Josh Ogundele in the transfer portal

[HuckFinn]

But, that is what it has become Huck....loyalty is going out the window. Don't get me wrong, I don't completely like this. I put this back on the NBA and the NFL for not doing things like the WNBA. But, without going down that rabbit hole (because Fry does not like that one and again I do get your points Fry there about an individual trying to make a living out of their talent). Colleges use players and players use colleges. It is only going to get worse with the portal and NIL.

I also agree personal relationships will not go completely away (nor do I completely advocate that....if we can put together a solid team at Iowa I would try to do what I could to keep that team together), but roster turnover is here to stay I'm afraid.

I did not hear that Fran podcast, but if what he said is being reported, I don't agree completely with Fran's stance there. I think if you have a big problem and you can get a better player to solve it, you should go after it. And if that player does not like it then he can either work harder in practice or portal himself.

Otherwise it is just a one-way street and Fran is going to get burned.....like CJF already did to him.

And College Sports is a BIG BUSINESS. It generates tons of money in television revenue, athletic apparel, coaching salaries, etc. Gambling as well. It most certainly is a business along with academics along for the ride.

But, much of what you say about “big business” has no relevance to players, fans, students.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

But, much of what you say about “big business” has no relevance to players, fans, students.

1. Gambling: Fans/Students (probably some players to unfortunately). Harmon ding ding. Pete Rose...ding ding.
2. Fan Apparel: everyone
3. Players: a coach's income (and his staff) is dependent on them....some places get more rope than others as we know.
4. The College: I'm going to pay a gazillon for Saban because look at what he does.
5. Players: If I can get more money to play here vs there.....I follow the money unless I really wanted to play for xyz because I grew up worshiping xyz.

I would argue a lot of relevance. College Sports has turned into a minor league pro sports league.

 

[HuckFinn]

But, that is what it has become Huck....loyalty is going out the window. Don't get me wrong, I don't completely like this. I put this back on the NBA and the NFL for not doing things like the WNBA. But, without going down that rabbit hole (because Fry does not like that one and again I do get your points Fry there about an individual trying to make a living out of their talent). Colleges use players and players use colleges. It is only going to get worse with the portal and NIL.

I also agree personal relationships will not go completely away (nor do I completely advocate that....if we can put together a solid team at Iowa I would try to do what I could to keep that team together), but roster turnover is here to stay I'm afraid.

I did not hear that Fran podcast, but if what he said is being reported, I don't agree completely with Fran's stance there. I think if you have a big problem and you can get a better player to solve it, you should go after it. And if that player does not like it then he can either work harder in practice or portal himself.

Otherwise it is just a one-way street and Fran is going to get burned.....like CJF already did to him.

And College Sports is a BIG BUSINESS. It generates tons of money in television revenue, athletic apparel, coaching salaries, etc. Gambling as well. It most certainly is a business along with academics along for the ride.

How has loyalty gone out the window? Do you mean among players, coaches, fans, students, or just folks like you and Fry and others on HN, plus the sports media, which is a giant joke married to ignorance? The transfer portal and NIL are classic unintentional consequence examples, I agree. Look. I am not bashing your views. I enjoy your posts. But I do view the college sports world from a different view than many on this board.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

How has loyalty gone out the window? Do you mean among players, coaches, fans, students, or just folks like you and Fry and others on HN, plus the sports media, which is a giant joke married to ignorance? The transfer portal and NIL are classic unintentional consequence examples, I agree. Look. I am not bashing your views. I enjoy your posts. But I do view the college sports world from a different view than many on this board.

I think loyalty has gone out the window among players, coaches, and the colleges themselves. I think fans are pretty passionate....but can be very bandwagonish and ride a lot of emotion with wins and losses. Sports media probably is bandwagonish to...especially during March Madness. But, by and large, they stay loyal to their areas of coverage (like ESPN favoring SEC and ACC).

 

[HuckFinn]

1. Gambling: Fans/Students (probably some players to unfortunately). Harmon ding ding. Pete Rose...ding ding.
2. Fan Apparel: everyone
3. Players: a coach's income (and his staff) is dependent on them....some places get more rope than others as we know.
4. The College: I'm going to pay a gazillon for Saban because look at what he does.
5. Players: If I can get more money to play here vs there.....I follow the money unless I really wanted to play for xyz because I grew up worshiping xyz.

I would argue a lot of relevance. College Sports has turned into a minor league pro sports league.

Sorry. Cynical, undocumented conclusions don’t influence my views.

 

[HuckFinn]

I think loyalty has gone out the window among players, coaches, and the colleges themselves. I think fans are pretty passionate....but can be very bandwagonish and ride a lot of emotion with wins and losses. Sports media probably is bandwagonish to...especially during March Madness. But, by and large, they stay loyal to their areas of coverage (like ESPN favoring SEC and ACC).

Yup. Fans. Short for fanatics. But ok if kept in perspective.. harmless fun. Enjoy it!

 

[HaydenHawk56]

Sorry. Cynical, undocumented conclusions don’t not influence my views.

Fair enough. Would Blue Chips sway your opinion?

 

[PCHawk]

A few points.

Fran's job isn't to put together the best roster. It's to put together the best seasons. If his job was the former, he should always chase slight upgrades in the portal, regardless of the consequences. Since it's the latter, he does have to balance bringing in a potential slight upgrade vs losing team comrodery. This year's team was really close and it's been talked about a lot as a big reason for the success they had. Bringing back Ash might have been a big contributor to that.

Fran still uses the portal to fill holes and recruit over guys who aren't producing at all. Looking for a big before Josh O left is an example.

Loyalty might be out the window. But at Iowa, you need to do things that separate you from everyone else. I can guarantee that there will still be recruits (and especially parents of recruits) who notice the loyalty and it makes the difference.

 

[PCHawk]

Ya, I mean you got to think a blind squirrel eventually finds a nut. But he has had a lot of empty seasons (actually everyone) without nuts.

And the thing of it is, you can't get rid of the guy. I mean, you can, but considering Iowa's recent history and considering the lessons learned from Mr. Davis, it would be a big blunder to do it. He has Iowa competitive and he is putting his team into position. That is a safe seat to be in currently where we are at.

But my only fear is that in 5 to 10 years time (say no big runs happen in the NCAAs), will we find ourselves back in a Mr. Davis like situation where the fanbase is pretty apathetic and you have a new AD that decides to make a Bowlsby like move. Now we are pushing 30 years or more without a Sweet 16 and finding ourselves right back to where we were after Mr. Davis was let go.

Like Fry alludes to, we would be even less relevant then.

That is why I wish Fran would really strike when the iron is hot.

Hopefully we just keep getting put into position and break through. But, until then, expect Lucy to pull the football away and be pleasantly surprised when she does not.

If Fran continues to do what he's done for the next 10 years with churning out All American, Big 10 first teamers, and tournament appearances, the program's footing will be fine. Being right back to where we were when Davis was let go isn't really a bad thing. We picked up the hottest coach on the market. What happened after that is irrelevant to the state of the program when Davis left.

Fran whiffed on two classes in a row back when the Lick years were fresh in everyone's mind. Since then the program has taken a pretty big step forward. I don't think we've seen Fran's ceiling with recruiting.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

If Fran continues to do what he's done for the next 10 years with churning out All American, Big 10 first teamers, and tournament appearances, the program's footing will be fine. Being right back to where we were when Davis was let go isn't really a bad thing. We picked up the hottest coach on the market. What happened after that is irrelevant to the state of the program when Davis left.

Fran whiffed on two classes in a row back when the Lick years were fresh in everyone's mind. Since then the program has taken a pretty big step forward. I don't think we've seen Fran's ceiling with recruiting.

I hope your right PC. Good points about whiffing on those two classes.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

A few points.

Fran's job isn't to put together the best roster. It's to put together the best seasons. If his job was the former, he should always chase slight upgrades in the portal, regardless of the consequences. Since it's the latter, he does have to balance bringing in a potential slight upgrade vs losing team comrodery. This year's team was really close and it's been talked about a lot as a big reason for the success they had. Bringing back Ash might have been a big contributor to that.

Fran still uses the portal to fill holes and recruit over guys who aren't producing at all. Looking for a big before Josh O left is an example.

Loyalty might be out the window. But at Iowa, you need to do things that separate you from everyone else. I can guarantee that there will still be recruits (and especially parents of recruits) who notice the loyalty and it makes the difference.

Fran isn't a cutthroat recruiter I don't think. He's very much an old school relationship driven guy. I think he's upfront with what he's selling and either it fits the kid or it doesn't. He's recognized lots of talent early on in the process to go after kids.

His recruiting style just doesn't fit most of the new age kids coming up who are very much cutthroat me me me types who most likely got that from their folks. He often gets the right kind of kids due to it but they are fewer and fewer and far between what's available as far as good talent goes. Landing kids like the Murrays was just luck. Late blooming legacy kids that nobody else really wanted.

 

[PCHawk]

Fran isn't a cutthroat recruiter I don't think. He's very much an old school relationship driven guy. I think he's upfront with what he's selling and either it fits the kid or it doesn't. He's recognized lots of talent early on in the process to go after kids.

His recruiting style just doesn't fit most of the new age kids coming up who are very much cutthroat me me me types who most likely got that from their folks. He often gets the right kind of kids due to it but they are fewer and fewer and far between what's available as far as good talent goes. Landing kids like the Murrays was just luck. Late blooming legacy kids that nobody else really wanted.

In that podcast he talked about other coaches promising minutes they might have no intentions of giving, and Fran said he doesn't do that. I think he might have specifically been talking about Joe T.

I agree that having homegrown talent is luck, bit it's luck that most of the major programs have way more of.

 

[InGoodCo]

I forgot that Iowa was the only state with homegrown talent, Fran is really lucky

 

[Knight78]

I don't get what they don't understand about your point. Maybe we need to appeal to visual learners somehow on this.

Here may be what you don't get. Check out the dates for men's basketball.

2023–24 NCAA Recruiting Calendar and NCAA Recruiting Guide

The NCAA Recruiting Calendar outlines when college coaches can start actively recruiting athletes. See a detailed explanation of the recruiting calendars.

www.ncsasports.org

The end of the final recruiting period was April 28. Ash was awarded a scholarship on May 7, well after the end of the recruiting period. I'd prefer the scholarship go to a player like Ash than be "banked".

 

[Northside Hawk]

If Fran continues to do what he's done for the next 10 years with churning out All American, Big 10 first teamers, and tournament appearances, the program's footing will be fine. Being right back to where we were when Davis was let go isn't really a bad thing. We picked up the hottest coach on the market. What happened after that is irrelevant to the state of the program when Davis left.

Fran whiffed on two classes in a row back when the Lick years were fresh in everyone's mind. Since then the program has taken a pretty big step forward. I don't think we've seen Fran's ceiling with recruiting.

Especially if he keeps getting guys from out east. The is gold to be mined out there even if some didn't stay to their senior year.

 

[RyDogg]

Here may be what you don't get. Check out the dates for men's basketball.

2023–24 NCAA Recruiting Calendar and NCAA Recruiting Guide

The NCAA Recruiting Calendar outlines when college coaches can start actively recruiting athletes. See a detailed explanation of the recruiting calendars.

www.ncsasports.org

The end of the final recruiting period was April 28. Ash was awarded a scholarship on May 7, well after the end of the recruiting period. I'd prefer the scholarship go to a player like Ash than be "banked".

Actaully Ash's sholly was anounced April 29th and there were still many potential impact transfers announced in May or later. So it wasn't like there weren't much better options out there by the time they gave it to Ash. Maybe they didn't have a chance at those left over, maybe they didn't make an effort for them, but there were still real D1 players out there after April.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

Here may be what you don't get. Check out the dates for men's basketball.

2023–24 NCAA Recruiting Calendar and NCAA Recruiting Guide

The NCAA Recruiting Calendar outlines when college coaches can start actively recruiting athletes. See a detailed explanation of the recruiting calendars.

www.ncsasports.org

The end of the final recruiting period was April 28. Ash was awarded a scholarship on May 7, well after the end of the recruiting period. I'd prefer the scholarship go to a player like Ash than be "banked".

So why was it not used on a better player before April 28th?

 

[Hawkfnntn]

I forgot that Iowa was the only state with homegrown talent, Fran is really lucky

In the sense that when Iowa has homegrown talent, we used to have a tough time keeping them here... If the Murrays were looked at as Harrison Barnes types of prospects coming out of HS (Keegan shoulda been anyway Kris will probably show us next yr him too) would they still have been Hawks? With the Dukes, UNCs, UKs and KUs all banging down their door I'm not so sure. Maybe. That's where the luck comes in Fran was the only one half interested initially and then as their prep season in FL went on he locked em in.

 

[HuckFinn]

And their mom and dad.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

In the sense that when Iowa has homegrown talent, we used to have a tough time keeping them here... If the Murrays were looked at as Harrison Barnes types of prospects coming out of HS (Keegan shoulda been anyway Kris will probably show us next yr him too) would they still have been Hawks? With the Dukes, UNCs, UKs and KUs all banging down their door I'm not so sure. Maybe. That's where the luck comes in Fran was the only one half interested initially and then as their prep season in FL went on he locked em in.

Also can't hurt his dad played here.