I heard the 2 the 3 and maybe the 4 can be hard too. Jk I agree with what you said I'm sure the 3 or swingman position is the easiest because althletic is athletic.
Compare the impact of Woodbury/Gesell to Horner/Brunner as freshmen.
- Thread starter Thawki
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Touche
big10fan
Well-Known Member
i don't think its impossible for them to match those numbers, but maybe not likely. i honestly think gesell will end up being the better player of the two and think that both W & G have much higher ceilings than H & B did. will the staff be able to develop them will remain to be seen.
some people will undoubtedly have unrealistic expectations for them, but i think most reasonable hawk fans will understand that next year will most likely be another very rough year of around 15 wins.
some people will undoubtedly have unrealistic expectations for them, but i think most reasonable hawk fans will understand that next year will most likely be another very rough year of around 15 wins.
homes
Well-Known Member
I expect that both of these guys will be significant contributors from the start. They've both played more basketball outside of the basketball season than during the season. Their development curve is already very well underway. So, I anticipate they'll be providing very meaningful, productive minutes out of the block. Fran's not going to hold them back.
busabus114
Well-Known Member
They will have a nice impact but I bet its less than B&H. I also bet that Iowa fan's expectations will be wayyyyyy out of line by the time the season rolls around
Some people who shall remain nameless thought 8 and 6 from Brommer would be fairly easy to attain
Some people who shall remain nameless thought 8 and 6 from Brommer would be fairly easy to attain
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goldenhawk96
Well-Known Member
I don't think you can make a direct comparison based on numbers alone. My main hope for Woodbury is not on the offensive end. That will be carried by Marble and Basabe. That much is pretty clear at this point. I'm hoping Woodbury's main impact is on the defensive end with some length and size that we are sorely lacking.
I would expect the center position to pick up a ton of fouls next year. With Fran's 2 and out first half rule I think Woodbury will be sitting a lot.
Gessell will have some weapons to get some assists. Having Marble on the wing and Basabe on the block is a solid foundation.
I would expect the center position to pick up a ton of fouls next year. With Fran's 2 and out first half rule I think Woodbury will be sitting a lot.
Gessell will have some weapons to get some assists. Having Marble on the wing and Basabe on the block is a solid foundation.
AdamHawk
Well-Known Member
I haven't seen much of either but just in the videos that are available I've been impressed with Woodbury's ability to go to either hand with ease. I think some people are underestimating his athleticism. You don't see too many 7 footers who move as smoothly as he does.
Edit: Not saying he is going to come out and be a world beater in his first year of college, just saying some people are selling him short. There's a reason Roy was after him.
Edit: Not saying he is going to come out and be a world beater in his first year of college, just saying some people are selling him short. There's a reason Roy was after him.
I'm not comparing Woody to Zeller, but look at the difference Zeller has made to the Hoosiers this year. We need that inside guy that we have not have in a long while.
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
Basabe averaged 11 ppg and 6.8 rpg last year as a freshmen, over an entire year. I don't see why Woodbury can't do 7 & 5.
That said, yes, I understand that Woody & Gesell will both be freshmen and players develop at different rates. Especially at various positions.
But we're talking about a Top 50 recruit in Woodbury, yes? Or at least Top 100? I just don't see 7 & 5 as that crazy of a goal.
That said, yes, I understand that Woody & Gesell will both be freshmen and players develop at different rates. Especially at various positions.
But we're talking about a Top 50 recruit in Woodbury, yes? Or at least Top 100? I just don't see 7 & 5 as that crazy of a goal.
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tailgater371
Well-Known Member
I loved Horner and Bruner, but help me remember, what was their rankings out of highschool? Why is it expected that Woodbury and Gesell can't/won't match or exceed them? Were they that highly ranked?
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
I believe both Horner & Brunner were both 4* recruits, both Top 100. Just like Woodbury & Gesell. Similar production wouldn't surprise me.
But thinking more long-term, I remember the team that Horner & Brunner had as seniors - 25 wins and a 3 seed in the tournament. If W&G turn into anything near as good, Iowa Hoops should be fine in a few years, provided they are surrounded with other solid players.
Rivals rankings for Woody(43),Gesell(89)
RSCI (composite) rankings for Brunner(50),Horner (58), Haluska(62).
RSCI ranking for Leonard (29), Zeller(12).
I think so much of the numbers these frosh put up depends on playing time,and the talent around them.
Horner and Brunner got good minutes on a somewhat depleted (injuries,suspensions) Hawkeye team.
Leonard was behind a senior center in Tisdale,but clearly Leonard was lacking Big Ten strength last year.
Zeller is bigger,more ready than Leonard,and has no real competition for center at IU.
Woody is more Leonard than Zeller as his ranking indicates,and will have some competition for center minutes with Gabe a sophmore.
Gesell will have a free run at pg,with only Clemmons to battle for minutes,unless Marble is considered a candidate.
So,I think Gesell might put up some numbers but they are joining a team that has Marble,McCabe,May,Melsahn,White,Oglesby and Gabe back. Those guys have all scored double figures in games at times this year already,so points might be very spread out again next year....but Gesell could average 7 pts and 4 assts,and be very good.
RSCI (composite) rankings for Brunner(50),Horner (58), Haluska(62).
RSCI ranking for Leonard (29), Zeller(12).
I think so much of the numbers these frosh put up depends on playing time,and the talent around them.
Horner and Brunner got good minutes on a somewhat depleted (injuries,suspensions) Hawkeye team.
Leonard was behind a senior center in Tisdale,but clearly Leonard was lacking Big Ten strength last year.
Zeller is bigger,more ready than Leonard,and has no real competition for center at IU.
Woody is more Leonard than Zeller as his ranking indicates,and will have some competition for center minutes with Gabe a sophmore.
Gesell will have a free run at pg,with only Clemmons to battle for minutes,unless Marble is considered a candidate.
So,I think Gesell might put up some numbers but they are joining a team that has Marble,McCabe,May,Melsahn,White,Oglesby and Gabe back. Those guys have all scored double figures in games at times this year already,so points might be very spread out again next year....but Gesell could average 7 pts and 4 assts,and be very good.
Thawki
Well-Known Member
Well, 1hawkeye1, I will tell you what I would base predictions on.
I wasn't quite sure what to expect from Brunner when he entered his freshman year, although he was a top 50 player when final rankings came out, I believe. With Horner, though, I personally felt like we would get out of him what we did his freshman year. I was not surprised in the least.
He had been around the block on the AAU circuit against national competition as the floor general (a difference from Bru, who was also on that team and played quite well) of a very good AAU team. Based upon what guys like Horner would typically do in that environment there was a reasonable expectation of his freshman year.
I believe the same can be extrapolated for Gesell, within reason. I believe his statistics will be slightly better than Horner's as a frosh, and his impact at least as good.
I am not quite so sure about Woodbury. Per Jon's comments above, I think he is a little bit more of an uncertainty. That being said, I will go out on a limb and say I am not sure why a reasonable expectation from him wouldn't be seven points and five rebounds at minimum, as well as a significant impact on defense.
I wasn't quite sure what to expect from Brunner when he entered his freshman year, although he was a top 50 player when final rankings came out, I believe. With Horner, though, I personally felt like we would get out of him what we did his freshman year. I was not surprised in the least.
He had been around the block on the AAU circuit against national competition as the floor general (a difference from Bru, who was also on that team and played quite well) of a very good AAU team. Based upon what guys like Horner would typically do in that environment there was a reasonable expectation of his freshman year.
I believe the same can be extrapolated for Gesell, within reason. I believe his statistics will be slightly better than Horner's as a frosh, and his impact at least as good.
I am not quite so sure about Woodbury. Per Jon's comments above, I think he is a little bit more of an uncertainty. That being said, I will go out on a limb and say I am not sure why a reasonable expectation from him wouldn't be seven points and five rebounds at minimum, as well as a significant impact on defense.
sportstalent
Well-Known Member
They will have lesser numbers because they are going to be on a solid team, actually, I think Iowa will have a chance to be an NIT team next year.
It doesn't have to do with W/G, it has to do with the whole class and with Marble and Basabe back, the bulk of the scoring should go to them with a whole bunch of solid role players like: White, Oglesby, McCabe, Olaseni. Look the only position that has to outperform the current roster is PG, the C position needs to step up, but with the combination of Woodbury/Olaseni, it will not get worse. Iowa's new bigs need to play hard, rebound and alter shots.
The Iowa team will be a team next season, the only real hole will be a proven swing player behind Marble, another wing player that can get to the rim. Maybe Ingram will provide that, but it will be imperative for Iowa to address that position with the 2013 class, both scholarships.
It doesn't have to do with W/G, it has to do with the whole class and with Marble and Basabe back, the bulk of the scoring should go to them with a whole bunch of solid role players like: White, Oglesby, McCabe, Olaseni. Look the only position that has to outperform the current roster is PG, the C position needs to step up, but with the combination of Woodbury/Olaseni, it will not get worse. Iowa's new bigs need to play hard, rebound and alter shots.
The Iowa team will be a team next season, the only real hole will be a proven swing player behind Marble, another wing player that can get to the rim. Maybe Ingram will provide that, but it will be imperative for Iowa to address that position with the 2013 class, both scholarships.
big10fan
Well-Known Member
Re: Well, 1hawkeye1, I will tell you what I would base predictions on.
wow, what a well thought out and coherent post! what are you doing here?
good thoughts, couldn't have said it better myself.
wow, what a well thought out and coherent post! what are you doing here?
good thoughts, couldn't have said it better myself.
Woodbury will not be alone in the center position
Olaseni 6'11 and Meyer 6'10 will be there to help
and contray to a few Marble will be the SG and White will be the SF
i still stand by next years lineup of
pg Gesell 6'2
sg Marble 6'6
sf White 6'8
pf Basabe 6'7
c Woodbury 7'1
that is a very solid lineup
2nd string if you will looks like this
pg Clemmons 6'1
sg Oglesby 6'5; Ingram 6'3
sf May 6'5
pf McCabe 6'7; Meyer 6'10
c Olaseni 6'11
that gives us much better quality depth than i have seen in years
the best news is that May is the only senior
the 2013-14 season will be the year of a run in the NCAA's
Basabe, Marble and McCabe will be seniors and the Woodbury class will be sophamores
Olaseni 6'11 and Meyer 6'10 will be there to help
and contray to a few Marble will be the SG and White will be the SF
i still stand by next years lineup of
pg Gesell 6'2
sg Marble 6'6
sf White 6'8
pf Basabe 6'7
c Woodbury 7'1
that is a very solid lineup
2nd string if you will looks like this
pg Clemmons 6'1
sg Oglesby 6'5; Ingram 6'3
sf May 6'5
pf McCabe 6'7; Meyer 6'10
c Olaseni 6'11
that gives us much better quality depth than i have seen in years
the best news is that May is the only senior
the 2013-14 season will be the year of a run in the NCAA's
Basabe, Marble and McCabe will be seniors and the Woodbury class will be sophamores
sportstalent
Well-Known Member
I will stick with the lineup of: Gesell, Oglesby, Marble, Basabe and Woodbury
Oglesby is too good to keep on the bench and Marble has plenty enough skill to keep up with the best players in the BIG at the 3-spot.
Also, with Gessel, Oglesby and Marble on the floor all at once, it gives Iowa a great passing team as well.
Two deep:
Clemmons
Ingram
White
Meyer/McCabe
Meyer/Olaseni
I know May is going to get all the chances he can, but the simple fact is Iowa has over-recruited him with this class and White is developing very nicely with a much better skill set. I just don't see him getting much playing time at the expense of better players.
Oglesby is too good to keep on the bench and Marble has plenty enough skill to keep up with the best players in the BIG at the 3-spot.
Also, with Gessel, Oglesby and Marble on the floor all at once, it gives Iowa a great passing team as well.
Two deep:
Clemmons
Ingram
White
Meyer/McCabe
Meyer/Olaseni
I know May is going to get all the chances he can, but the simple fact is Iowa has over-recruited him with this class and White is developing very nicely with a much better skill set. I just don't see him getting much playing time at the expense of better players.
