Kurt Warner: Iowan to Canton

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DeanMarshall

Well-Known Member
Kurt Warner LIGHTS UP the Packer defense today with unbelievably gaudy stats.

Kurt Warner will be in the NFL Hall of Fame........First ballot.

:)
 
I agree KW to the HOF. I about threw up when listening to ESPN radio during the game tonight and they were saying he isn't...but McNabb from the Eagles is??? Not saying McNabb shouldn't be in the HOF, but KW definitely should be there!
 
I have to agree with the guys on ESPN radio. There are only 253 members in the HOF, and 39 of those are coaches & contributors, like owners, comissioners, etc. Each year only 4-7 guys are elected to the HOF. I like Warner and think he is a great player but you have to be so elite to make it to the HOF that I just think it is unlikely that he ever makes it.

There are roughly 1700-1800 NFL players every year and less than .003% of them will make the HOF. Is Warner in the top .003%, probably not.
 
dluzman said:
I have to agree with the guys on ESPN radio. There are only 253 members in the HOF, and 39 of those are coaches & contributors, like owners, comissioners, etc. Each year only 4-7 guys are elected to the HOF. I like Warner and think he is a great player but you have to be so elite to make it to the HOF that I just think it is unlikely that he ever makes it.

There are roughly 1700-1800 NFL players every year and less than .003% of them will make the HOF. Is Warner in the top .003%, probably not.
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Don't know how you're more elite than 5 TD passes in a playoff game missing one of your best receivers when your defense is not helping out at all. That's better than 99.997 percent of players.
 
He's an easy first ballot pick. He has the top three passing performances in Superbowl history. He has the 2nd highest (maybe highest now) passer rating in playoff history. 2 league MVPs. And so on. His stats and records place him in the company of the greatest names to ever play.

I don't know why this is even debatable. Yeah, he didn't have the longest career. That's the only knock, and it's woefully inadequate to deny him entry to Canton.

Here, I'll make it simple for you. If you have to reference a guy when discussing the most meaningful records for a player at his position, he's a first ballot HOF player.
 
dluzman said:
I have to agree with the guys on ESPN radio. There are only 253 members in the HOF, and 39 of those are coaches & contributors, like owners, comissioners, etc. Each year only 4-7 guys are elected to the HOF. I like Warner and think he is a great player but you have to be so elite to make it to the HOF that I just think it is unlikely that he ever makes it.

There are roughly 1700-1800 NFL players every year and less than .003% of them will make the HOF. Is Warner in the top .003%, probably not.
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Those the same guys who picked Georgia Tech to stomp Iowa and Green Bay to beat down Arizona? Those guys?
 
Kurt Warner is a true professional. It is unreal what he has done for Arizona. He is amazing.
 
GodGodGodBathia said:
Don't know how you're more elite than 5 TD passes in a playoff game missing one of your best receivers when your defense is not helping out at all. That's better than 99.997 percent of players.
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You have got to have more than one great playoff game to make the HOF. I know Warner has had some great playoff games before this one but your argument for having one great game doesn't hold up. If that were the case Doug Williams and Timmy Smith would be in the HOF based on one great Super Bowl game.

QB's like Brett Favre, Tom Brady, and Peyton Manning are HOF quarterbacks. Kurt Warner, not sure about that. Warner has had some unbelievable games, some of the best of all time, especially in the playoffs, but from 2002 through 2007 he spent a lot of time as the 2nd string QB. HOF QB's don't spend time as backups like he has.

His three year run from 99 through 01 might be the best of all time but to make the HOF you have to do it for many years, and he just hasn't done that. If there were a HOF for playoff games he might make that because he has been great in the playoffs but over the long haul his stats just don't hold up.

I think Kurt Warner is a great QB, but he's just not HOF material.
 
ThunderHawk said:
Those the same guys who picked Georgia Tech to stomp Iowa and Green Bay to beat down Arizona? Those guys?
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Not sure who those guys were, I wasn't listening to ESPN radio.

I've got nothing against Kurt Warner. He has undoubtedly had some of the greates games of all time, especially in the playoffs but HOF players are voted in because they are the best over several years, not just a few select years.
 
dluzman said:
You have got to have more than one great playoff game to make the HOF. I know Warner has had some great playoff games before this one but your argument for having one great game doesn't hold up. If that were the case Doug Williams and Timmy Smith would be in the HOF based on one great Super Bowl game.

QB's like Brett Favre, Tom Brady, and Peyton Manning are HOF quarterbacks. Kurt Warner, not sure about that. Warner has had some unbelievable games, some of the best of all time, especially in the playoffs, but from 2002 through 2007 he spent a lot of time as the 2nd string QB. HOF QB's don't spend time as backups like he has.

His three year run from 99 through 01 might be the best of all time but to make the HOF you have to do it for many years, and he just hasn't done that. If there were a HOF for playoff games he might make that because he has been great in the playoffs but over the long haul his stats just don't hold up.

I think Kurt Warner is a great QB, but he's just not HOF material.
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Gayle Sayers didn't do it for many years. Neither did Jim Brown.

But that's really neither here nor there.

The point is this: Warner IS like those QBs you mentioned. You can't talk about great clutch QBs of this era without talking about Warner. Especially in the postseason, where he's better, with the possible exception of Brady, who has his defenses and Adam Vinatieri to thank as well.

One QB has the top three passing performances of all time in the Superbowl. One. Warner. He'd have three rings if his defenses could have stopped the other team on the last possession.

Those tools on ESPN radio must be GD idiots. Really. They must be deliberately stupid and completely ignorant of relevant stats.
 
dluzman said:
Not sure who those guys were, I wasn't listening to ESPN radio.

I've got nothing against Kurt Warner. He has undoubtedly had some of the greates games of all time, especially in the playoffs but HOF players are voted in because they are the best over several years, not just a few select years.
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So by your criteria Warren Moon is deserving but Warner isn't.

That doesn't say much about the criteria for getting in.
 
ThunderHawk said:
Gayle Sayers didn't do it for many years. Neither did Jim Brown.

But that's really neither here nor there.

The point is this: Warner IS like those QBs you mentioned. You can't talk about great clutch QBs of this era without talking about Warner. Especially in the postseason, where he's better, with the possible exception of Brady, who has his defenses and Adam Vinatieri to thank as well.

One QB has the top three passing performances of all time in the Superbowl. One. Warner. He'd have three rings if his defenses could have stopped the other team on the last possession.

Those tools on ESPN radio must be GD idiots. Really. They must be deliberately stupid and completely ignorant of relevant stats.
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Your changing the criteria when you say "clutch QB's of this era." We are talking about the HOF, which is different. There are lots of "clutch" players, doesn't make them HOF material.

Gale Sayers and Jim Brown were the best every year they played. Can't say that about Kurt Warner, which is exactly the point I'm making. Look at HOF players, they are the best every year. HOF players make multiple Pro Bowls, not just a couple here and there.

Just because Warner has the top three performances in the Superbowl doesn't alone make him a HOF player. Aikman never had the best stats, but he was always considered one of the best at his position, every year he played except his first couple years, which is why he is in the HOF. Warner had several years (2002-2007) where he wasn't the best, which is why he probably won't make it.

And yea, those guys on ESPN radio are such idiots, I'm sure that is how they got hired.
 
Words fail. My criteria is a simple one: You can't talk about the great QBs of this era without referencing Warner. He's in the club. He leads or is near the top in a bunch of meaningful statistics. And he resurrected two of the most losing franchises and took them to the playoffs and superbowl, which shouldn't be so easily swept under the rug. When you talk about his stats, the ones that matter, he's in the company of the all-time greats.

Forget it. This is like peeing into the wind.
 
ThunderHawk said:
So by your criteria Warren Moon is deserving but Warner isn't.

That doesn't say much about the criteria for getting in.
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I don't make the criteria for getting in, the voters do. It's very subjective, just like the Heisman and any Most Valuable Player award. Is the MVP the person that is the most valuable to the team, or is it the person with the best statistics? Often those are two different things but the person with the best stats usually wins that award.

Warren Moon was a special player; he played for 17 seasons in the NFL and was always considered one of the best at his position. If Warner could play another 7 years at the level of his 99-01, and 07-09 seasons I think he would make the HOF. However, Warner had below average years from 02 through 06, which is going to hurt him. Kurt had 6 great years, but the 5 from 02 through 06 he only had 27 touchdown passes. You can't average barely better than 5 TD passes a year for half your career and make the HOF.

The more I look at his stats and his career the more I'm convinced that there is no way he makes the HOF. I'm sorry but 6 great years won't get you in the HOF unless you are Gale Sayers. There are lots of players that have 6 great years. The HOF is for players that have 10 or more great years, with a few exceptions, like Gale Sayers, and Jim Brown.
 
ThunderHawk said:
Words fail. My criteria is a simple one: You can't talk about the great QBs of this era without referencing Warner. He's in the club. He leads or is near the top in a bunch of meaningful statistics. And he resurrected two of the most losing franchises and took them to the playoffs and superbowl, which shouldn't be so easily swept under the rug. When you talk about his stats, the ones that matter, he's in the company of the all-time greats.

Forget it. This is like peeing into the wind.
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Your right, we will just have to agree to disagree. I hope Warner does make it in the HOF, unfortunately, I don't see it happening.
 
dluzman said:
Your right, we will just have to agree to disagree. I hope Warner does make it in the HOF, unfortunately, I don't see it happening.
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Well I'd add that you should probably take the opinions of "experts" who think McNabb belongs in the Hall but Warner doesn't with a big grain of salt. A grain big enough for McNabb to choke on, an activity with which he is well acquainted.
 
ThunderHawk said:
Well I'd add that you should probably take the opinions of "experts" who think McNabb belongs in the Hall but Warner doesn't with a big grain of salt. A grain big enough for McNabb to choke on, an activity with which he is well acquainted.
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I don't think those guys have a vote so it doesn't matter to me what they think. I just know that I am always amazed at how good some of the players are that DON'T make the HOF. I can't believe guys like Jim Plunkett and Ray Guy are not in the HOF. I wasn't very old when they played but I remember who they were and thought they were pretty good.

As far as McNabb goes, I'm biased there. I'm a huge Cowboy fan and hate everything about the Eagles. I lived in Philadelphia for two years and remember one of the sports guys on a local radio station saying that he "wanted a Joe Theismann to happen to Troy Aikman" before a Cowboy/Eagle game. He was referencing the time Theismann's leg was snapped in half when Lawrence Taylor tackled him. I just thought that was so unprofessional and that only increased my dislike for the Eagles.

For that matter I don't think McNabb makes it either. He is good but he's not among the elite QB's every year.
 
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