Loved the fight. We COULD learn a lot from it.

Hawkfnntn said:
Who were those against remind me? Context context context…
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NW and PSU, but what does that matter? Illinois beat Minny by a ton. We beat Illinois by similar. To lose to Minny the way we did, and with his mistakes? We literally were in a position to tie or get within one when he went on his damn "odyssey", or whatever the hell that was. The FT? Good Lord.

The only explanation I have is that either he wanted to throw the game...or Fran did...what with Minny being 1-point betting favorite and all...
 
NikeHawk21 said:
It’s basketball man. Our 1H effort sucked, I get that.

That Minnesota team won at Wisconsin. That Illinois team we wiped the floor with just beat Maryland.

Teams improve and find things out about themselves all the time.
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Good points. Still, the airball FT and coast-to-coast TO in the last couple minutes? The only way to learn from that is NOT put that person on the floor in crunch time. Which, like it or not, makes us less effective on offense because he does draw attention from defenders.
 
revkev73 said:
Tyler Cook, auditioning for the NBA draft. Sigh.

No jump shot, dribbles way too high, right hand only, turnover incubator, defensive liability. Doesn't make his teammates better.

Outstanding physical ability, with coaching, maturing, practice has potential. 2-3 years of solid, professional coaching.

Good future running mate for the Greek Freak
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That coast-to-coast TO was his defining moment. And it was not a "good" moment.
 
I think maybe Cook thought he was going to break Street's record if he made that free throw. It's not easy to purposely hit the front of the rim like Bohannon did.
 
hawkeyebob62 said:
That coast-to-coast TO was his defining moment. And it was not a "good" moment.
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Not the best way to showcase your NBA skills for a national audience.

I felt sorry for him, in spite of his selfish, ill-advised decisions.

There were several momentum killing decisions. Iowa had a real chance, then the door was slammed shut in a self-inflicted way.

Minnesota was reeling, but we bailed them out.
 
hawkeyebob62 said:
NW and PSU, but what does that matter? Illinois beat Minny by a ton. We beat Illinois by similar. To lose to Minny the way we did, and with his mistakes? We literally were in a position to tie or get within one when he went on his damn "odyssey", or whatever the hell that was. The FT? Good Lord.

The only explanation I have is that either he wanted to throw the game...or Fran did...what with Minny being 1-point betting favorite and all...
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Yeah it matters... NW and PSU aren't that good... We should have beaten them without Cook. Do you really thing more mins for Kreiner against MNs front line was going to help us? MN is a matchup nightmare for us and we are still a Jekle and Hyde team on the road. I'm pissed we lost the way we lost too don't get me wrong. But I'm not pissed that we lost if that makes sense.
Big picture wise losing at MN isn't a bad loss. It's not. But now we have to beat them at home. It'd have been really nice to steal that one but with how they were shooting along with getting offensive rebounds they earned it. Their 2nd half turnovers from our press having an effect was what got us back into it at all. Our D and rebounding has to improve if we look to win on the road it just does. Along with Cook realizing he's not LeBron James out there..
 
Hawkfnntn said:
Yeah it matters... NW and PSU aren't that good... We should have beaten them without Cook. Do you really thing more mins for Kreiner against MNs front line was going to help us? MN is a matchup nightmare for us and we are still a Jekle and Hyde team on the road. I'm pissed we lost the way we lost too don't get me wrong. But I'm not pissed that we lost if that makes sense.
Big picture wise losing at MN isn't a bad loss. It's not. But now we have to beat them at home. It'd have been really nice to steal that one but with how they were shooting along with getting offensive rebounds they earned it. Their 2nd half turnovers from our press having an effect was what got us back into it at all. Our D and rebounding has to improve if we look to win on the road it just does. Along with Cook realizing he's not LeBron James out there..
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I just don't see any way we beat Minnesota at home this year.
 
SidFarkas said:
Trust me, he is at a point of avg 5 tos a game. Some end up being live ball layups or spot threes - can’t have it -especially on the road when your not going to get calls.

Then, runouts from piss poor fade away one handed shots.

May score 18, but the above puts him in way negative efficiency space.
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How can we "trust you" when you are wrong? He averages 3.2 TOs per game. His box +/- is second highest among the starting 5 (behind only JW).
Box +/- for the season, for 9 man rotation highest to lowest per Sports Reference:
Baer +11.8
JW + 6.6
TC + 6.2
Kriener + 5.9
Moss + 5.8
Garza + 5.1
JBo + 3.7
CMac + 2.1
You (and anyone else) can place the blame at the feet of TC and he certainly does deserve some of it. His 9 rebounds and 4 assists more than overcome the 5 TOs, as far as +/- impact on the game. The real blame is our back court play of JBo/JW/CMac, which combined for 6 points in 60 minutes of playing time. The poor defense I will hang on the entire team.
 
lightning1 said:
How can we "trust you" when you are wrong? He averages 3.2 TOs per game. His box +/- is second highest among the starting 5 (behind only JW).
Box +/- for the season, for 9 man rotation highest to lowest per Sports Reference:
Baer +11.8
JW + 6.6
TC + 6.2
Kriener + 5.9
Moss + 5.8
Garza + 5.1
JBo + 3.7
CMac + 2.1
You (and anyone else) can place the blame at the feet of TC and he certainly does deserve some of it. His 9 rebounds and 4 assists more than overcome the 5 TOs, as far as +/- impact on the game. The real blame is our back court play of JBo/JW/CMac, which combined for 6 points in 60 minutes of playing time. The poor defense I will hang on the entire team.
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Good to see you back (not that you were gone long). My issue with many of Cook's turnovers, and other missed transition opportunities, is that he has a bad habit of crashing into the basket support or getting tangled up with the camera operators on the baseline and takes himself completely out of the play going the other way. Giving up any opportunity of transition defense. If you throw the ball away and compound it by not being able to get back can that in a sense count as two turnovers?

Obviously, Cook was far from our biggest problem. The ball was getting in deep with too much regularity. And that's on our guards. And yes, the three you mentioned disappeared completely on offense. If we get any offensive contribution from Joe or Jordan we overcome all of this and win by ten.
 
lightning1 said:
How can we "trust you" when you are wrong? He averages 3.2 TOs per game. His box +/- is second highest among the starting 5 (behind only JW).
Box +/- for the season, for 9 man rotation highest to lowest per Sports Reference:
Baer +11.8
JW + 6.6
TC + 6.2
Kriener + 5.9
Moss + 5.8
Garza + 5.1
JBo + 3.7
CMac + 2.1
You (and anyone else) can place the blame at the feet of TC and he certainly does deserve some of it. His 9 rebounds and 4 assists more than overcome the 5 TOs, as far as +/- impact on the game. The real blame is our back court play of JBo/JW/CMac, which combined for 6 points in 60 minutes of playing time. The poor defense I will hang on the entire team.
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You can’t say “backcourt” play and completely leave out Moss. That’s simply twisting numbers.

Yes JBo and JW had off games but it’s not like they were shooting a bunch of shots and missing them. Pitino was mic’ed during one of the timeouts and said we know what they are going to do, throw it inside, stay out on the shooters. Basically they were okay with Garza and Cook getting their’s if it meant Iowa’s shooters weren’t going to get the looks. Offense was not the issue here.

Defense as you noted was a fail by pretty much everyone outside of Baer and Dailey.

To your point about TC, I’m with you. He’s an asset, we need him, we just need him to play within himself and stick to his strengths. If we are going inside near the end of the game it needs to be to Garza, he’s a quality FT shooter.
 
Northside Hawk said:
Good to see you back (not that you were gone long). My issue with many of Cook's turnovers, and other missed transition opportunities, is that he has a bad habit of crashing into the basket support or getting tangled up with the camera operators on the baseline and takes himself completely out of the play going the other way. Giving up any opportunity of transition defense. If you throw the ball away and compound it by not being able to get back can that in a sense count as two turnovers?

Obviously, Cook was far from our biggest problem. The ball was getting in deep with too much regularity. And that's on our guards. And yes, the three you mentioned disappeared completely on offense. If we get any offensive contribution from Joe or Jordan we overcome all of this and win by ten.
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You live with turnovers from your bigs, as long as they are efficient on offense and they rebound/defend. It's a trade off you accept. Cook's trying to take it the length of the floor was poor, to say the least.
 
To put the blame on Cook is beyond freaking stupid. Without Cook we get torched by 20+. Cook wishes he had those plays back more than any idiot message board poster does.
 
NikeHawk21 said:
You can’t say “backcourt” play and completely leave out Moss. That’s simply twisting numbers.

Yes JBo and JW had off games but it’s not like they were shooting a bunch of shots and missing them. Pitino was mic’ed during one of the timeouts and said we know what they are going to do, throw it inside, stay out on the shooters. Basically they were okay with Garza and Cook getting their’s if it meant Iowa’s shooters weren’t going to get the looks. Offense was not the issue here.

Defense as you noted was a fail by pretty much everyone outside of Baer and Dailey.

To your point about TC, I’m with you. He’s an asset, we need him, we just need him to play within himself and stick to his strengths. If we are going inside near the end of the game it needs to be to Garza, he’s a quality FT shooter.
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I clearly named the 3 players I was referring to.
 
lightning1 said:
You live with turnovers from your bigs, as long as they are efficient on offense and they rebound/defend. It's a trade off you accept. Cook's trying to take it the length of the floor was poor, to say the least.
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Good points. Ed Horton, Greg Stokes and Acie Earl were all turnover prone the entire time they were here. And they made up it in other areas and were usually in the NCAA'S.
 
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