Iowa v Ohio St

Dominate said:
Was at the meet last night and agree with your analysis. Hawks have a long way to go if they are going to compete with Penn St. Way to much standing around and not much energy from DSJ, Nick Moore, EL, and Telford. Was very surprised how easily Triggas rode McD. Telford definitely has to pick it up or else he won't see the Podium at Nationals this year. Very happy with Burak's win and thought Evans did exactly what was required to keep himself in a position to win. Just would like to see more action/energy out of the Hawks in their remaining duals especially when it comes to initiating and finishing take downs.
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Agreed, I do hope that if DSJ gets another chance to wrestle Demas he absolutely dominates him, because after reading through the kid's twitter account I've reached the conclusion that I strongly dislike him. He retweeted literally every single tweet saying he was screwed by the refs. Although that may be true, Evans had a questionable call like that too and he fought through it none the less.
 
metcalfpins said:
Agreed, I do hope that if DSJ gets another chance to wrestle Demas he absolutely dominates him, because after reading through the kid's twitter account I've reached the conclusion that I strongly dislike him. He retweeted literally every single tweet saying he was screwed by the refs. Although that may be true, Evans had a questionable call like that too and he fought through it none the less.
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Losers whine and complain. I hope DSJ stomps him into the ground next time they wrestle.
 
metcalfpins said:
My thoughts on things:

125: McD looked out of shape... lots of trouble on bottom. Anyone know if he had some persisting illness?
133: Nothing new with Ramos, dominant as usual. That couldn't have possibly been Ohio State's second best guy at the weight class though.
141: Ballweg is slow moving his feet, but I do like his scrambling ability.
149: Kelly looked good the second and third periods, but seemed a little out of control in the first which led to the loss. His aggression is much better this year, however.
157: Bad match by DSJ, imo that should've been a reversal with backpoints against him... he needs to do much more offensively!
165: Seems like this is the typical Nick Moore match. Needs to be more aggressive.
174: Wow! Evans is a gamer. Not much else to say. Probably should've been a pin at the end, too.
184: Lofty needs to shoot more and finish the shots he does take, but at this point in the meet it didn't matter much.
197: Great confidence builder for Burak. He looked great early on in the match. Hard to judge how well he held up down the stretch because the tOSU wrestler didn't really even try to take a shot.
Heavyweight: I'm not sure what to say. Telford didn't do squat until when he was down 2 in overtime.

Solid win. I'm really disappointed about Stieber not wrestling and instead sending out whoever was against Ramos... I thought they at least had Paddock or someone to give it a go.
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I'd say this is about as accurate of a recap as we can ask for. My biggest disappointment other than Ramos having to wrestle a 2nd stringer (if even that), was telford. I firmly believe that Clark could have beaten Telford last night.

As far as being sluggish, it is my understanding that the team is enduring 2 aday practices right now. Is this correct?? if so, it would explain some of our "feet stuck in mud" action. Looking forward to getting back to Carver sunday for another home dual. Go Hawks!
 
metcalfpins said:
My thoughts on things:

125: McD looked out of shape... lots of trouble on bottom. Anyone know if he had some persisting illness?
133: Nothing new with Ramos, dominant as usual. That couldn't have possibly been Ohio State's second best guy at the weight class though.
141: Ballweg is slow moving his feet, but I do like his scrambling ability.
149: Kelly looked good the second and third periods, but seemed a little out of control in the first which led to the loss. His aggression is much better this year, however.
157: Bad match by DSJ, imo that should've been a reversal with backpoints against him... he needs to do much more offensively!
165: Seems like this is the typical Nick Moore match. Needs to be more aggressive.
174: Wow! Evans is a gamer. Not much else to say. Probably should've been a pin at the end, too.
184: Lofty needs to shoot more and finish the shots he does take, but at this point in the meet it didn't matter much.
197: Great confidence builder for Burak. He looked great early on in the match. Hard to judge how well he held up down the stretch because the tOSU wrestler didn't really even try to take a shot.
Heavyweight: I'm not sure what to say. Telford didn't do squat until when he was down 2 in overtime.

Solid win. I'm really disappointed about Stieber not wrestling and instead sending out whoever was against Ramos... I thought they at least had Paddock or someone to give it a go.
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You don't get back points if you still control the leg. The reversal, yes. Telford didn't do squat.
 
castille said:
You don't get back points if you still control the leg. The reversal, yes. Telford didn't do squat.
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Huh? Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm by no means a genius having only wrestled for about two years in my life but if he had been awarded the reversal he would have also gotten back points as DSJ was pretty close to being stuck.
 
metcalfpins said:
Huh? Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm by no means a genius having only wrestled for about two years in my life but if he had been awarded the reversal he would have also gotten back points as DSJ was pretty close to being stuck.
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Yes correct. having the leg has nothing to do w/ back points. that position is either scored two ways, DSJ remains in control or it's a reversal and back points. having the leg is a moot point when talking about back points.
 
CRlightweight said:
Yes correct. having the leg has nothing to do w/ back points. that position is either scored two ways, DSJ remains in control or it's a reversal and back points. having the leg is a moot point when talking about back points.
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Ask your local ref or go to the handbook.
 
castille said:
Ask your local ref or go to the handbook.
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I sent an e-mail to pat mcCormick, who happens to be the head of the wrestling officials, to explain the rule. I also sent an e-mail to the head of the "Rules Interpretation and Clarification comittee.
 
castille said:
You don't get back points if you still control the leg. The reversal, yes. Telford didn't do squat.
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This doesn't make any sense. You are given back points when one has control on top and the bottom person is over 90 degrees. You don't get a reversal unless you've been determined to have control. Therefore if Demas gets the reversal, he's getting back points.
 
castille said:
I sent an e-mail to pat mcCormick, who happens to be the head of the wrestling officials, to explain the rule. I also sent an e-mail to the head of the "Rules Interpretation and Clarification comittee.
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Good for you. I'm sure he is also going to tell you if a person gets 2 points for a reversal then they are in control of the other therefore they get the back points as well.

You can't get a reversal unless you are in control of your opponent and you can't get back points unless you are in control of your opponent.

Actually can you explain how you can reverse a guy to his back and not get back points? That might be the better question.
 
pumpdog20 said:
This doesn't make any sense. You are given back points when one has control on top and the bottom person is over 90 degrees. You don't get a reversal unless you've been determined to have control. Therefore if Demas gets the reversal, he's getting back points.
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My friend is an official. That's the way it was explained to me. I'd rather find out for myself than speculate or guess. If McCormick is head of officials and he reviewed it and came away with the same call, were not understanding some rule.
 
hawkeyescott said:
Good for you. I'm sure he is also going to tell you if a person gets 2 points for a reversal then they are in control of the other therefore they get the back points as well.

You can't get a reversal unless you are in control of your opponent and you can't get back points unless you are in control of your opponent.

Actually can you explain how you can reverse a guy to his back and not get back points? That might be the better question.
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Remember that McCormick is the one who officiated the meet. Maybe you need to explain it to him.
 
Only the offensive wrestler can score a near fall. The defensive player can only score a fall but no back points.
 
The whole issue here is JUDGEMENT. . . Control in a match is basically up to the judgement of the referee. The official did not think that DSJ had lost control and was - in his judgement - still in control. A different official might have called this situation totally different. . . The rules books all give definitions of positions, etc, but it is up the the judgement of the mat official to determine match scoring. . .
 
k64hawkeye said:
The whole issue here is JUDGEMENT. . . Control in a match is basically up to the judgement of the referee. The official did not think that DSJ had lost control and was - in his judgement - still in control. A different official might have called this situation totally different. . . The rules books all give definitions of positions, etc, but it is up the the judgement of the mat official to determine match scoring. . .
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THIS! +1
 
k64hawkeye said:
The whole issue here is JUDGEMENT. . . Control in a match is basically up to the judgement of the referee. The official did not think that DSJ had lost control and was - in his judgement - still in control. A different official might have called this situation totally different. . . The rules books all give definitions of positions, etc, but it is up the the judgement of the mat official to determine match scoring. . .
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Everyone is aware of the judgement part. The discussion turned into a disagreement of getting the reversal but not back points.
 
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