Iowa vrs Maryland

Fryowa

Administrator
Man it saddens me that so few fans are going to games. I mean Murray isn't going to be there after this yr. Enjoy him while we have him cause nobody has anybody better. He's beyond legit. Inside outside runs the floor in transition. Just takes what the D gives him and plays within the flow of the game. He's so efficient and doesn't take bad shots. His shot selection is as impressive as anything he does.

I get it that the after 8 pm start times in the middle of the week sucks along with CHA not being the greatest environment but lets show out better then that when the weather allows. We had no homecourt advantage last night and that sure as hell would help.
It's te perfect storm of things that makes it a snooze-fest in CHA.

-Students don't care about basketball anymore and Iowa isn't a basketball school. They also have to pay to get in and can't sit anywhere remotely close to the floor. You could fit a swimming pool behind each basket comfortably. Give students free entry and some pizza. It's not like you'd be losing money anyway because they don't go now the way it is...

-Even with Keegan Murray, people want to see a really good, explosive team. We've got one elite standout, one guy in JB who'd start at a few B1G schools, and then a bunch of mid-major guys. Hawks had a lot of trouble handling a Maryland program that's in shambles after a coaching change, when they play the Illinois and Purdues of the world it ain't gonna happen consistently. To be honest I think a lot of it is apathy with Franball. I like Fran and I don't want to fire him, but after over a decade it seems like the first round every once in a while is his ceiling. I'm not advocating one way or the other, but his sample size is fairly large now as college coaches go. Fans don't expect a whole lot and then they don't go to games because of it.

-It's been brought up a million times before but CHA is a terrible basketball venue. At the bottom levels where you need the rowdiest fans it's 50% aisles, and 50% old money blue hair donors. You think Brent Feller and his weird Ozzy Osbourne-lookin' wife are going to let some punk kids have those seats when they donate millions every year to travel around with the team? No way. Not until they get a new venue with luxury boxes for those guys.

And to the people who say "the product is there, it has to be something else..."

I say one word in reply...wrestling. CHA is slammin', rowdy, and loud as hell for wrestling. So yes, if you put an elite "product" on the floor, CHA will rock. Our basketball program is middle of the pack and naturally you aren't going to fill seats.
 

InGoodCo

Well-Known Member
Not sure who said it but this is one of the more athletic teams i can remember. I get excited with the "underdog have to scrap for a NCAA berth" mentality.
This team has the potential to play defense, I will enjoy watching that too, i always feel like when we need the big stop the teams in the past give up a wide open layup, jump shot or 3. Hopefully with more athletic players we can make the stop.
Fun win that we definitely needed to have to get in the win column. On to Kohl center on Friday night, that place will be rocking. Hope for a win, expect a decent showing, praying its not a blowout.
It's Thursday fwiw - just didn't want you to miss the game.
 

InGoodCo

Well-Known Member
It's te perfect storm of things that makes it a snooze-fest in CHA.

-Students don't care about basketball anymore and Iowa isn't a basketball school. They also have to pay to get in and can't sit anywhere remotely close to the floor. You could fit a swimming pool behind each basket comfortably. Give students free entry and some pizza. It's not like you'd be losing money anyway because they don't go now the way it is...

-Even with Keegan Murray, people want to see a really good, explosive team. We've got one elite standout, one guy in JB who'd start at a few B1G schools, and then a bunch of mid-major guys. Hawks had a lot of trouble handling a Maryland program that's in shambles after a coaching change, when they play the Illinois and Purdues of the world it ain't gonna happen consistently. To be honest I think a lot of it is apathy with Franball. I like Fran and I don't want to fire him, but after over a decade it seems like the first round every once in a while is his ceiling. I'm not advocating one way or the other, but his sample size is fairly large now as college coaches go. Fans don't expect a whole lot and then they don't go to games because of it.

-It's been brought up a million times before but CHA is a terrible basketball venue. At the bottom levels where you need the rowdiest fans it's 50% aisles, and 50% old money blue hair donors. You think Brent Feller and his weird Ozzy Osbourne-lookin' wife are going to let some punk kids have those seats when they donate millions every year to travel around with the team? No way. Not until they get a new venue with luxury boxes for those guys.

And to the people who say "the product is there, it has to be something else..."

I say one word in reply...wrestling. CHA is slammin', rowdy, and loud as hell for wrestling. So yes, if you put an elite "product" on the floor, CHA will rock. Our basketball program is middle of the pack and naturally you aren't going to fill seats.
If the standard for attendance is having a team full of elite players, I don't understand how they've had any fans the last 40 years. They've never had that. I also think that standard only applies to like 5 programs in the country on an annual basis. Tough bar

Iowa basketball hasn't been a thing to do in ages - there are million reasons why - but it's never going to field a team full of elite players and frankly it never has.
 

Hawkfnntn

Well-Known Member
It's te perfect storm of things that makes it a snooze-fest in CHA.

-Students don't care about basketball anymore and Iowa isn't a basketball school. They also have to pay to get in and can't sit anywhere remotely close to the floor. You could fit a swimming pool behind each basket comfortably. Give students free entry and some pizza. It's not like you'd be losing money anyway because they don't go now the way it is...

-Even with Keegan Murray, people want to see a really good, explosive team. We've got one elite standout, one guy in JB who'd start at a few B1G schools, and then a bunch of mid-major guys. Hawks had a lot of trouble handling a Maryland program that's in shambles after a coaching change, when they play the Illinois and Purdues of the world it ain't gonna happen consistently. To be honest I think a lot of it is apathy with Franball. I like Fran and I don't want to fire him, but after over a decade it seems like the first round every once in a while is his ceiling. I'm not advocating one way or the other, but his sample size is fairly large now as college coaches go. Fans don't expect a whole lot and then they don't go to games because of it.

-It's been brought up a million times before but CHA is a terrible basketball venue. At the bottom levels where you need the rowdiest fans it's 50% aisles, and 50% old money blue hair donors. You think Brent Feller and his weird Ozzy Osbourne-lookin' wife are going to let some punk kids have those seats when they donate millions every year to travel around with the team? No way. Not until they get a new venue with luxury boxes for those guys.

And to the people who say "the product is there, it has to be something else..."

I say one word in reply...wrestling. CHA is slammin', rowdy, and loud as hell for wrestling. So yes, if you put an elite "product" on the floor, CHA will rock. Our basketball program is middle of the pack and naturally you aren't going to fill seats.
Yeah folks just have other stuff they'd rather do and when your couch is a better option then spending $ and doing everything it takes to travel to the games it is what it is. We all have our over unders on distance/time/$. If it'd cost me less then 50 all together and I lived within an hour I'd be at every damn game willing to pay for decent seats.

It is a perfect storm I agree because it includes the multiple demographics of people. The administration is beyond stupid. Get students in there anyway shape or form it takes. I assume they have a marketing department so come on..

I just wonder how much difference it makes to have a great crowd. Last night was pathetic... When Iowa started the game as hot as they were and Murray was dunking left and right that crowd shouda been blowing the roof off.
 

Fryowa

Administrator
If the standard for attendance is having a team full of elite players, I don't understand how they've had any fans the last 40 years. They've never had that. I also think that standard only applies to like 5 programs in the country on an annual basis. Tough bar

Iowa basketball hasn't been a thing to do in ages - there are million reasons why - but it's never going to field a team full of elite players and frankly it never has.
I don’t think it takes a full slate of elite players, I just think that Iowa has set a pretty consistent bar over the past say 12 years where there have been big expectations at times that haven’t really ever been realized, and fans are having apathy. Not apathy where they’re super pissed and want change, but just “bored” apathy if that makes sense. With Iowa there’s very little that’s appealing for a family of four (like I mentioned in another thread) to go drop a couple hundred bucks on a night.
 

InGoodCo

Well-Known Member
I don’t think it takes a full slate of elite players, I just think that Iowa has set a pretty consistent bar over the past say 12 years where there have been big expectations at times that haven’t really ever been realized, and fans are having apathy. Not apathy where they’re super pissed and want change, but just “bored” apathy if that makes sense. With Iowa there’s very little that’s appealing for a family of four (like I mentioned in another thread) to go drop a couple hundred bucks on a night.
That I agree with, it costs a lot more to go to and the convenience of watching at home is much more appealing. Who wants to deal with shitty parking and terrible amenities for an 8 pm tip on a Monday night? Not many - and it doesn't matter if they had Michael Jordan out there, that's not going to change all those other variables.

But that's the main reason IMO, and not the product. The product is fine - we are potentially having our 3rd straight season with an All American on the floor. They just spent an entire season going wire to wire in the top 10. Fran's teams are always competitive and fun to watch. They are going to the dance with regularity -

I blame a lot of things, but IMO, product or program isn't anywhere near the top of the reasons for declining interests in Iowa Basketball.

And there are what? 6 or 7 home meets in Wrestling a year? All of them being on a FRI/SAT/SUN -

not a good defense or comparison to a team that has to play at 8 pm on a Monday and it's 1 of 20 other games they could attend.
 

Fryowa

Administrator
And there are what? 6 or 7 home meets in Wrestling a year? All of them being on a FRI/SAT/SUN -

not a good defense or comparison to a team that has to play at 8 pm on a Monday and it's 1 of 20 other games they could attend.
I think that’s offset by wrestling not being near as widely followed (or even known about sport) the up until just last year wasn’t regularly on tv. All of Iowa’s BT duals are on national tv this year which is unprecedented.

Either way I do think it’s a combination of a lot of things, and part of that is lackluster success (perceived). I’m not saying in any way that it’s easy to win in the BT or that Iowa should expect to do better, but casual fans (99% of them are casual and aren’t wackos like us on HN) are bored with Iowa basketball. A B1G title (not the BT tournament) or a deep tourney run would turn that situation around in a heartbeat but aren’t really realistic goals.
 

thedukeofearl

Well-Known Member
Attended last nights' game and thought there might be 4000 there, but it could have been closer to 3000. The 8 oclock start, cold weather, and just after the new year probably a few reasons. I would guess some fans avoiding crowds for the obvious reason. That being said, Keegan is really good. He doesn't even look like he's trying that hard. One of the smoothest players I have ever watched. Joe T was so much better the second half. He was more aggressive and looked like he was intent on getting to the rim and scoring. Connor has a role. Control the tempo, defend, and has the ability to inbounds the ball as we are getting pressed. He does those things well. I can't figure out why some coach hasn't worked on his shot. It is flat. It needs to come off his finger tips more instead of off the palm of his hand. Perkins and Ulis looked their best when trying to attack the rim. Good win. Finally, beer is expensive there.

Connor has his moments tossing the ball inbounds


Damn, we had some players on that team

Luka, Tyler, Isaiah, JoeW, and Jordan

I really like watching this team right now

To have the opportunity to watch Keegan in person should be enough incentive

Keegan reminds me of Grant Hill and


I went to Vets Auditorium to watch Drake play Cincinnati with Oscar Robertson
who scored 52 points before the 3-point shot

Then I went to Vets to watch Drake play Indiana State and watched Larry Bird
score 53 points
 

Hawkfnntn

Well-Known Member
Attended last nights' game and thought there might be 4000 there, but it could have been closer to 3000. The 8 oclock start, cold weather, and just after the new year probably a few reasons. I would guess some fans avoiding crowds for the obvious reason. That being said, Keegan is really good. He doesn't even look like he's trying that hard. One of the smoothest players I have ever watched. Joe T was so much better the second half. He was more aggressive and looked like he was intent on getting to the rim and scoring. Connor has a role. Control the tempo, defend, and has the ability to inbounds the ball as we are getting pressed. He does those things well. I can't figure out why some coach hasn't worked on his shot. It is flat. It needs to come off his finger tips more instead of off the palm of his hand. Perkins and Ulis looked their best when trying to attack the rim. Good win. Finally, beer is expensive there.
Were you there early by chance watching warmups? Like how's CM look in that setting when shooting? It always blows my mind when a guy that could score in HS can't put the ball in the basket in college. I'm not talking about being guarded and how tough it is to get open but when the dude is open he can't (won't even try most of the time) score. He's not unique with that either he's just the most obvious of recent example of a guy like that
 

1980HAWKFAN

Well-Known Member
Were you there early by chance watching warmups? Like how's CM look in that setting when shooting? It always blows my mind when a guy that could score in HS can't put the ball in the basket in college. I'm not talking about being guarded and how tough it is to get open but when the dude is open he can't (won't even try most of the time) score. He's not unique with that either he's just the most obvious of recent example of a guy like that
Ya saw some warm ups. Mainly watched Jbo launching from 30 feet. Not sure I saw Connor take a shot in warm ups. I never saw him play in high school. I would guess the defense in high school was extremely weak compared to what he's dealing with now. Most good long range shooters have a few things in common. 1) ball coming off the finger tips with the hand and wrist following thru like the goose neck 2) good rotation( see#1) and a decent amount of arc. 3) good rhythm with getting your legs into the shot.
When Connor fires away from deep, most of his shots are flat and hit the front of the rim, also I would argue he shoots a lot out of rhythm. Example, his one shot last night that was short was an after thought. Instead of being in rhythm, he hesitated realized hey Im open looked briefly to his right to check on anybody else open....nope ok I'll shoot it. Brick out of rhythm.
 

HuckFinn

Well-Known Member
Booze-fueled, rapid-fire internet rants are never a good idea. I know you’ve got personal issues going on right now, but the better idea when you got to your motel room after the game would’ve been to go to bed instead of the bar. Be careful with that stuff; it’ll get ya. Seriously.
Thanks for your concern. But, I had my traditional two pints of Amber Bock, then good night. I was having fun ranting back at the crazy rants about the game. I thought that was part of the deal. Most of those rants, I think, came before my two pints. As to my personal issues, of course those are having an impact, but not on what I write on HC. I made that mistake once, and I am grateful for what you did for me.
 

HuckFinn

Well-Known Member
Connor has his moments tossing the ball inbounds


Damn, we had some players on that team

Luka, Tyler, Isaiah, JoeW, and Jordan

I really like watching this team right now

To have the opportunity to watch Keegan in person should be enough incentive

Keegan reminds me of Grant Hill and


I went to Vets Auditorium to watch Drake play Cincinnati with Oscar Robertson
who scored 52 points before the 3-point shot

Then I went to Vets to watch Drake play Indiana State and watched Larry Bird
score 53 points
Wow!
 

dahlhawk

Well-Known Member
I saw all the empty seats and knew there couldn't be more than a few thousand there. The announcer even made a comment about Maryland having to deal with Iowa's crowd. Ha, Ha, he might have been being sarcastic.
 

HuckFinn

Well-Known Member
Maryland did pretty well at taking the crowd out of the game with some good runs when Iowa went ice cold shooting the ball. It got louder when Iowa fought back and made a run of their own. Pretty typical crowd reaction at BB games. Football as well.
 

Dadman

Well-Known Member
If the standard for attendance is having a team full of elite players, I don't understand how they've had any fans the last 40 years. They've never had that. I also think that standard only applies to like 5 programs in the country on an annual basis. Tough bar

Iowa basketball hasn't been a thing to do in ages - there are million reasons why - but it's never going to field a team full of elite players and frankly it never has.
I dunno about that, 86'-87' had some pretty good players, per a wiki link, it notes 8 players from this team were selected in the NBA drafts. Not sure how you can call that anything but elite.........if ever we should have won an NCAA title, it was that year
 

InGoodCo

Well-Known Member
I dunno about that, 86'-87' had some pretty good players, per a wiki link, it notes 8 players from this team were selected in the NBA drafts. Not sure how you can call that anything but elite.........if ever we should have won an NCAA title, it was that year
1 instance in 130 years shouldn't set an expectation
 

Dadman

Well-Known Member
1 instance in 130 years shouldn't set an expectation
I would agree 100%.......and that happened almost by accident, Davis inherited a team Raveling recruited basically. Perhaps the 69-70 team had the best starting 5, but that was two elite players and 3 damn good ones.

But even 2 in over 50 years should not be the standard.
 

Northside Hawk

Well-Known Member
I dunno about that, 86'-87' had some pretty good players, per a wiki link, it notes 8 players from this team were selected in the NBA drafts. Not sure how you can call that anything but elite.........if ever we should have won an NCAA title, it was that year
The only thing that team lacked was a rim protector. Which ultimately caught up to us against UNLV.

If Acie Earl was on that team.......
 

trj

Well-Known Member
The only thing that team lacked was a rim protector. Which ultimately caught up to us against UNLV.

If Acie Earl was on that team.......
I don't think they needed a rim protector to take out Indiana or Syracuse if they could have managed to survive that 2nd half against UNLV. Horton/Lohaus were great on the front end of that press, not so much on the back end like Earl was.
 
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