Lick supporters-Was this the game?

[clicheusername3]

When you finally wake up and realize that the coach needs to go no matter what happens? If not, what is it going to take for you to come around? This game was humiliating for the fans, and that is when I know that change is needed

 

[ddiction]

What did he do that was so bad? Guys weren't hitting their open shots. They outrebounded Illinois by 11 despite being undersized, only turned it over 10 times, and had plenty of open looks.

 

[TChawk]

What did he do that was so bad? Guys weren't hitting their open shots. They outrebounded Illinois by 11 despite being undersized, only turned it over 10 times, and had plenty of open looks.

Chucking up 3's is not a way to win games.....sure some where open some where not but it is not a high % shot, yet that is the shot lick wants to live by and usually coming with less than 5 seconds on the clock after alot of passing around the periamter.

 

[ddiction]

Chucking up 3's is not a way to win games.....sure some where open some where not but it is not a high % shot, yet that is the shot lick wants to live by and usually coming with less than 5 seconds on the clock after alot of passing around the periamter.

Sure it's a way to win games, especially when the other team has a 7'1" center. Our inside shooting was terrible because the lane was off limits. We only shot 28% from three. For the three to be an efficient shot, it needs to be more like 38%... and if we'd shot that well, we'd have won. By the way, from inside we were 30.7%.

 

[tweeterhawk]

Sure it's a way to win games, especially when the other team has a 7'1" center. Our inside shooting was terrible because the lane was off limits. We only shot 28% from three. For the three to be an efficient shot, it needs to be more like 38%... and if we'd shot that well, we'd have won. By the way, from inside we were 30.7%.

But I thought Lick's key to recruiting was getting good shooters.

 

[clicheusername3]

What did he do that was so bad? Guys weren't hitting their open shots. They outrebounded Illinois by 11 despite being undersized, only turned it over 10 times, and had plenty of open looks.

I'm also talking about looking past the game and in to the stands...its a total embarassment. I know its not all the coaches fault but in big time sports the coach usually is the one taking the fall

 

[DYK88]

That's what happens in BigTen play when you don't have a big boy or two in the paint...you get owned. I'm expecting more of the same the rest of the season. Yippee.

 

[HawkI101]

I have been reading the free forums for awhile but this is my first post so cut me some slack. I am not a fan of TL and I think the stats quoted above prove the point about his coaching. We outrebounded them, only had 10 TO, and had open shots and we STILL lost. All coaches at the college level can coach, some better than others, but at that level it is about recruiting. Put Dean Smith or Coach K with our group and they don't have any better record than we do right now. TL will never bring in the type of kids we need to be at the top of the Big Ten, maybe he can have some years he gets us to the middle of the conference but never at the top because he doesn't recruit well. Even next years class, a good class for him, is a middle to bottom of Big Ten standards.

 

[tweeterhawk]

I have been reading the free forums for awhile but this is my first post so cut me some slack. I am not a fan of TL and I think the stats quoted above prove the point about his coaching. We outrebounded them, only had 10 TO, and had open shots and we STILL lost. All coaches at the college level can coach, some better than others, but at that level it is about recruiting. Put Dean Smith or Coach K with our group and they don't have any better record than we do right now. TL will never bring in the type of kids we need to be at the top of the Big Ten, maybe he can have some years he gets us to the middle of the conference but never at the top because he doesn't recruit well. Even next years class, a good class for him, is a middle to bottom of Big Ten standards.

Well stated for your first post. (Are you really Tom Davis?)

 

[blkngoldUofI]

I have been reading the free forums for awhile but this is my first post so cut me some slack. I am not a fan of TL and I think the stats quoted above prove the point about his coaching. We outrebounded them, only had 10 TO, and had open shots and we STILL lost. All coaches at the college level can coach, some better than others, but at that level it is about recruiting. Put Dean Smith or Coach K with our group and they don't have any better record than we do right now. TL will never bring in the type of kids we need to be at the top of the Big Ten, maybe he can have some years he gets us to the middle of the conference but never at the top because he doesn't recruit well. Even next years class, a good class for him, is a middle to bottom of Big Ten standards.

What other coach has brought talent in that led Iowa to the top of the league or country? Raveling was the coach that brought in the players that Mr. Davis had a great run with back in the day but other than that Iowa has no conference titles in the last 20 years besides a conference tourny one which isn't exactly like a regular season title. Iowa might not ever be a top flight team in the Bog Ten because we never were. But, Mr. Davis won games, we finished in the top half of the Big 10, got us to the tourny and usually won his first round game. SA won one NCAA tourny game in 8 years, Lick none in 3 years. Having open shots and making or missing them are not exactly the coaches fault. Maybe when the new facilities are ready the kids can get in more shooting?

 

[pistons]

We have no

Center

PG

Or SLashers

We let family members play because we cant fill out a roster?

Who's fault is it Gary Dolphin?

 

[HawkI101]

True, GR brought in all the best recruits for Davis, but TD still delivered some good recruiting classes that landed us in the top half of the conference. SA also recruited some good players to Iowa that allowed them to finish middle to upper half in the conference a few times. TL isn't the guy I would have liked us to hire but I wasn't in horrible disagreement with it until now. People say "who else are we gonna get." I wanted and still do a young guy to come in, doesn't even have to have head experience but some solid assistant experience at big time programs. It could be a gamble but the TL gamble didn't hasn't paid out.

 

[IATrainMaster101]

To answer the OP question...

No this was not "the game".

The game will be sometime next season.

I had zero expectations for this season and IMHO anyone who did was kidding theirself.

At the end of last season, when all of the defections occured, I thought, you know this might just be the time to cut and run. I thought there has been too much of this in 3 years. It had nothing to do with whether or not I thought TL could coach, just that I thought things were going to be worse this season and we were on the verge of completely losing our fan base.

Barta did not cut and run. I'm fine with that, because I still have no idea whether TL is the right or wrong guy for this job as far as coaching ability. But since we did not cut last year, I felt that we needed to make a 2 year investment from that point on. Last years recruiting class was pretty decent and by all accounts next years is even better.

At the end of the season last year, we all knew we knew we weren't going to field a full roster, we knew we were not going into the season with any kind of experience at ppg and we knew that we were still goint to at least have some growing pains in the post. That was before Archie's injury.

We made the investment to go into this season anyway. By doing so I think we needed to make the commitment to go into 1 full season with 4 classed and a full roster. I think it only fair don't you? I mean how can you give one more year, knowing it's going to be disaster and then cut after it's done? Why wouodl you take that approach?

So to answer the OP question again. No this was not "the game".

Since last season, I knew that this season would not provide "The game".

Next season, you betcha. A losing Non Confrence record, a loss to Directional Tech, A second ugly loss at home in B10.....They are all fair targets for "The Game".

This year, not so much. Bad reasoning, bad timming. It was before this season or after next season IMHO.

 

[IowaFanSince82]

What did he do that was so bad? Guys weren't hitting their open shots. They outrebounded Illinois by 11 despite being undersized, only turned it over 10 times, and had plenty of open looks.

I am fed up with scoring 40pts a game! This is pathetic, I don't care what coach you bring in, get someone who can recruit decent athletes and someone who can SCORE! 40pts is so sad, I have watched JH teams score more points than Iowa! TL days better be counting down, if he stays for another year, Iowa basketball will be losing money next year! They will have to pay the fans to come out and watch!

 

[DuffMan]

When you finally wake up and realize that the coach needs to go no matter what happens? If not, what is it going to take for you to come around? This game was humiliating for the fans, and that is when I know that change is needed

Our FANBASE allowed themselves to be the vocal minority last night. Yes there were 150 or so Illannoy kids there. There were several thousand Iowa fans there, yet for most of the game they allowed themselves to be overwhelmed by those 150 kids.

If you dont like the fact the arena is empty? Look at the fanbase. If you don't like the visiting fans were louder? Look at the fan base. I get a laugh out of all the people who get on the message boards saying "I watched the game and the arena was empty". Pathetic, if you really care get off your duff and go to a few games, otherwise save it.

Fact: Our fanbase ran the winningest coach in the history of Iowa out of town.

Fact: Our fanbase stopped attending games with the next coach allegedly becuase of off the court behavior of his kids and how he dealt with it.

Fact: Under the new coach attendance has contintued to slide.

Fact: Hawkeyenation has a very poor record of supporting basketball over the last 12 or so years.

 

[1977Hawkeye]

Sure it's a way to win games, especially when the other team has a 7'1" center. Our inside shooting was terrible because the lane was off limits. We only shot 28% from three. For the three to be an efficient shot, it needs to be more like 38%... and if we'd shot that well, we'd have won. By the way, from inside we were 30.7%.

You make it sound like the team just had an unusually bad night shooting the 3 ball, but here are some stats for you on our 3-point shooting that I just got from HawkeyeInsider.com this morning:

Gatens - 34.6%
Payne - 31.1%
May - 27.8%
Fuller - 20%
Tucker - 31.3%
Cougill - 40.5%
Bawinkel - 37.9%
Lickliter - 28.1%

As a team - 32.1%

That's for the year.

So when you say that we "only" shot 28%, that actually isn't very much below our season average, so poor outside shooting is nothing new for this team. I hate to say that, but the stats are what they are. I find this to be a very disturbing stat for a team whose system revolves around shooting alot of 3's.

I thought Lickliter now has the players in place that fit his system. Wouldn't that require great outside shooters? I imagine some people will come back and say that we have good shooters, but again, the stats don't lie. 32% as a team. That's not good, especially when almost half of your attempts are from 3.

 

[golfbymagic]

I think TL will get it done, but lets assume Barta cuts him loose and they hire the newest hot thing in coaching circles -- maybe Keno, maybe not (Iowa was not kind to his dad so maybe he doesn't want to come here). We will still be undersized, undertalented and getting screwed by a Big Ten Network schedule set up to favor the eastern time zone. There is no way anyone with a brain can dump all of this on Lick. The product will bring the people, not the other way around. I grew up with 20 consecutive seasons of non-winning football and I have seen the BB team this bad before. Maybe TL gets it done, maybe not. But I do not want Iowa to be one of those impatient programs who trades the long term in favor of short term success. If we are, I wish to hell it would have started about 7 or 8 years ago when the pretty boy who preceeded TL had proved himself incapable of improving anything but his hairdo.

 

[HawkI101]

I think TL will get it done, but lets assume Barta cuts him loose and they hire the newest hot thing in coaching circles -- maybe Keno, maybe not (Iowa was not kind to his dad so maybe he doesn't want to come here). We will still be undersized, undertalented and getting screwed by a Big Ten Network schedule set up to favor the eastern time zone. There is no way anyone with a brain can dump all of this on Lick. The product will bring the people, not the other way around. I grew up with 20 consecutive seasons of non-winning football and I have seen the BB team this bad before. Maybe TL gets it done, maybe not. But I do not want Iowa to be one of those impatient programs who trades the long term in favor of short term success. If we are, I wish to hell it would have started about 7 or 8 years ago when the pretty boy who preceeded TL had proved himself incapable of improving anything but his hairdo.

I agree I don't want to be a program that changes coaches like a revolving door, but until you find the coach that can be successful you have to make changes even if you don't want to. You can't pay millions of dollars in coaches salaries and lose money as a program. And I do have a brain and for you to say that this is not all TL's fault is incorrect. He gets paid to put product on the floor and he hasn't done it in three years. We have gotten worse every year. Is that showing progress?? If you could see progress it would be different. Some people say we are young, which is true, but the talent we have is never going to get us in the top half of this conference. I love the effort our players put in but I also realize they aren't going to win alot. I watch every game and I have to defend myself to a lot of other people who say, "how can you watch that," which I hate having to do.

 

[1977Hawkeye]

I agree I don't want to be a program that changes coaches like a revolving door, but until you find the coach that can be successful you have to make changes even if you don't want to. You can't pay millions of dollars in coaches salaries and lose money as a program. And I do have a brain and for you to say that this is not all TL's fault is incorrect. He gets paid to put product on the floor and he hasn't done it in three years. We have gotten worse every year. Is that showing progress?? If you could see progress it would be different.

This is what I think. I appreciate the concept of sticking with a coach and being patient, but said coach also needs to be showing some progress. If that isn't happening, and especially if the program is regressing, then that is a problem. Sticking with a coach just for the sake of sticking with him isn't going to solve anything, either.

 

[HawkI101]

Great point!