Nunge Rumor

ohhawk said:
On a side note (aren't 80% of posts as of late)...........looked like tOSU and SDSt both employed the "Iowa Defense" in this afternoon's Tourney game. Could have sworn that was Iowa out there defending the 3 on both ends of the court. 71 total three point attempts........most uncontested.
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I watched the first half of the Arizona-Buff game and thought Az's defense reminded me of Iowa's, giving up the easy dribble-drive, poor help defense, etc. Sean Miller year after year gets the least out of his talent as any coach in America.
 
Northside Hawk said:
Too many players were playing too many minutes partially because there were no upperclassman to play those minutes. If you want to argue that the playing time and substitution patterns were poorly handled by coaching then you have an argument for this year and next. But I will stand by the potential of more than three of these players with another year of experience and what others in the conference lose.
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As I just said Garza, Nunge, Moss all have POTENTIAL. Yet unrealized potential happens all the time. I'm not confident that Fran understans how to use Nunge at all. Garza will do well, because he is a 5, plain and simple, Fran does know how to use them.
 
deanvogs said:
Nunge has some nice potential, but he is another 2 years from really getting there. He will be a nice piece as a Jr. and Sr, but I he has alot of work to do yet. Moss has some potential as well, but once again, he better start realizing some of it. Yet both of them, right now simply aren't good enough to play much on a good NCAA team.

Plus Nunge ultimate development might be determined by Fran. If he continues to think Nunge is a 3, just because he can shoot the 3 point shot, Nunge will develop even slower. He simply can't match up the other 3's at the B1G level, he isn't anywhere near quick enough to do so.
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Right now is the key phrase. They were thrown to the wolves this year. I totally agree with you there. Next year is different. They could make a huge leap forward. I also agree with you that Fran didn't and there's no guarantee that he will know how to use them. I explained that in the first reply to your post. Dean, it really sucks to be not playing right now, doesn't it. It's a bitch.
 
SteveGarvey1 said:
I watched the first half of the Arizona-Buff game and thought Az's defense reminded me of Iowa's, giving up the easy dribble-drive, poor help defense, etc. Sean Miller year after year gets the least out of his talent as any coach in America.
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I'm afraid Indiana got the wrong Miller. Archie could have them humming an a couple of years.
 
Getting back to the Nunge rumor, a few posts talked about how he should have redshirted. I agree that a redshirt would have helped this team, but that redshirt should have gone to Pemsl. He was recovering from surgery and rebuilding his body this offseason. For a guy who already knew how to play in the Big at a high level, putting him out there before he had a chance to pack the muscle back on was ill advised. It would have opened up minutes for Nunge at the 4 and 5 while potentially giving Kriener more leash to develop his game. Then it would give us a redshirt senior at the 4 for 2 years after Cook is gone (I'm pretty convinced Cook will leave after next year, his game just needs a couple tweaks). That would have fixed the logjam in the front court and helped for the future. The problems at the guard situation wouldn't have been solved, but if we're going to have a bad year, we might as well make the most of it.
 
N8theGr8 said:
Getting back to the Nunge rumor, a few posts talked about how he should have redshirted. I agree that a redshirt would have helped this team, but that redshirt should have gone to Pemsl. He was recovering from surgery and rebuilding his body this offseason. For a guy who already knew how to play in the Big at a high level, putting him out there before he had a chance to pack the muscle back on was ill advised. It would have opened up minutes for Nunge at the 4 and 5 while potentially giving Kriener more leash to develop his game. Then it would give us a redshirt senior at the 4 for 2 years after Cook is gone (I'm pretty convinced Cook will leave after next year, his game just needs a couple tweaks). That would have fixed the logjam in the front court and helped for the future. The problems at the guard situation wouldn't have been solved, but if we're going to have a bad year, we might as well make the most of it.
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Cordell's situation has been discussed. He may have been more effective when he weighed 250 and could get position in the post by sticking his rear end into someone. He didnt seem as strong this year. He was getting moved around and getting the ball stripped from him. You mentioned the off-season surgery and lack of summer workouts. Redsirting could have been a possibility, especially whan medical was involved.
In retrospect it was a no brainer. I also wonder how much that leg gash at Hilton affected him, from practice time to his history of leg problems.
 
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Northside Hawk said:
Cordell's situation has been discussed. He may have been more effective when he weighed 250 and could get position in the post by sticking his rear end into someone. He didnt seem as strong this year. He was getting moved around and getting the ball stripped from him. You mentioned the off-season surgery and lack of summer workouts. Redsirting could have been a possibility. In retrospect it was a no brainer. I also wonder how much that leg gash at Hilton affected him, from practice time to his history of leg problems.
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If it's still affecting him, or he hasn't been able to get his weight/strength up due to playing all year, a redshirt may still do him good. It may also give him a chance to add a jumper. He has a pretty good looking stroke from the free throw line that really improved year over year.

The other main benefit being that it guarantees Nunge playing time and adds Pemsl to the roster in years when we'll need him more. I think Fran will use Nunge better when he's the best option available at his natural position, the 4. With an offseason of getting stronger, I think he becomes the first man off the bench for Cook because he'll potentially be the best option at the 4 by the end of the season (and I'm still crossing my fingers that he'll get looks at the 5 becoming the next Kaminsky). All this to say that unless he feels he's on a sinking ship, he'll be back and play a huge role going forward.
 
deanvogs said:
As I just said Garza, Nunge, Moss all have POTENTIAL. Yet unrealized potential happens all the time. I'm not confident that Fran understans how to use Nunge at all. Garza will do well, because he is a 5, plain and simple, Fran does know how to use them.
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Heard a rumor tonight Pemsl is looking around.... unhappy with playing time.
 
deanvogs said:
As I just said Garza, Nunge, Moss all have POTENTIAL. Yet unrealized potential happens all the time. I'm not confident that Fran understans how to use Nunge at all. Garza will do well, because he is a 5, plain and simple, Fran does know how to use them.
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Garza will do well IMO because he seems highly motivated and comes from a family that knows basketball. I haven't seen enough to make me think that Fran knows how to develop big men. Woodbury came in as a defensive specialist and while not having the offensive skills that Garza has he never really developed his game beyond that much. I thought Olesani never really developed that much either for a guy that seemed to have some real potential. Maybe Nunge after playing under Fran for a year has figured out that Fran may not use him in a way that will help him blossom.
 
Nunge certainly seemed to be playing out of position most of the season. Didn't have time to develop his footwork on the perimeter, or anything else for that matter. Wherever he played he needed much more time to gain actual on the floor experience.....

Last few games of the season without playing with the fear of being yanked off the floor for a poor play, he p!ayed very well around the basket, fighting for rebounds. Played much more comfortably and showed his potential ability and value to the team moving on.....

Hope the rumors are unfounded and he stays around.....

:cool:
 
N8theGr8 said:
If it's still affecting him, or he hasn't been able to get his weight/strength up due to playing all year, a redshirt may still do him good. It may also give him a chance to add a jumper. He has a pretty good looking stroke from the free throw line that really improved year over year.

The other main benefit being that it guarantees Nunge playing time and adds Pemsl to the roster in years when we'll need him more. I think Fran will use Nunge better when he's the best option available at his natural position, the 4. With an offseason of getting stronger, I think he becomes the first man off the bench for Cook because he'll potentially be the best option at the 4 by the end of the season (and I'm still crossing my fingers that he'll get looks at the 5 becoming the next Kaminsky). All this to say that unless he feels he's on a sinking ship, he'll be back and play a huge role going forward.
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The coaches wanted him to lose the weight. It had nothing to do with the grind of the season. But even at 235 or whatever he played at how many times did you see him run the court and fill a lane on the break. The weight loss was supposed to make him quicker and make him less prone to hernias and other nagging lower body injuries. I don't know what direction they're going to go with him now.
 
hawkeyemark said:
Garza will do well IMO because he seems highly motivated and comes from a family that knows basketball. I haven't seen enough to make me think that Fran knows how to develop big men. Woodbury came in as a defensive specialist and while not having the offensive skills that Garza has he never really developed his game beyond that much. I thought Olesani never really developed that much either for a guy that seemed to have some real potential. Maybe Nunge after playing under Fran for a year has figured out that Fran may not use him in a way that will help him blossom.
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Woodbury and Olesani had limited offensive range. They were never going to be threats from seventeen feet, let alone three point range. They were more rim protectors.

Garza and Nunge are different birds entirely. They have already shown three point range. But they have a long way to go on the other end of the floor to match the defensive contributions of Adam or Gabe.
 
Northside Hawk said:
He was back home for spring break. I'm sure he's still very frustrated. I'm sure all of them still are.
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I enjoy Cordell’s passion and energy but he’s got to look in the mirror and realize there’s competition for minutes and quite frankly he made a lot of mistakes with the ball / decision making and especially on defense this past year. He does not play above the rim and his offensive game is limited to about 5 feet from the bucket. I think he got way more minutes than earned but that’s just me. If you rank the true 4’s he is clearly less talented and behind Cook & Nunge. He provides more offense than Wagner but far less defense so that’s a toss up too.

He spent the previous off season losing weight but added really nothing to his offensive skill set. He should have come back with a 12-15 foot jumper. Defenses really sagged off him anytime he was more than 7-8 feet from the basket as they know he has nothing outside of there. If he’s frustrated that’s on him.
 
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SpecialKHawk said:
I enjoy Cordell’s passion and energy but he’s got to look in the mirror and realize there’s competition for minutes and quite frankly he made a lot of mistakes with the ball / decision making and especially on defense this past year. He does not play above the rim and his offensive game is limited to about 5 feet from the bucket. I think he got way more minutes than earned but that’s just me. If you rank the true 4’s he is clearly less talented and behind Cook & Nunge. He provides more offense than Wagner but far less defense so that’s a toss up too.

He spent the previous off season losing weight but added really nothing to his offensive skillet. He should have come back with a 12-15 foot jumper. Defenses really sagged off him anytime he was 7-8 from the basket as they know he has nothing outside of there. If he’s frustrated that’s on him.
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All valid points. His weight, his role, physical or finesse, how much to work on his game in the off season vs surgery, it's all added up to one big ball of confusion for him. And yes it's on him. The key is whether or not he realizes it.
 
Northside Hawk said:
Woodbury and Olesani had limited offensive range. They were never going to be threats from seventeen feet, let alone three point range. They were more rim protectors.

Garza and Nunge are different birds entirely. They have already shown three point range. But they have a long way to go on the other end of the floor to match the defensive contributions of Adam or Gabe.
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Very good points raised here. I never cared whether Woodbury could hit from three or even if he could dunk like Tyler Cook and many fans never quite grasped his importance on the defensive end. I maybe have never seen a big man pass as well as he did and thought Fran never took advantage of that and always thought we would run the offense through him more than we did. I thought we would see a more complete all around player by the time both he and Olesani finished.

As you say Garza and Nunge both have the offensive game and I question whether Fran can get them to where we need them defensively unless they just work really hard on their own. Please prove me wrong Fran.
 
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This makes the most sense. It's unfortunate he wasn't able to carve out a role here and contribute at a desperately needed position. The question becomes, does Fran use this to resolve his "scholarship problem" and give Connor a scholarship, or does he use it to bring in another guard? It may be best all around option for Connor to remain without a scholarship so that he can still play baseball whenever he chooses and not count against Heller's total allotment.
 
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