ball....playing to the home crowd all the way....so evidently the Big Ten might have just quietly ''suspended'' Eddie for most of the season but now has let him back in....why?????

According to this web site (I cannot verify the accuracy), Eddie Hightower has done 13 Big Ten conference games (most by any ref) this year and only 7 Big East conference games. Now, if you count games where there is 1 Big Ten team or 1 Big East team, the numbers may get closer.

Ed Hightower Officiating Schedule - College Basketball Referee

This web site is interesting. I find some of the referee schedules fascinating.

 

[EddyP]

Tell them what? My entire point is that you can never say who is best before the game, but only after. Of course we all know the 1980 hockey team was the best...because they proved it after 60 minutes.

Thanks for backing me up on this.

THAT DAY. You said the best team always wins and clearly that is not true. The best team does not always win that is why they call them upsets. That is why March Madness is so exciting because on any given day a 15 seed can beat a 2 seed or whatever.

 

[derekforhawks]

Duffman FTW. Complaining about the officials is the lamest thing you can do. Over 40 minutes, the best team always wins.

In most cases, I don't mind what you have to say but in this case I have to wonder if you've ever heard of Tim Donaghy? Look him up and then come back. I'm interested to hear your response on this.

 

[ShadasRevenge]

If he was basing it on the horn, then it may be that the horn and lights at CHA are not properly sync'd. If you stop the slow-mo replay on that clip at the :16 mark, the ball is clearly out of Bryce's hands -- you can see a CHA railing between the ball and his hands, and his stance shows he is finishing the shot -- but the lights have not gone off on the back basket.

This is what I was thinking while Dolph was describing it on the radio. He said that the light on the backboard behind him (Cartwright) was on, but that the clock said .1 when the ball left his hand.

But close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades. Iowa's complete inability to get a stop when it mattered was what cost them.

 

[greghammel]

The answer to the question is YES... the question wasn't did it cost us the game? That will never be known. Point is... the basket was called good! I watched it over and over on DVR... at halftime they reviewed it and overturned it without having conclusive evidence. That is bad stuff. If you are going to overturn a call, you better be right!

And this dumb argument that 40+ minutes of basketball the best team wins... explain best of 7 NBA playoffs where it usually takes at least 6 games to determine the winner... if they best team always wins... why wouldn't it always be a sweep? Why even play more than once? Ridiculous! You could run the NCAA Tournament immediately over again the following week and get a whole different look and most likely a different champion.

 

[ibahawkeye]

In most cases, I don't mind what you have to say but in this case I have to wonder if you've ever heard of Tim Donaghy? Look him up and then come back. I'm interested to hear your response on this.

Donaghy was never found guilty of fixing games.

He simply bet on games knowing the relationship between the refs and the players, coaches, GMs and owners. You should check out his book: Personal Foul.

 

[twinhawkfans]

Eddie's schedule is probably set 2-3 years in advance.

Not true. I have a good friend named Terry Oglesby who refs Bg 10 and Bg 12 and he doesn't really know his schedule until in the fall every year. had 64 games this year, told me that at a high school football game in october and said he had just gotten his assignments the previous week, around Oct 1st. Don't know why Eddie be any different.

 

[derekforhawks]

Donaghy was never found guilty of fixing games.

He simply bet on games knowing the relationship between the refs and the players, coaches, GMs and owners. You should check out his book: Personal Foul.

Obviously it's going to be hard to prove whether he fixed games or not. Just because he was never found guilty of it and denied it doesn't mean he didn't fix games. The man was busted and a guy like that isn't going to come clean. He's going to make it sound like it wasn't as bad as it seems. Why would a read a book about a cheater? Either way, my point was that it can be done. This still happens today and will continue to happen. Refs can change the outcome of a game. As far as the shot or the game....who knows. Iowa didn't really help themselves. The thing that I find funny is that some people honestly believe the best team always wins.

Edit:Thought I would throw a little information at you ibahawkeye. I know it's not correct to quote wikipedia but they have references at the bottom so whatever. Anyway, I took this little piece of info off there, "Sports gambling expert R. J. Bell, president of sports betting information site Pregame.com, tracked every game Donaghy worked from 2003 to 2007. He discovered that during the two seasons investigated by the NBA, the teams involved scored more points than expected by the Las Vegas sports books 57 percent of the time. In the previous two seasons, this only happened 44 percent of the time. According to Bell, the odds of such a discrepancy are 1 in 1,000, and there was "a 99.9 percent chance that these results would not have happened without an outside factor". He also found 10 straight games in 2007 in which Donaghy worked the game that the point spread moved 1.5 points or more before the tip—an indication that big money had been wagered on the game. The big money won every time—another indication that "something (was) going on"


BTW I suggest you read into the facts and not the guy's book.

 

[ibahawkeye]

Obviously it's going to be hard to prove whether he fixed games or not. Just because he was never found guilty of it and denied it doesn't mean he didn't fix games. The man was busted and a guy like that isn't going to come clean. He's going to make it sound like it wasn't as bad as it seems. Why would a read a book about a cheater? Either way, my point was that it can be done. This still happens today and will continue to happen. Refs can change the outcome of a game. As far as the shot or the game....who knows. Iowa didn't really help themselves. The thing that I find funny is that some people honestly believe the best team always wins.

Edit:Thought I would throw a little information at you ibahawkeye. I know it's not correct to quote wikipedia but they have references at the bottom so whatever. Anyway, I took this little piece of info off there, "Sports gambling expert R. J. Bell, president of sports betting information site Pregame.com, tracked every game Donaghy worked from 2003 to 2007. He discovered that during the two seasons investigated by the NBA, the teams involved scored more points than expected by the Las Vegas sports books 57 percent of the time. In the previous two seasons, this only happened 44 percent of the time. According to Bell, the odds of such a discrepancy are 1 in 1,000, and there was "a 99.9 percent chance that these results would not have happened without an outside factor". He also found 10 straight games in 2007 in which Donaghy worked the game that the point spread moved 1.5 points or more before the tip—an indication that big money had been wagered on the game. The big money won every time—another indication that "something (was) going on"


BTW I suggest you read into the facts and not the guy's book.

We agree that the fact is that he was never found guilty of fixing games.

 

[tm3308]

We agree that the fact is that he was never found guilty of fixing games.

And O.J. was never found guilty of murder, and Barry Bonds never tested positive for steroids.

But we know they did it, because it's painfully obvious.

 

[Section136]

Tell them what? My entire point is that you can never say who is best before the game, but only after. Of course we all know the 1980 hockey team was the best...because they proved it after 60 minutes.

Thanks for backing me up on this.

But the Russian Hockey Team but the U.S. like 10-1 a month or so before the Olympics. Did the US improve that much and did the Russians get that much worse in a months worth of time? Im confuzed.

 

[DuffMan]

Not true. I have a good friend named Terry Oglesby who refs Bg 10 and Bg 12 and he doesn't really know his schedule until in the fall every year. had 64 games this year, told me that at a high school football game in october and said he had just gotten his assignments the previous week, around Oct 1st. Don't know why Eddie be any different.

I stand corrected.

 

[Iowafarmgirl]

THAT DAY. You said the best team always wins and clearly that is not true. The best team does not always win that is why they call them upsets. That is why March Madness is so exciting because on any given day a 15 seed can beat a 2 seed or whatever.

Of course THAT DAY! No one knows how a team is going to play on any given day. That is wht makes athletics so compelling; That on any given day any team can win.
I don't believe in upsets, because all people take into account is talent and records. Well, on game day, those two things mean squat. As they say in stock trading, "past success is not an indicator of future performance". I honestly believe, that in every game, hell, in every practice, a new team shows up in the same uniform each day, and that new team has to forge its own success.

To kind of illustrate it, when Iowa beat MSU in basketball by 20...they were the better team that day! It was not an upset, because one team clearly outclassed the other. When they played again, Iowa was beat by a better team. It is because team's constantly evolve, and they changed into their incarnations that day.

Look, I know I have kind of an abstract philosophy here, and I am doing an even worse job of articulating it over a few days, so don't bother with it if you must.