Now Maryland has issues?!

I have always wondered if there was a personal choice made by the 13 players who got rhabdo - out late drinking, energy drinks, something stronger, etc...

If there.was, it is best that it didn't come to light. It could also explain Doyle's lack of punishment.

Purely conjecture, no inside info, and not starting rumors.
Yeah, all 13 players binged on Jägerbombs and DMT the night before a known intense workout. :confused:
 
Our coaches didn’t withhold water as punishment but it was only once a practice and they treated it like a reward. Not that I’m bashing my coaches (that was pretty much the culture everywhere in the 80s/90s) but it sucked and we had people get a little sick once in a while. They also kept the water in the tunnel leading out of the elementary school which was about 600 yards away. When it was water time we had to run to get it and run back.

When you go half a practice without any water, when you do finally get it you gorge yourself which isn’t good either. I remember an underclassman lineman one time, huge kid. He was way too out of shape to be playing football and three or four times I remeber him drinking about a half gallon of blue Gatorade and puking it right back up 5 mins later through his face mask. Of course he wasn’t allowed to go get more.
 
cincy, let me share a personal story with you. i used to live in Denver (Arvada) Colorado. If you live in CO you automatically start becoming active outside. I think there's something in the water.

Anyway, I used to run a lot. I was diagnosed with exercised induced asthma by my primary care physician. For a few years I was on albuterol and advair. In 2013, I decided to go to a respiratory expert. They put me through a battery of tests including inhaling varying levels of some chemical that they said if I had a negative reaction to would be confirmation of asthma. If I did not have any reaction, then I did not have asthma. It was guaranteed. I did not have a reaction. After further review they determined that I have chronic rhinitis. This means I have similar symptoms but I don't NEED to be on the albuterol and advair. Now, I only take albuterol as needed during allergy season.

perhaps, if you haven't had this level of testing you may want to and see if you can get off the inhaler. If you have and it's confirmed you have exercise induced asthma, then I hope this was an interesting story and you've learned something about ArvadaHawk. :)
I once learned something about running in Colorado.

It's not as easy as the Midwest if you're not acclimated.

I was the only one in our family who got any kind of altitude sickness on our trip. Jeez I was running at 8,000 ft elevation. How did I get altitude sickness?

It was a nice break from Midwest humidity, however. And those 50 degree mornings were mighty refreshing.
 
I once learned something about running in Colorado.

It's not as easy as the Midwest if you're not acclimated.

I was the only one in our family who got any kind of altitude sickness on our trip. Jeez I was running at 8,000 ft elevation. How did I get altitude sickness?

It was a nice break from Midwest humidity, however. And those 50 degree mornings were mighty refreshing.

oh, it doesn't take much. you can get it altitude sickness in Denver just climbing stairs; albeit more mildly. our bloods cells just want their damn oxygen.
 
I have always wondered if there was a personal choice made by the 13 players who got rhabdo - out late drinking, energy drinks, something stronger, etc...

If there.was, it is best that it didn't come to light. It could also explain Doyle's lack of punishment.

Purely conjecture, no inside info, and not starting rumors.

It's a reasonable thought. That exact workout had been done for years at the same time. So many possible factors, the one constant was the workout.
 
oh, it doesn't take much. you can get it altitude sickness in Denver just climbing stairs; albeit more mildly. our bloods cells just want their damn oxygen.
There's a freaking marathon that goes to the top of Pike 's Peak (over 14,000 foot elevation) and back down.

It's hard enough just to drive a vehicle up there.

And if my lungs somehow survived the incline my knees would take a severe beating coming back down.
 
Do you really think it's that implausible? Sure, we know better now as old, very wise sages. But 18-21 year old me was bulletproof.
Well, whatever happened, we certainly know it wasn't the coaches' fault. They always do it the right way. Just read any article from the last 2 days.

giphy.gif
 
Yeah...I remember those early August football practices. It didn't matter that they were early since it was always approaching 90 by 10:00am...we also had two a days once in awhile. It's crazy to think that water was held until the breaks. I remember the mad dash to the gatorade table and the water...it was crazy. I just remember thinking about water for the final 15 minutes of that first session and seriously wondering if I was going to make it.

If that is happening in this day and age...the coaches and trainers are flat out idiots. I'm questioning the trainers and coaches we had at this juncture.
 
Well, whatever happened, we certainly know it wasn't the coaches' fault. They always do it the right way. Just read any article from the last 2 days.

giphy.gif

Of course the coaches have to be held responsible. If they hadn't, they'd still be doing that workout. They do a lot right, but there's shortcomings....as you are here to keep us aware of. Personally, I appreciate it. :)
 
I have always wondered if there was a personal choice made by the 13 players who got rhabdo - out late drinking, energy drinks, something stronger, etc...

If there.was, it is best that it didn't come to light. It could also explain Doyle's lack of punishment.

Purely conjecture, no inside info, and not starting rumors.

When you train that hard, following up with the proper nutrients and supplements is critical... as well as avoiding things like alcohol and bad crap. (every workout is a mini-trauma to your body).

20 year-olds often think they're invincible and don't follow directions. Based on what I've heard from folks in IC, this has a lot to do with what happened.
 
Gester and Walker. You guys really need to read the the 18 page report on the rhabdo incident. You guys are perpetuating the falsehood that the affected players were somehow responsible. There are several passages that make it clear and actually dispel those rumors that the players were acting irresponsibly before and after the workouts. And drug tests on those players actually confirm this.

I realize that this was an "in-house" investigation but it is as good as we were going to get. It is still worth reading. I am convinced the players were 0% responsible.

This workout wasn't done for year(S) like some of you have falsely claimed. Only twice before ('04 and '07) and the timing of the 2011 workout was much different than the previous two and more likely to cause problems. 2004 was done in the summer and 2007 was done in December following only a one week layoff. 2011 followed a 3-week winter break and it was basically the first official workout thrown at them. That is NOT on the players.

A couple more points. There were three workout groups that day. There was a dispute between the first group (6:00 am) and the coaching staff. Some of the players claim they were not allowed to remove their hands from the squat bar thus preventing them from drinking water. Later groups don't report this. Later groups also had rhabdo victims. The committee investigating never could determine who was lying basically.

What is clear is that players were required to perform 100 back squats with 50% of their personal best weight. Players that were made to do more squats, because some weren't considered full or complete and thus not counted, were more likely to suffer from rhabdo. And smaller and more skilled players were more likely to suffer vs heavier athletes like lineman, leading some to believe it might be related to fast twitch muscle fibers and a difference in muscle breakdown etc.

I believe the commitee's findings that Doyle and others were not intentionally trying to hurt their players. He/they didn't know what the consequences might be and they didn't recognize or discounted the symptoms from the affected players in subsequent days. But when 13 of your athletes under your direct supervision are hospitalized due to a workout you designed, shouldn't you be suspended pending an investigation? At the very least? Instead you win an award? Those of you who believe big-time college athletics can't corrupt our officials here at Iowa need to think about that.

What IS interesting is how little Ferentz is mentioned in this report. I, along with many others, witnessed a clear lack of leadership from him. Many found his response and lack of communication to be utterly insufficient and shocking. Cowardly IMO. He often seems to be above the fray and not held accountable IMO.

Finally, I am really tired of the whole "players must be responsible" narrative. This has been going on for 7 years now! This from the report's summary:

"The 13 football players who were hospitalized were in no way responsible for their own injuries. In particular they did not take banned substances or engage in other risky behaviors."

You really need to read the full report and we can talk more if you want.

https://www.scribd.com/document/51390471/FinalReportonRhabdoincident
 
Last edited:
Gester and Walker. You guys really need to read the the 18 page report on the rhabdo incident. You guys are perpetuating the falsehood that the affected players were somehow responsible. There are several passages that make it clear and actually dispel those rumors that the players were acting irresponsibly before and after the workouts. And drug tests on those players actually confirm this.

I realize that this was an "in-house" investigation but it is a good as we were going to get. It is still worth reading. I am convinced the players were 0% responsible.

This workout wasn't done for year(S) like some of you have falsely claimed. Only twice before ('04 and '07) and the timing of the 2011 workout was much different than the previous two and more likely to cause problems. 2004 was done in the summer and 2007 was done in December following only a one week layoff. 2011 followed a 3-week winter break and it was basically the first official workout thrown at them. That is NOT on the players.

A couple more points. There were three workout groups that day. There was a dispute between the first group (6:00 am) and the coaching staff. Some of the players claim they were not allowed to take remove their hands from the squat bar thus preventing them from drinking water. Later groups don't report this. Later groups also had rhabdo victims. The committee investigating never could determine who was lying basically.

What is clear is that players were required to perform 100 back squats with 50% of their personal best weight. Players that were made to do more squats, because some weren't considered full or complete and thus not counted, were more likely to suffer from rhabdo. And smaller and more skilled players were more likely to suffer vs heavier athletes like lineman, leading some to believe it might be related to fast twitch muscle fibers and a difference in muscle breakdown etc.

I believe the commitee's findings that Doyle and others were not intentionally trying to hurt their players. He/they didn't know what the consequences might be and they didn't recognize or discounted the symptoms from the affected players in subsequent days. But when 13 of your athletes under your direct supervision are hospitalized due to a workout you designed, shouldn't you be suspended pending an investigation? At the very least? Instead you win an award? Those of you who believe big-time college athletics can't corrupt our officials here at Iowa need to think about that.

What IS interesting is how little Ferentz is mentioned in this report. I, along with many others, witnessed a clear lack of leadership from him. Many found his response and lack of communication to be utterly insufficient and shocking. Cowardly IMO. He often seems to be above the fray and not held accountable IMO.

Finally, I am really tired of the whole "players must be responsible" narrative. This has been going on for 7 years now! This from the report's summary:

"The 13 football players who were hospitalized were in no way responsible for their own injuries. In particular they did not take banned substances or engage in other risky behaviors."

You really need to read the full report and we can talk more if you want.

https://www.scribd.com/document/51390471/FinalReportonRhabdoincident

I believe the players were also using weights calculated from their pre-season maxes, which likely greatly over-prescribed considering max strength drops substantially during the season.

It was a mistake. My guess is that the coaches wanted it to suck as bad as possible to send a message after a season full of disappointments. They did not plan on anyone getting seriously hurt (negligence, but not gross negligence).

Iowa probably should have handled it differently at the time. But, we can't go back in time. I think lessons were learned, and Doyle's reputation among former players tells you all you need to know about his genuine concern for his athletes.
 
Gester and Walker. You guys really need to read the the 18 page report on the rhabdo incident. You guys are perpetuating the falsehood that the affected players were somehow responsible. There are several passages that make it clear and actually dispel those rumors that the players were acting irresponsibly before and after the workouts. And drug tests on those players actually confirm this.

I realize that this was an "in-house" investigation but it is a good as we were going to get. It is still worth reading. I am convinced the players were 0% responsible.

This workout wasn't done for year(S) like some of you have falsely claimed. Only twice before ('04 and '07) and the timing of the 2011 workout was much different than the previous two and more likely to cause problems. 2004 was done in the summer and 2007 was done in December following only a one week layoff. 2011 followed a 3-week winter break and it was basically the first official workout thrown at them. That is NOT on the players.

A couple more points. There were three workout groups that day. There was a dispute between the first group (6:00 am) and the coaching staff. Some of the players claim they were not allowed to take remove their hands from the squat bar thus preventing them from drinking water. Later groups don't report this. Later groups also had rhabdo victims. The committee investigating never could determine who was lying basically.

What is clear is that players were required to perform 100 back squats with 50% of their personal best weight. Players that were made to do more squats, because some weren't considered full or complete and thus not counted, were more likely to suffer from rhabdo. And smaller and more skilled players were more likely to suffer vs heavier athletes like lineman, leading some to believe it might be related to fast twitch muscle fibers and a difference in muscle breakdown etc.

I believe the commitee's findings that Doyle and others were not intentionally trying to hurt their players. He/they didn't know what the consequences might be and they didn't recognize or discounted the symptoms from the affected players in subsequent days. But when 13 of your athletes under your direct supervision are hospitalized due to a workout you designed, shouldn't you be suspended pending an investigation? At the very least? Instead you win an award? Those of you who believe big-time college athletics can't corrupt our officials here at Iowa need to think about that.

What IS interesting is how little Ferentz is mentioned in this report. I, along with many others, witnessed a clear lack of leadership from him. Many found his response and lack of communication to be utterly insufficient and shocking. Cowardly IMO. He often seems to be above the fray and not held accountable IMO.

Finally, I am really tired of the whole "players must be responsible" narrative. This has been going on for 7 years now! This from the report's summary:

"The 13 football players who were hospitalized were in no way responsible for their own injuries. In particular they did not take banned substances or engage in other risky behaviors."

You really need to read the full report and we can talk more if you want.

https://www.scribd.com/document/51390471/FinalReportonRhabdoincident
giphy.gif
 
What I don't get is why would any kid want to go play for this coaching staff? Yet Maryland's last two recruiting have been fairly highly rated

I thought the same thing, but then again, I doubt abusive coaching practices are part of the recruiting process. No current player is going to reveal this to recruits out of fear of retaliation and I doubt recruits are brought to summer conditioning camps.

That being said, their string of recruiting success will end with this report.
 
There's a freaking marathon that goes to the top of Pike 's Peak (over 14,000 foot elevation) and back down.

It's hard enough just to drive a vehicle up there.

And if my lungs somehow survived the incline my knees would take a severe beating coming back down.

so, so, SO amen to that!
 
I thought the same thing, but then again, I doubt abusive coaching practices are part of the recruiting process. No current player is going to reveal this to recruits out of fear of retaliation and I doubt recruits are brought to summer conditioning camps.

That being said, their string of recruiting success will end with this report.

I wondered about this too. But you always read from the recruits visiting Iowa that they really like the family atmosphere and that the players always mention how tight everyone is. You would think the Maryland players would have a difficult time endorsing this type of practice with visiting recruits and that they would pick up on that.
 
Gester and Walker. You guys really need to read the the 18 page report on the rhabdo incident. You guys are perpetuating the falsehood that the affected players were somehow responsible. There are several passages that make it clear and actually dispel those rumors that the players were acting irresponsibly before and after the workouts. And drug tests on those players actually confirm this.

I realize that this was an "in-house" investigation but it is a good as we were going to get. It is still worth reading. I am convinced the players were 0% responsible.

This workout wasn't done for year(S) like some of you have falsely claimed. Only twice before ('04 and '07) and the timing of the 2011 workout was much different than the previous two and more likely to cause problems. 2004 was done in the summer and 2007 was done in December following only a one week layoff. 2011 followed a 3-week winter break and it was basically the first official workout thrown at them. That is NOT on the players.

A couple more points. There were three workout groups that day. There was a dispute between the first group (6:00 am) and the coaching staff. Some of the players claim they were not allowed to take remove their hands from the squat bar thus preventing them from drinking water. Later groups don't report this. Later groups also had rhabdo victims. The committee investigating never could determine who was lying basically.

What is clear is that players were required to perform 100 back squats with 50% of their personal best weight. Players that were made to do more squats, because some weren't considered full or complete and thus not counted, were more likely to suffer from rhabdo. And smaller and more skilled players were more likely to suffer vs heavier athletes like lineman, leading some to believe it might be related to fast twitch muscle fibers and a difference in muscle breakdown etc.

I believe the commitee's findings that Doyle and others were not intentionally trying to hurt their players. He/they didn't know what the consequences might be and they didn't recognize or discounted the symptoms from the affected players in subsequent days. But when 13 of your athletes under your direct supervision are hospitalized due to a workout you designed, shouldn't you be suspended pending an investigation? At the very least? Instead you win an award? Those of you who believe big-time college athletics can't corrupt our officials here at Iowa need to think about that.

What IS interesting is how little Ferentz is mentioned in this report. I, along with many others, witnessed a clear lack of leadership from him. Many found his response and lack of communication to be utterly insufficient and shocking. Cowardly IMO. He often seems to be above the fray and not held accountable IMO.

Finally, I am really tired of the whole "players must be responsible" narrative. This has been going on for 7 years now! This from the report's summary:

"The 13 football players who were hospitalized were in no way responsible for their own injuries. In particular they did not take banned substances or engage in other risky behaviors."

You really need to read the full report and we can talk more if you want.

https://www.scribd.com/document/51390471/FinalReportonRhabdoincident

I'm not perpetuating anything. It was a bad deal, a black eye, poorly managed, poorly handled. I'm totally fine with the coaching staff being held accountable. I don't know exactly what happened, or why. Neither does anyone else. I don't blame the athletes that were affected, and its unfortunate as many may have forever lasting effects in some way or other.

2018 football cant come soon enough. Good grief.
 
Gester and Walker. You guys really need to read the the 18 page report on the rhabdo incident. You guys are perpetuating the falsehood that the affected players were somehow responsible. There are several passages that make it clear and actually dispel those rumors that the players were acting irresponsibly before and after the workouts. And drug tests on those players actually confirm this.

I realize that this was an "in-house" investigation but it is a good as we were going to get. It is still worth reading. I am convinced the players were 0% responsible.

This workout wasn't done for year(S) like some of you have falsely claimed. Only twice before ('04 and '07) and the timing of the 2011 workout was much different than the previous two and more likely to cause problems. 2004 was done in the summer and 2007 was done in December following only a one week layoff. 2011 followed a 3-week winter break and it was basically the first official workout thrown at them. That is NOT on the players.

A couple more points. There were three workout groups that day. There was a dispute between the first group (6:00 am) and the coaching staff. Some of the players claim they were not allowed to take remove their hands from the squat bar thus preventing them from drinking water. Later groups don't report this. Later groups also had rhabdo victims. The committee investigating never could determine who was lying basically.

What is clear is that players were required to perform 100 back squats with 50% of their personal best weight. Players that were made to do more squats, because some weren't considered full or complete and thus not counted, were more likely to suffer from rhabdo. And smaller and more skilled players were more likely to suffer vs heavier athletes like lineman, leading some to believe it might be related to fast twitch muscle fibers and a difference in muscle breakdown etc.

I believe the commitee's findings that Doyle and others were not intentionally trying to hurt their players. He/they didn't know what the consequences might be and they didn't recognize or discounted the symptoms from the affected players in subsequent days. But when 13 of your athletes under your direct supervision are hospitalized due to a workout you designed, shouldn't you be suspended pending an investigation? At the very least? Instead you win an award? Those of you who believe big-time college athletics can't corrupt our officials here at Iowa need to think about that.

What IS interesting is how little Ferentz is mentioned in this report. I, along with many others, witnessed a clear lack of leadership from him. Many found his response and lack of communication to be utterly insufficient and shocking. Cowardly IMO. He often seems to be above the fray and not held accountable IMO.

Finally, I am really tired of the whole "players must be responsible" narrative. This has been going on for 7 years now! This from the report's summary:

"The 13 football players who were hospitalized were in no way responsible for their own injuries. In particular they did not take banned substances or engage in other risky behaviors."

You really need to read the full report and we can talk more if you want.

https://www.scribd.com/document/51390471/FinalReportonRhabdoincident

Some of those "drinking" reports came from players. But...do you think players that drink the night before, especially those under legal age, would be completely forthcoming?

As to KF, he wasn't in town when it happened, IIRC, so I'm not sure what you expected in terms of him being "mentioned"...
 

Latest posts

Top