Combine Results

[99topdawg]

Is it more important to start or to play the most snaps? Van Ness played the most snaps, I'll trust Parker on why he didn't "start".

Every now and then I have basketball players that get to start, play 2 minutes at the beginning of each half, and sit the rest of the game. I bring in kids that don't start to play 3 or 4 times the minutes as that kid the rest of the game. But hey, he's a starter.

 

[99topdawg]

Moss:

4.45 40 12th fastest CB
1.48 10 4th fastest
39" vertical 6th highest

Julius Brents
4.53 40
41.5" vertical 2nd
11' 6" broad jump 1st

 

[99topdawg]

Kaevon Merriweather
4.62 16th safety
35.5" vertical 9th

Other than vertical, he was in the bottom 5 safties in everything else.

 

[Grady]

Moss:

4.45 40 12th fastest CB
1.48 10 4th fastest
39" vertical 6th highest

Julius Brents
4.53 40
41.5" vertical 2nd
11' 6" broad jump 1st

Yeah, Brents is a long, lean dude. Surprised there are 11 CBs out there faster than Moss this year.

 

[Grady]

As to Van Ness…Can you read?

Indeed I can. Van Ness had a nice 40yd dash time, but his vertical jump and broad jump ranked 23rd and 18th among all defensive ends and edge rushers at the Combine. I don't know that any of these measurements are reliable predictors of NFL success, but my point was from a comparative point of view his Combine measurements were uneven.

 

[Hawkboys]

Indeed I can. Van Ness had a nice 40yd dash time, but his vertical jump and broad jump ranked 23rd and 18th among all defensive ends and edge rushers at the Combine. I don't know that any of these measurements are reliable predictors of NFL success, but my point was from a comparative point of view his Combine measurements were uneven.

From what I saw he was 3-4" taller and 40#s heavier than the really fast DEs.

 

[Hawkboys]

From what I saw he was 3-4" taller and 40#s heavier than the really fast DEs.

CBS Sports tabs Lukas Van Ness as day one NFL Combine star

Lukas Van Ness went into Indianapolis and delivered on lofty expectations. CBS Sports named Van Ness a star of day one at the NFL Combine.

hawkeyeswire.usatoday.com

 

[HuckFinn]

Indeed I can. Van Ness had a nice 40yd dash time, but his vertical jump and broad jump ranked 23rd and 18th among all defensive ends and edge rushers at the Combine. I don't know that any of these measurements are reliable predictors of NFL success, but my point was from a comparative point of view his Combine measurements were uneven.

Not very well. He is predicted to compete hard for a first round pick.

 

[RyDogg]

From what I saw he was 3-4" taller and 40#s heavier than the really fast DEs.

This.

I think if you consider size, especially weight, he compares quite favorably with the other DE's/Edge's.

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Bobby Football

@Rob__Paul


Highest #RAS (
@MathBomb
) scores from Day 1 of the NFL Scouting Combine: 1. Jack Campbell, Iowa (9.98) T-2. Ade Adebawore, Northwestern (9.85) T-2. YaYa Diaby, Louisville (9.85) 4. Lukas Van Ness, Iowa (9.74) 5. Gervon Dexter, Florida (9.69) 6. Bryan Bresee, Clemson (9.69)

 

[99topdawg]

Van Ness did 17 reps on bench which was 24th of 25 DE's. If that hurts him, that's stupid. Watch the film.

Here he is against Peter Skoronski, 1st OT taken in Mel Kiper's most recent mock draft at #10 showing his lack of strength: https://twitter.com/BenFennell_NFL/status/1555712533457158146

Here he is against Paris Johnson Jr, 2nd OT taken in Mel Kiper's most recent mock draft at #11 showing his lack of strength: https://twitter.com/Brownscentral_/status/1610649812512247808

Here he is against OSU's #74: https://twitter.com/Brownscentral_/status/1610667975383699462

These 3 plays alone should wipe out any doubt about his strength because of his 17 reps...unless you're my Browns. Analytics > film. Dumbasses.

 

[NCHawker]

I'm not sure how much weight the pros put on the combine. I'm sure it varries from team to team. As someone said its like hiting balls on the driving range. It does not always translate to the game

 

[okeefe4prez]

Van Ness did 17 reps on bench which was 24th of 25 DE's. If that hurts him, that's stupid. Watch the film.

Here he is against Peter Skoronski, 1st OT taken in Mel Kiper's most recent mock draft at #10 showing his lack of strength: https://twitter.com/BenFennell_NFL/status/1555712533457158146

Here he is against Paris Johnson Jr, 2nd OT taken in Mel Kiper's most recent mock draft at #11 showing his lack of strength: https://twitter.com/Brownscentral_/status/1610649812512247808

Here he is against OSU's #74: https://twitter.com/Brownscentral_/status/1610667975383699462

These 3 plays alone should wipe out any doubt about his strength because of his 17 reps...unless you're my Browns. Analytics > film. Dumbasses.

The 225 bench is lame. It doesn't test actual upper body strength and dudes with really long arms are often at a sizeable disadvantage in bench press, but when you're drafting a d-lineman you want that guy with really long arms to impede the passing lane.

A better test would be a 275 or 315 bench where guys do one rep, then rest 30 seconds, then do another rep. See how many they can do. That would better simulate the upper body push and type of endurance dudes need.

Really, though, the only weight thing I would care about if I were a GM is how well dudes can move the sled. They should scrap or modify the bench and add a test where dudes have to push a 500 pound sled fifty feet. Time that. It will somewhat simulate an actual football skill. Maybe make them do it ten times with 30 second breaks in between to simulate game endurance during an actual drive.

 

[Fryowa]

The 225 bench is lame. It doesn't test actual upper body strength and dudes with really long arms are often at a sizeable disadvantage in bench press, but when you're drafting a d-lineman you want that guy with really long arms to impede the passing lane.

A better test would be a 275 or 315 bench where guys do one rep, then rest 30 seconds, then do another rep. See how many they can do. That would better simulate the upper body push and type of endurance dudes need.

Really, though, the only weight thing I would care about if I were a GM is how well dudes can move the sled. They should scrap or modify the bench and add a test where dudes have to push a 500 pound sled fifty feet. Time that. It will somewhat simulate an actual football skill. Maybe make them do it ten times with 30 second breaks in between to simulate game endurance during an actual drive.

Because how else would Mel Kiper have bogus filler material like talking about how Linderbaum’s arms are 1/2” too short so he’s gonna drop three rounds because of it?

 

[Fryowa]

I'm not sure how much weight the pros put on the combine. I'm sure it varries from team to team. As someone said it’s like hiting balls on the driving range. It does not always translate to the game

I really do think the only reason it exists is for media and ad revenue. It’s become a huge broadcasting viewership draw (tv ad $) and all the sports networks go crazy for it. The NFL ain’t dummies and they know any press is good press.

NFL evaluators also ain’t dummies and they know they could easily bring guys in to private workouts and really find out what they want to find out. I’d dare bet there’s not a good correlation between Pro Bowlers and top 2 or 3 combine overall performances at each position.

 

[okeefe4prez]

I’d dare bet there’s not a good correlation between Pro Bowlers and top 2 or 3 combine overall performances at each position.

I'm too lazy to go back and look, but I would suspect that a fair percentage of the dudes who are really good are physical outliers, even by NFL standards. Like take Suh, I'll bet if he did the combine he'd destroy everyone in a couple of key categories. Same with Barry Sanders or Orlando Pace. Thing is, those guys are freaks to begin with and would get picked top 5 without the combine. The combine might be fine to sort out the generational absolute outliers, but I have to think everyone else kind of coalesces around certain means and that they have a bunch of different peaks and valleys in certain categories, none of which are indicative of NFL success.

But there are a lot of sports channels on TV nowadays that need content. And the combine is content.

 

[HawkGold]

Moss:

4.45 40 12th fastest CB
1.48 10 4th fastest
39" vertical 6th highest

Julius Brents
4.53 40
41.5" vertical 2nd
11' 6" broad jump 1st

I had a great view at Illinois of Moss' called-back fumble return. Practically he ran right at me. About then there was a discussion about his NFL prospects being negative. What I saw was spectacularly fast. It was reminiscent of Tim Dwight. Maybe not shot out of a cannon Tim Dwight but it was still spectacular.

 

[99topdawg]

LaPorta ran a 4.59. 3rd best for a tight end.

 

[ShemHawk]

The 225 bench is lame. It doesn't test actual upper body strength and dudes with really long arms are often at a sizeable disadvantage in bench press, but when you're drafting a d-lineman you want that guy with really long arms to impede the passing lane.

A better test would be a 275 or 315 bench where guys do one rep, then rest 30 seconds, then do another rep. See how many they can do. That would better simulate the upper body push and type of endurance dudes need.

Really, though, the only weight thing I would care about if I were a GM is how well dudes can move the sled. They should scrap or modify the bench and add a test where dudes have to push a 500 pound sled fifty feet. Time that. It will somewhat simulate an actual football skill. Maybe make them do it ten times with 30 second breaks in between to simulate game endurance during an actual drive.

I remember all the discussion re the tire flipping the linemen (and others) did. The point was that the bench press is pushing a weight straight out in front of you and that's not how you block or rush in football. You get the leverage and lift and push...like flipping that tire. Make that a combine workout.

 

[Seth53]

Would be interesting to see if anyone has done an actual statistical correlation between Combine scores and NFL success/failure.

You hear of the "busts" Mandarich, Mamula, Gholston, etc., but rarely hear of the antithesis.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

Because how else would Mel Kiper have bogus filler material like talking about how Linderbaum’s arms are 1/2” too short so he’s gonna drop three rounds because of it?

What's funny about that is he's a Baltimore guy and was saying how much he loves the fit with him being there. They just have to come up with things to talk about.