deanvogs
Well-Known Member
That is the first thing I thought as well (handing the ball to the ref). Also one would think that not only that, but I would tell the refs, I'm gonna down the ball in the middle of the field and hand the ball to you.
Wisconsin clearly fumbled on the last play
- Thread starter Wadegarret
- Start date
That is the first thing I thought as well (handing the ball to the ref). Also one would think that not only that, but I would tell the refs, I'm gonna down the ball in the middle of the field and hand the ball to you.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
Maybe you missed the whole controversy. This is why you kick it from where you are at:
Bizarre ending to Wisconsin-Arizona State - YouTube
hawkfan340
Well-Known Member
This is like arguing that WRs shouldn't block down field because Clint Solomon got flagged for a facemask whilst getting his own head ripped off in the Outback Bowl. Sometimes the proper strategy gets blown up due to some moron failing beyond all belief. It doesn't mean the strategy was wrong, it just means a moron got in the way.
Expecting a ref to spot the ball within 16 seconds is completely reasonable. It's almost mind boggling they could screw up so badly, hence the official Pac-12 reprimand.
tm3308
Well-Known Member
Especially when they spend 13 games a year keeping Oregon running like a well-oiled machine.
thejumper5
Well-Known Member
Question for all of those saying Wisconsin shouldn't have tried to make that play in the final 18 seconds and should have kicked from the right hash:
If it had been a long field goal, say 50+ yards, and Wisconsin had tried to gain more advantageous vertical position because their kicker struggles from that distance, would you have claimed that they were making a mistake and should have just kicked from long distance instead of risking a once in a generation referee mistake?
If you think Wisconsin should try to advance the ball vertically one more time in my hypothetical situation, why do you disagree with Wisconsin's attempt to move the ball horizontally in the real game?
Finally, given my hypotheticals and the belief that Wisconsin made a mistake Saturday, would you argue that Iowa, after taking a timeout down by 1 point, should have attempted a 56-yard game winning field goal with 12 seconds left vs. Wisconsin in 2010?
If it had been a long field goal, say 50+ yards, and Wisconsin had tried to gain more advantageous vertical position because their kicker struggles from that distance, would you have claimed that they were making a mistake and should have just kicked from long distance instead of risking a once in a generation referee mistake?
If you think Wisconsin should try to advance the ball vertically one more time in my hypothetical situation, why do you disagree with Wisconsin's attempt to move the ball horizontally in the real game?
Finally, given my hypotheticals and the belief that Wisconsin made a mistake Saturday, would you argue that Iowa, after taking a timeout down by 1 point, should have attempted a 56-yard game winning field goal with 12 seconds left vs. Wisconsin in 2010?
thejumper5
Well-Known Member
Another question for those saying Wisconsin made a mistake by trying that play and leaving the game "in the hands of the officials":
Should Iowa have run the ball one more time with Shonn Greene to center it for the game winning field goal against PSU in '08? There were only 11 seconds on the clock when that play started, and Iowa had the ball at the 16-yard line. They called timeout with only 6 seconds to play. What if the officials had made a huge error like failing to acknowledge Iowa's attempt to call time out? What if the officials had allowed the clock to run out? How could Iowa have taken that risk?
Should Iowa have run the ball one more time with Shonn Greene to center it for the game winning field goal against PSU in '08? There were only 11 seconds on the clock when that play started, and Iowa had the ball at the 16-yard line. They called timeout with only 6 seconds to play. What if the officials had made a huge error like failing to acknowledge Iowa's attempt to call time out? What if the officials had allowed the clock to run out? How could Iowa have taken that risk?
A
alexzelada
Guest
Did you watch the video? (95% of the thread viewers likely didn't) The announcers basically predicted what was about to happen. They also said he didn't take a knee which adds to the idea that confusion was everywhere. Rule #1: At crunch time expect Murphy's law to be invoked. Thus, take the safe journey instead of the clever one.
A
alexzelada
Guest
To answer your question. If they had taken our advice they would've won the game. But they took your advice and lost the game. But you're arguing your advice is better. Thus you are arguing losing is better. Can you see the problem with that?
tm3308
Well-Known Member
You don't know that Wisconsin would have won if they'd taken your advice. The fact that what Wisconsin did failed, doesn't mean it was wrong.
Say you have 2 choices. One has a 75% chance of success while the other has a 50% chance (not saying these percentages represent Wisconsin's choices, but the principle applies). You choose the 75% choice and it doesn't work. That doesn't mean the 50% option was better.
A
alexzelada
Guest
You're at war with truth and common sense. And you're losing.
tm3308
Well-Known Member
Nobody expects it to take over 10 seconds to get the ball ready for play (especially in that situation), hence the reprimand from the conference. Wisconsin took what should have been a very reasonable risk in that situation.
A
alexzelada
Guest
I just exchanged some late night texts (he's big into twitter and texting
) with Kirk Ferentz. He said he would've kicked the field goal with 18 seconds to go. I'll let the audience decide whether that makes Wisky right or wrong.
) with Kirk Ferentz. He said he would've kicked the field goal with 18 seconds to go. I'll let the audience decide whether that makes Wisky right or wrong.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
If you have a TO left, by all means run a play. How can you even compare the two? The opponents can't keep you from calling a TO, but they can keep you from lining up and running another play. They could lay on Greene for 10 min., but as soon soon as the play is whistled dead, you can call TO.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
Kicking a FG when you are out of range is a bad idea. Kicking a FG when you are in range is a good idea.
Like I said, all things equal, there is plenty of time to run a play, spot the ball, and spike it. All things are not equal at the end of the game. Like someone else said, listen to the announcer, there are several bad things that can happen by running that play. The real question is, why take the risk when you are already in chip shot range?
JonDMiller
Publisher/Founder
This post made me laugh out loud. I came to say that the QB knee was down..I read the OP, then saw the very first response with the screen shot. LOL. end of thread right there
lightning1
Well-Known Member
blubberhawk
Well-Known Member
So losing at ASU by two points in a game they should have won makes Wisc. a bad team?
What about Michigan?
MSU?
You want to laugh at a league, how about starting with the Big 12?
K-State losing at home to an FBS team. ISU losing at home to an FBS team and then to Iowa. Texas getting their *** handed to them by everyone they play. Kansas losing to Rice. West Virginia losing at home by 50 to Oregon.
hawkfan2679
Well-Known Member
To the bold...no, they can't. I thought that was already brought up once within this thread. It's delay of game on the defense. To suggest that Wisconsin should have accounted for the ref's incompetence that, by all accounts that I've heard, no one had ever even been witness to before, is somewhat silly.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
The refs not enforcing the rules is only one of the things that could have gone wrong there. You also have a fumbled snap, or a fumble by the QB would lose the game for Wisconsin. If an offensive player would get injured, that is a clock run off with no TO. A penalty by the offense would have meant a loss as well.
Sure the officials should make the correct calls. All I am saying is that it was a p!ss poor coaching decision to bring all of those things into play, just to center the ball for a chip shot FG
