Kurt Warner: Iowan to Canton

I'm torn when it comes to the KW/HOF talk. Due to injuires and getting to the league late he lacks longevity. However, I am swayed by how good he is when he's healthy and the resurection of two woeful franchises. Besides the story is incrediblly cool'
 
Obviously, no one knows for sure weather Kurt Warner will end up in the Hall of Fame or not. His statistics and his accomplishments ensure he will be one of the 15 that are selected every year. I don't think number of years is going to mean squat..since he ranks with the best of them in the time he was given. Tom Brady has 3 super bowls, Favre has 2 and Manning has 1. Only one of them is in the same class as Warner with 3-and his team is still alive this post season...he could conceivably get to a 4th (however unlikely). MVP's go like this: Manning has 4; Favre has 3; Warner has 2, and Brady 0. We all know from the TV announcers that Warner has the top 3 passing performances in Superbowl history, he is at least #2, possible #1 all time in the playoffs.....let me say again...ALL TIME. Let that sink in. If he was so unworthy because of the years he rode the pine because of ignorant coaches, how did this happen??? He is now 9-3 as a starter in the playoffs, that's a .750% winning percentage. Manning is 15-7, .681%; Favre is 12-10 or .545%; and Brady is 14-3 or .823%. Total yardage goes like this: Manning=50,128;Favre=69,329;Warner=32,344;and Brady=30,844. I am seeing a pattern here-his bad years are WAY overshadowed by REALLY, REALLY good years. Warner is in the same conversation with the other 'elite' QB's in the NFL today.
 
phays01 said:
Obviously, no one knows for sure weather Kurt Warner will end up in the Hall of Fame or not. His statistics and his accomplishments ensure he will be one of the 15 that are selected every year. I don't think number of years is going to mean squat..since he ranks with the best of them in the time he was given. Tom Brady has 3 super bowls, Favre has 2 and Manning has 1. Only one of them is in the same class as Warner with 3-and his team is still alive this post season...he could conceivably get to a 4th (however unlikely). MVP's go like this: Manning has 4; Favre has 3; Warner has 2, and Brady 0. We all know from the TV announcers that Warner has the top 3 passing performances in Superbowl history, he is at least #2, possible #1 all time in the playoffs.....let me say again...ALL TIME. Let that sink in. If he was so unworthy because of the years he rode the pine because of ignorant coaches, how did this happen??? He is now 9-3 as a starter in the playoffs, that's a .750% winning percentage. Manning is 15-7, .681%; Favre is 12-10 or .545%; and Brady is 14-3 or .823%. Total yardage goes like this: Manning=50,128;Favre=69,329;Warner=32,344;and Brady=30,844. I am seeing a pattern here-his bad years are WAY overshadowed by REALLY, REALLY good years. Warner is in the same conversation with the other 'elite' QB's in the NFL today.
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Tom Brady never won a league MVP award? Wow. That's hard to fathom, isn't it? Who won it the year the Patriots were 16-0?

I heard on Tebowvision that Warner is #4 all time in playoff TDs with 31. Ahead of Joe Montana. My God.
 
phays01 said:
Obviously, no one knows for sure weather Kurt Warner will end up in the Hall of Fame or not. His statistics and his accomplishments ensure he will be one of the 15 that are selected every year. I don't think number of years is going to mean squat..since he ranks with the best of them in the time he was given. Tom Brady has 3 super bowls, Favre has 2 and Manning has 1. Only one of them is in the same class as Warner with 3-and his team is still alive this post season...he could conceivably get to a 4th (however unlikely). MVP's go like this: Manning has 4; Favre has 3; Warner has 2, and Brady 0. We all know from the TV announcers that Warner has the top 3 passing performances in Superbowl history, he is at least #2, possible #1 all time in the playoffs.....let me say again...ALL TIME. Let that sink in. If he was so unworthy because of the years he rode the pine because of ignorant coaches, how did this happen??? He is now 9-3 as a starter in the playoffs, that's a .750% winning percentage. Manning is 15-7, .681%; Favre is 12-10 or .545%; and Brady is 14-3 or .823%. Total yardage goes like this: Manning=50,128;Favre=69,329;Warner=32,344;and Brady=30,844. I am seeing a pattern here-his bad years are WAY overshadowed by REALLY, REALLY good years. Warner is in the same conversation with the other 'elite' QB's in the NFL today.
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I agree. We can "cherry-pick" numbers to bolster one's argument for-or-against. You are comparing his #'s to future HOF's which is one way to do it. Another way is to compare his #'s to HOF members such as Aikman, Kelly and Young. (See my thread). Very comparable with far fewer games played (range of 36-45). Should a guy be penalized for injuries and bad coaching decisions?
 
Kurt Warner singlehandedly reserected two moribound franchises and made them contenders. In each case, he was brought in as an afterthought and then, when pressed into duty, was the triggerman in an formidable offense. He also accomplised these two feats 10 years apart.
 
While I think Warner is a HOF'er, let's not be delusional about his "down" years. It didn't really have anything to do with an "ignorant coach"...he was pretty bad during those years. There were the final years with the Rams and the year with the Giants that he flat out wasn't very good; in fact, he couldn't even break the starting lineup. You could call it ignorant coaching, or you could call it throwing 10 TD's vs. 16 INT's.

Much like a vast majority of other players (HOFer's included), he looks a lot better when he's got a lot of talent around him.
 
From an actual HOF voter:

1. Kurt Warner is a Hall of Famer, period: Going into Sunday’s game between Green Bay and Arizona, I was astounded by some of the commentary on various NFL pregame shows as the pundits analyzed the matchup. I’m not going to say that Warner was overlooked, but I think it’s fair to say that they may have had a memory loss over his postseason track record. It was nothing malicious; just strange. How could anyone forget the huge numbers and victories put up by Warner in the postseason? How could anyone take him for granted at this time of year? The one guy who didn’t was — no surprise — Marshall Faulk of the NFL Network. He made it a point to stress Warner’s experience and history in postseason games. Of course, we all know what happened. Warner played the best postseason game of his career, and the Cardinals needed all of it to prevail over Green Bay 51-45 in one of the most entertaining sporting events we’ve seen in a long, long time. Warner completed 29 of 33 for 379 yards and 5 TDs and at least temporarily put the retirement speculation to the side.
At this point, I really don’t understand how any of my fellow voters could conclude that Warner isn’t a Hall of Fame QB. I wrote an entire column on this a couple of months ago, and I’m not going to list all of his qualifications again here. But since he just shot out all of the lights in another postseason game, it’s a good time to update his postseason ledger. Which is pretty amazing. The rankings cited here are based on a minimum of 250 passing attempts.
Team Record When Warner Starts: 9-3
Completion percentage: 66.5, 1st.
Passer Rating: 104.6, 2nd to Bart Starr.
Yards Per Attempt: 8.59, 1st.
Touchdowns: 31, 4th behind Joe Montana, Brett Favre, Dan Marino.
Average Yards Passing Per Game: 312, 1st.
300-Yard Games: 6, which ties him for first with Peyton Manning and Joe Montana.
Most Completions of 25+ yards: 31, 2nd to Brett Favre.
Other notes: Warner has the three-highest passing totals in Super Bowl history and was the MVP of Super Bowl 34… if he passes for 253 yards against New Orleans on Saturday, Warner will become only the seventh QB in league history 4,000 postseason passing yards in a career … Warner has the two highest passing-yards totals for an NFL postseason, with 1,147 yards for Arizona in 2008 and 1,063 for the Rams in 1999….He’s passed for 365 yards or more in six of 12 postseason games.
Warner’s overall body of work is exceptional — but his postseason resume is preposterously good.
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Kurt Warner Rides Again | Bernie’s 5 Minutes | STLtoday
 
Hawks1 said:
then Brady isn't a HOF QB ,because he was not the best QB this year or last year
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I know that's snark, but I'm going to use it to make a statement:

These are sure-fire hall of famers from this era, clutch performers, legends of the game:

Favre
Brady
Manning
Warner

Three of the four are still in the playoffs. This is an epic playoff season.
 
So dluzman, would the argument change if KW led the Cards to a Super Bowl victory this year? I think he's in the HOF either way, but maybe the naysayers need one more Super Bowl appearance to believe he's legit. If he plays the way he did yesterday (against the #2 defense in the NFL), I think the Cards go all the way.
 
HerkyHigh said:
So dluzman, would the argument change if KW led the Cards to a Super Bowl victory this year? I think he's in the HOF either way, but maybe the naysayers need one more Super Bowl appearance to believe he's legit. If he plays the way he did yesterday (against the #2 defense in the NFL), I think the Cards go all the way.
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Absolutely that would change things. A lot could change, his career is not over yet. He could play a few more years. Look, I have nothing against Kurt Warner, I HOPE HE DOES MAKE THE HOF. I just don't think he would right now if this were his last year. KW has had six great years and that alone doesn't put him in the HOF in my opinion. If those six years were consecutive I think that would help his cause but the fact they were split in half by 5 below average years hurts.

Look at the QB's in the HOF right now. How many were 2nd string in the middle of their careers? Kurt might go on to another Super Bowl this year and have another couple games with gaudy numbers. Maybe he makes it in because his playoff numbers are just that good.

I'll say it again, I have nothing against Kurt Warner and hope he does make the HOF. I'm trying to be objective though when I look at his career versus others in the HOF.

Thunderhawk quoted a St. Louis sportswriter, a HOF voter, as evidence for KW making the HOF. What St. Louis writer wouldn't vote KW in the HOF? That's like quoting a Dallas writer as evidence for Aikman making the Hall.

Of course everybody in Iowa wants KW in the HOF. I'm just trying to be objective when looking at it because not all voters are from Iowa, or St. Lous, or Arizona!
 
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ThunderHawk said:
He's an easy first ballot pick. He has the top three passing performances in Superbowl history. He has the 2nd highest (maybe highest now) passer rating in playoff history. 2 league MVPs. And so on. His stats and records place him in the company of the greatest names to ever play.

I don't know why this is even debatable. Yeah, he didn't have the longest career. That's the only knock, and it's woefully inadequate to deny him entry to Canton.

Here, I'll make it simple for you. If you have to reference a guy when discussing the most meaningful records for a player at his position, he's a first ballot HOF player.
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Thunder............Good post. As usual, we agree! He is arguably the greatest QB ever in the NFL, in terms of Playoff/Super Bowl performances.
Start carving that bust of the boy from CR Regis now. :D
 
How many Super Bowls did Dan Marino win? How many Super Bowls did Dan Fouts play in? Joe Namath is in the HOF because of ONE Super Bowl....other than that, his career wasn't all that great.

How many Super Bowls did the Rams win before Warner? How many Super Bowls were the Cardinals in? For that matter, how many playoff games did the Cardinals win in the 50 years before Warner? Kurt is a Hall of Famer....period.
 
83Hawk said:
How many Super Bowls did Dan Marino win? How many Super Bowls did Dan Fouts play in? Joe Namath is in the HOF because of ONE Super Bowl....other than that, his career wasn't all that great.

How many Super Bowls did the Rams win before Warner? How many Super Bowls were the Cardinals in? For that matter, how many playoff games did the Cardinals win in the 50 years before Warner? Kurt is a Hall of Famer....period.
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BINGO. Will the 'KW to HOF deniers' be surprised, or continue to deny, when Kurt is voted in and accepts his much deserved honor? :rolleyes:
 
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