A guy leaving early who is only boarderline NBA at best is a small excuse. But to me it's only an excuse for having a slightly worse season than we would have if Cook would have stayed. It's not enough of an excuse to miss the tournament altogether.
A guy leaving early who is only boarderline NBA at best is a small excuse. But to me it's only an excuse for having a slightly worse season than we would have if Cook would have stayed. It's not enough of an excuse to miss the tournament altogether.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
So, we have a kid that is a 4-star, Top 100 recruit, and he will be battling a former walk-on for "spot minutes?" Jesus. If Patrick's last name were Jones, I think this Board would have a whole different take on him. I am very confident that Patrick will at least play Baer's role/minutes this upcoming season, and I am cautiously optimistic he will develop into even more than that as the season progresses.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
Love this post N8.
The lineup, at least to start the year, will be:
Connor/JT
Bakari/Fredrick
Wieskamp/Patrick
Nunge/Pemsl
Garza/Kriener
All the 4's and 5's are interchangeable. I think Baraki starts at the 2 with his experience and Fredrick gets starter minutes as the first man off the bench. Fredrick and JT may force Fran's hand to start them if they are obviously superior early (and I think they might be). Till will be the 3rd guy at the 3 and 4, definitely behind Pat since Pat has been confirmed as playing this season. A top 100 guy would never sit behind a former walk-on, especially as a coaches son.
I have very few concerns about regression this year as I think there's a toughness to these lineups that was missing a few years ago but has really developed since.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
N8, I agree with your starting line-up. That is highly likely to be the team that starts the season for all the reasons you noted, but I also agree that the 1-3 positions are highly susceptible to change as the new guys show what they have during early games.
However, my best line-up, is JT, JW sliding over to the 2, Patrick at the 3, Nunge, Garza. You have speed and tough defense at the point. Two loooong perimeter players that can score in a variety of ways, and length and size inside. Think how long that team is on defense. You won't drive by JT, and not too many PGs in this league are going to consistently shoot over him. If you can get by the two perimeter players, you will be running into the trees with trees on your hip.
However, my best line-up, is JT, JW sliding over to the 2, Patrick at the 3, Nunge, Garza. You have speed and tough defense at the point. Two loooong perimeter players that can score in a variety of ways, and length and size inside. Think how long that team is on defense. You won't drive by JT, and not too many PGs in this league are going to consistently shoot over him. If you can get by the two perimeter players, you will be running into the trees with trees on your hip.
JG10Hawk
Well-Known Member
Barring any unforeseen circumstances, I expect this team to be dancing or at the very least be solidly on the bubble. While there are some unknowns at the guard spots, there is just way too much returning experience at the 3-5 spots to expect this team to not at least repeat similar success as last season.
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
Each person is entitled to their own opinion, but time and time again recruiting rankings have proven to be an inexact science. For what it’s worth I think DJ Carton is overrated as well.
How about a story. Remember the name Malik Williams? He was a 5 star recruit Iowa was sitting well with in the Garza class. He ended up choosing Louisville. As a freshman he averaged 3.8 points per game on an average Louisville team. Last year up to 7.7 points. Basically he’s been a role player for the last two years and he was considered a top 25 5 star recruit!
To me, Pat just needs time to fill out his frame and continue to improve his jumpshot. If that happens he can reach his potential and the reason he was ranked as high as he was. That might take some time. At his size I don’t think it will happen this year, regardless of what his name is.
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
I would disagree that all the 4s and 5s are interchangeable, especially from a defensive perspective. I would actually argue that Nunge is the only big we have that is really suited to guard opposing 4 men.
The way basketball is going 4 men can step outside shoot it and handle the ball and move their feet. Iggy Bradzegnis was Michigan’s 4 last year. Lamar Stevens plays the 4 for Penn State. Pemsl and Kriener really don’t have the footspeed to have a chance to cover those type of guys, which would force Iowa into zone. The only problem with that is they would have to guard one of the corners in a zone and if you give up baseline penetration you’re basically toast in a zone.
Now with the makeup of our roster of course Pemsl or Kriener is going to be asked to play some at the 4, but hopefully it’s for shorter spurts or in the right matchups because I don’t think they are ideal defenders at the 4 spot.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
21, look if you want to ignore the rankings, feel free. I get that it is inexact, but its also like 70% of what we do around here.
In any event, watch the tape, the kid has length, a shot, and athleticism. He is not coming in to play the post, he is coming in as a perimeter player. 3s at the college level aint backing their opponents down the lane and dunking on them. Pat will be just fine. It may take some time to adjust to the college game, but this tired argument that he is too skinny to play will be proven wrong.
My main problem was that your post was not what you were hoping for, but what you were predicting. If you think Till will best Patrick for "spot minutes" this season, well I would be willing to wager hefty dollars that prediction will not come true. Or, we can wager pride and check back in late January to see who was right.
In any event, watch the tape, the kid has length, a shot, and athleticism. He is not coming in to play the post, he is coming in as a perimeter player. 3s at the college level aint backing their opponents down the lane and dunking on them. Pat will be just fine. It may take some time to adjust to the college game, but this tired argument that he is too skinny to play will be proven wrong.
My main problem was that your post was not what you were hoping for, but what you were predicting. If you think Till will best Patrick for "spot minutes" this season, well I would be willing to wager hefty dollars that prediction will not come true. Or, we can wager pride and check back in late January to see who was right.
I think the ideal rotation would be Nunge/Pemsl at the 4 and Garza/Kriener at the 5. I do think that Pemsl is suited to guard the 4, at least more so than Kriener and Garza. His footwork is quick and smart. However, I think we will play a lot of zone still (at least until Pat puts on enough muscle to defend 4's in this league) and that Nunge would be a monster blocking shots at the 5 in a 1-3-1 with his added weight and length.
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
First off I was not the poster who said Till would play over Pat.
Secondly I’m not disregarding the rankings. It plays a factor along with a handful of other things (which I’d be happy to discuss). In Pat’s case we didn’t see an offer sheet obviously because everyone knew he’d play for his dad.
To me right now Pat has height and athleticism along with a good handle. If you look at his jump shot it’s very slow and his release is fairly low. That plays against 6 foot kids from Iowa, but won’t likely play against B1G wing players. Look at where he did the majority of his scoring at the HS level. It was layups and close range shots. Sorry but he’s not going to be getting a lot of those looks at the B1G level.
Now do I think he can be a nice energy guy off the bench this year? Sure he can probably get a few blocks, steals, make some plays in transition, and hit an open look. But do I expect him to make an instant impact like say a Cook, Garza, or Wieskamp did as freshman next year?.... ABSOLUTELY NOT
With that said if it all comes together for him with the jump shot and added strength, down the road I do think he can be a very high quality player.
Northside Hawk
Well-Known Member
So that's why Moss transferred. He would really be confused on where to set his feet.
BigD
Well-Known Member
Man I like it when posters state the obvious. Of course we want the best case scenario, but I think your post is dead on. It will be difficult for freshmen players to come in and make an immediate and strong impact. Take them out of the question and what do we have at the point guard position? Yikes!! If Joe can play point then that could be our best bet until the freshmen develop. I do think our post play will be slightly above average for Iowa but slightly below average as far as B1G standards are concern. I think we struggle to make NIT and finish somewhere between ninth and twelfth in the conference. If JBo makes an unexpected recovery and plays then that would make a B1G difference and I jump us up as high as fifth to eight place in the conference. Nunge could be an X factor that the team could build around along with Joe. If those two can excel and the new guards at least play good defense then that changes the chemistry in a major way. That’s a lot of if’s and but’s though.
SomersHawk
Well-Known Member
Connor/JT
Bakari/Fredrick
Wieskamp/Patrick
Nunge/Pemsl
Garza/Kriener
I tend to be overly optimistic until proven wrong, but as I look at this lineup I see a ton of EXPERIENCED pretty dam good players with Garza and Wieskamp all BIG. Both 1st year players are going to contribute and thinking Joe T is gonna more than hold his own once he settles in. I am not seeing anyone on there that looks to be a liability when on the floor from the things that we have seen and heard about them. Lots of capable scorers and I predict we will see 7 different players have a 20 point game at some point. Expecting to see better defense, better offensive flow, and more sustained effort.Really looking forward to seeing an almost new team loaded with potential and how it all comes together.
No worse than 5th BIG and dancing again with a win over Izzo mixed in!
Bakari/Fredrick
Wieskamp/Patrick
Nunge/Pemsl
Garza/Kriener
I tend to be overly optimistic until proven wrong, but as I look at this lineup I see a ton of EXPERIENCED pretty dam good players with Garza and Wieskamp all BIG. Both 1st year players are going to contribute and thinking Joe T is gonna more than hold his own once he settles in. I am not seeing anyone on there that looks to be a liability when on the floor from the things that we have seen and heard about them. Lots of capable scorers and I predict we will see 7 different players have a 20 point game at some point. Expecting to see better defense, better offensive flow, and more sustained effort.Really looking forward to seeing an almost new team loaded with potential and how it all comes together.
No worse than 5th BIG and dancing again with a win over Izzo mixed in!
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The 2 times Fran started a freshman at point guard we were one of the first teams out of the tournament. Both times there were literally no other options for point. This year we have two other options for point. We also have the best scoring center in 30 years at Iowa and a player who will be an all time great at Iowa as long as he stays long enough (might not be at all time great level this year tho, but close). If Joe T starts, he will have earned it. Especially considering he would be starting over Connor, and Fran would probably lean towards starting his more experienced son if it was even close.
I'm leaning towards this too. The cool thing is the entire team will be back the next year sans Kriener. Hopefully it pans out better than it did last year where we had pretty much everyone back and ended up losing 4 of our top 6.
NikeHawk21
Well-Known Member
Evelyn only has one year of eligibility. At this point I’d have to put Wieskamp at 50/50 at best based on quotes I’ve heard from him. I’m not sure how many kids go through the pre draft process twice and still return to school. I’ve mentioned elsewhere I wouldn’t be surprised if this is Pemsl’s last year in black and gold.
