Press Release on Gary Dolphin Suspension

[PCHawk]

Can the discussion take place without the people talking about the topic being couched lbeing liberal or conservative?

And I’m not picking on you? I’m talking to everybody one here.

Ok this makes more sense now. You were referring to a couple posts who mentioned that. I thought you meant the entire topic, which had me really confused.

 

[FRANAMANIAC]

But you can never control how overly sensitive someone is. If one person seriously got offended by you saying "how are you" would you truly quit saying that to others, knowing full well that fryowa had an oversensitive problem? Or would you say "sorry you're so sensitive man" and go on living your life.

Now clearly the King Kong thing is one ring higher on the insensitivingy ladder than "hi how are you", but the point remains. When is saying something that can be contrived as insensitive a you problem or a their problem? There is a lot of grey area there.

I think if someone can be offended by what Gary said because they know King Kong is closer to an ape than anything else and black people can be called apes, it's a you problem. There isnt enough time in the day to try to conform to those standards. Why would I even want to? That said, I'm a nice guy so I would say "sorry man" and laugh at them behind their back later.

I see what you're saying. It's a good point. And as far as apologizing and laughing about it later.... so long as you werent laughing with the intention of hurting anyone, or you werent doing it in a highly visible platform (news, social media, etc), then I dont think there's anything wrong with that.

I'm mainly speaking out against the people doubling down and saying there was literally 0 problem with what he said. Do I think it's a big deal? Nah, but I do think that it was problematic. I honestly think the UI has shot themselves in the foot here suspending him, its a really bad PR move. B/c now the debate almost has to reach this point.

 

[99topdawg]

My thing is that now people are trying to overcorrect problems.

This right here is the problem with the Dolph situation and society in general.

 

[Fryowa]

But you can never control how overly sensitive someone is. If one person seriously got offended by you saying "how are you" would you truly quit saying that to others, knowing full well that fryowa had an oversensitive problem? Or would you say "sorry you're so sensitive man" and go on living your life.

Now clearly the King Kong thing is one ring higher on the insensitivingy ladder than "hi how are you", but the point remains. When is saying something that can be contrived as insensitive a you problem or a their problem? There is a lot of grey area there.

I think if someone can be offended by what Gary said because they know King Kong is closer to an ape than anything else and black people can be called apes, it's a you problem. There isnt enough time in the day to try to conform to those standards. Why would I even want to? That said, I'm a nice guy so I would say "sorry man" and laugh at them behind their back later.

It goes back to intent versus perception.

There is nothing to apologize for if there was no ill intent. Whether someone feels there is or not.

Then you have the SJWs like @FRANAMANIAC crying foul for attention, like an ambulance chaser of people ‘s commentary

 

[FRANAMANIAC]

I’m talking about your SJW ilk in general. You knew that, but yet you still deflect and avoid the point.

Well to me, I think the term SJW is loaded in of itself...

So assuming you are talking about people who are social justice oriented, yes its true some of them are a little pushy in how they interact online, but the same could be said of some hardcore people of the opposing side to that, its not a one way street. I mean you yourself were raging about how you hated me and stuff. Not saying you intended or meant it, but you did type it out.

Do you think I like running into people who yell "SNOWFLAKE" AND "LIBTARD" OR "SOFT" at me? I dont like it anymore than you do at people who cry racist or bullier.

 

[FRANAMANIAC]

It was meant as a compliment. I'm not sure how it could possibly be insensitive. I would like to know who reported it, and what their motives were. I have asked people I know of all races including women who hadn't heard about the story and I haven't found anyone yet who thinks "that was racist" or "that was insensitive" The conversation has been more "sounds like that guy is a beast on the boards".
My point is, we've gone way too far with this one. I don't think he has anything to apologize for. He used a movie reference about a big strong monster to describe a guy who had a great game rebounding. But this world is full of fake outrage these days, so I expect nothing less.

A compliment can be insensitive, thats the point i'm trying to make. I dont think Dolph meant it in any negative way.

I'm just saying that people should recognize there is a connotation with referring to black players as primates, thats all. Im not asking for anyone's head, not asking for anyone to be fired, just for people to say "oh, I see how that could bother someone."

 

[RobHowe]

Here’s a good article with Ali apologizing to Frazier for comments that hurt the latter:

LINK

I’m not saying this is a parallel to this case with Dolph. Having known Gary for 22 years, I do not believe it was a racist comment.

 

[PCHawk]

I see what you're saying. It's a good point. And as far as apologizing and laughing about it later.... so long as you werent laughing with the intention of hurting anyone, or you werent doing it in a highly visible platform (news, social media, etc), then I dont think there's anything wrong with that.

I'm mainly speaking out against the people doubling down and saying there was literally 0 problem with what he said. Do I think it's a big deal? Nah, but I do think that it was problematic. I honestly think the UI has shot themselves in the foot here suspending him, its a really bad PR move. B/c now the debate almost has to reach this point.

I gotta say, even tho I think your beliefs are really bad and dont agree with them at all, you at least have a well thought out side and articulate it well. It's crazy to me that someone can still think that way after putting any thought into it, but to each their own I guess.

 

[FRANAMANIAC]

It goes back to intent versus perception.

There is nothing to apologize for if there was no ill intent. Whether someone feels there is or not.

Then you have the SJWs like @FRANAMANIAC crying foul for attention, like an ambulance chaser of people ‘s commentary

Yes, I only say what I say for attention. Wow you've figured me out. How am I supposed to even have a rational discussion with you with you dropping stuff like that on me.

If anything my whole time here i've been consistent in saying I dont think he should have been suspended etc.

 

[FRANAMANIAC]

I gotta say, even tho I think your beliefs are really bad and dont agree with them at all, you at least have a well thought out side and articulate it well. It's crazy to me that someone can still think that way after putting any thought into it, but to each their own I guess.

I appreciated the level headed discussion. I know my ideas are pretty against the grain.

 

[CP87]

Bullshit AGAIN!!!

If Dolph said it as a compliment to the guy being a beast of a basketball player, then it's exactly the same as my example.

You're entire sham of a premise is the straw man here!

Goddammit man, people like you are just so insufferable to listen to and deal with. You make fucked up nonsensical arguments, and then when anyone disagrees with them you turn tail, yell "RACIST!" or "BULLIER!" and try to flip it on the other person.

I'm only 38 so I haven't lived a long full life like a lot of people here, but I'm pretty confident when I say that you'd be better off in all aspects of your life if you get rid of your pathetic, fake-victim view of the world and see things for what they are. Stop looking for someone to blame because ther's no one there.

@FRANAMANIAC has been nothing but thoughtful and articulate on the subject at hand. He is not calling anyone a racist, he has been very open-minded to others' ideas. I am not sure why the attacks are necessary.

I think the Dolphin suspension for this is ridiculous. I also think that IN GENERAL we should care if our words/actions negatively affects others. In the Dolphin case, I don't think we have any evidence that his words hurt anyone.

Now that doesn't mean that I say something, Person A is upset, I am automatically a bad person and need to apologize. Look at it on a situational basis. I have to ask myself, if I was Person A in this case, would I feel upset? How does Person A's background influence how they interpret this situation vs. how I interpret this situation?

Sometimes Person A is just being an oversensitive asshole (especially if Person A is getting offended on behalf of another group of people who don't seem to have taken any particular offense at all). Then you just move on with your life.

But sometimes Person A has a point. And I can learn, and I can be a better human being in my interactions with Person A in the future. Win-win.

p.s. - I love Beth Mowins

 

[RobHowe]

Yes, I only say what I say for attention. Wow you've figured me out. How am I supposed to even have a rational discussion with you with you dropping stuff like that on me.

If anything my whole time here i've been consistent in saying I dont think he should have been suspended etc.

I’m not taking sides here, but you have handled yourself well in this discussion.

Civility is important when trying to exchange ideas and make points.

The yelling and name calling serves no purpose.

 

[CP87]

Shit, I just remembered that calling an African American articulate is racist because finding it notable enough to point out infers that African Americans are normally not articulate. I will go sit in the corner.

 

[DJL]

A compliment can be insensitive, thats the point i'm trying to make. I dont think Dolph meant it in any negative way.

I'm just saying that people should recognize there is a connotation with referring to black players as primates, thats all. Im not asking for anyone's head, not asking for anyone to be fired, just for people to say "oh, I see how that could bother someone."

But was it offensive to some white guy who wants to appear to be fighting the good fight, or did this come from somebody else? I think that's a fair question. The black people I know can't see it, or say that anyone who would think that is probably the real racist. I admit I have a small circle of black friends, so that's why I'm legitimately asking where the complaint came from.

 

[FRANAMANIAC]

also not trying to stir anyone up, but I think its really sad about the state of affairs in our lives that Jim Boeheim literally killed someone driving and is still coaching but Gary Dolphin was suspended for an insensitive comment.

Or maybe it just shows you that this isnt really so much about anything poltical, outside of office politics (ie. boosters/admin/barta)

 

[CP87]

I’m not taking sides here, but you have handled yourself well in this discussion.

Civility is important when trying to exchange ideas and make points.

The yelling and name calling serves no purpose.

I know you probably can't, but I would love to see you pick a side (not in Fry vs. Franamaniac, but in UI athletics vs. Dophin). You have to think this is ridiculous as well, right? Jon is pretty fired up on Twitter.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

What vocal minority? NOBODY WAS TALKING ABOUT THIS BEFORE TODAY!

It's the ever so minor group of decision makers....

 

[FRANAMANIAC]

Shit, I just remembered that calling an African American articulate is racist because finding it notable enough to point out infers that African Americans are normally not articulate. I will go sit in the corner.

Haha you're fine man, at least you thought about it. I didnt even think of that when I read your post, I appreciated the comment. Just shows that we all have blindspots, myself included!

 

[theboat]

I see what you're saying. It's a good point. And as far as apologizing and laughing about it later.... so long as you werent laughing with the intention of hurting anyone, or you werent doing it in a highly visible platform (news, social media, etc), then I dont think there's anything wrong with that.

I'm mainly speaking out against the people doubling down and saying there was literally 0 problem with what he said. Do I think it's a big deal? Nah, but I do think that it was problematic. I honestly think the UI has shot themselves in the foot here suspending him, its a really bad PR move. B/c now the debate almost has to reach this point.

Interesting coming from a person who is calling someone a maniac with their screen name.

 

[FRANAMANIAC]

Interesting coming from a person who is calling someone a maniac with their screen name.

I am a little disappointed in my screen name, but I havent found any way to change it? I made it well before I was so concerned about my language and how it affects others.

You do raise a good point about ableism in our language.