Iowa: Head Coaching Destination Job For All The Wrong Reasons.

[MelroseHawkins]

Look, I know you’re knowledgeable and top rated in here. I also know you’re better than this. You’re better than some of the posters who simply call someone a troll for having an opinion contrary to prevailing opinion, or a contrarian way of expressing that opinion. You’re better than to inject as you did the word “any,” as if anywhere in my post I said anything close to KF having “no” intellect.

More to the point, look at how many times Iowa under KF temporarily visits a top 10 or 15 national ranking, but substantially falls ungraciously, bringing the state’s embarrassment with him. The polls may feel that KF has done the work of training fundamentals and discipline and reward him with a high ranking, a motivation, but KF always falls; he never takes it even a notch higher to truly affirm the polling plaudits. Again, the Purdue and Wisky debacles are pure proof of my contention - even you can't deny that. You know that KF leans heavily on the player ‘team leaders’ motivation thing. Well, sometimes well-intentioned college guys need a more mature adult’s leadership to guide them to the next level.

It’s not devastating to say KF has been promoted to his level of incompetency – he’s still a wonderful and honorable man. But Iowa has invested money into a program over decades and now deserves a return on that investment. Yet our return has been maxed out for years – and KF still gets the big salary. Admit it, it’s just too weird how KF can’t, as various other coaches have, pass beyond the team’s threshold. (Chryst?) Aren’t we due for at least some hint of ’85, or even some weekly consistency when reaching a top 10 or 15, or to even win our western division more than once in years? I can't debate this point further, but I’m glad you questioned me and I hope you respect that I responded to you. And, true, I’m not particularly smooth in my posts.

You make some good points and a very valid point in the 2nd paragraph. Iowa historically and especially in the KF era has never been the best when the team was or is the hunted. They rarely hold on to a top 8 ranking during the season. Yes, they've ended there a couple times after winning a bowl game, but being highly ranked during the season has been a struggle.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

I was at Dowling in HS and watched the games that were on TV rabidly and listened to them on WHO 1040 rabidly

Those were the glory days

Plus Don Nelson was playing at Iowa and the Hawks almost beat #1 Ohio State
at their house

Nelson outplayed Jerry Lukas that night

Connie Hawkins was on the freshman team with Nelson

Nellie was living in Hawaii, playing cards with Willie Nelson and Woody Harrelson

View attachment 8239

Nelson looks a bit like Aaron White

......and a very similar to Chris Street. Rest in peace. Probably the haircut.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

I think the 2005-07 stretch is the key to all this. imo, KF made up his mind that he was going to win a certain type of way, with a certain type of kid and it was validated with the 08 and 09 seasons. After 09 I think KF doubled down on his philosophy and never second guess it since.

Yes, that highly regarded 2005 was what really solidified his philosophy going forward. The 2005 class was full of highly rated athletes but when on campus and the team, couldn't either get their shit straight or left the program. This kills a team like Iowa because you just don't have plug and play players. It kills the depth. Kirk went back to really evaluating the quality of the young men over stars, looking for players who were going to buy in and be committed.

 

[Luftgekuehlt67]

I think the 2005-07 stretch is the key to all this. imo, KF made up his mind that he was going to win a certain type of way, with a certain type of kid and it was validated with the 08 and 09 seasons. After 09 I think KF doubled down on his philosophy and never second guess it since.

Absolutely. That top 10 class - 05 or 06, can't remember - it really looked like the program was about to go super sonic.

I don't know if it was bad luck, a culture misfit, or something else (maybe a combo), but it just didn't pan out.

 

[Luftgekuehlt67]

You make some good points and a very valid point in the 2nd paragraph. Iowa historically and especially in the KF era has never been the best when the team was or is the hunted. They rarely hold on to a top 8 ranking during the season. Yes, they've ended there a couple times after winning a bowl game, but being highly ranked during the season has been a struggle.

Honestly, it's because we often play over our head and, due to the abject insanity of how top 25 polls work, we find ourselves overrated. When we get into that rarified top 10 air and finally lose, the pollsters tend to drop us like a hot potato because, like everyone else, they knew we were overrated all along but, due to the unwritten top 25 poll laws, were unable to rank us more objectively until we lost.

If you look at the historical Massey data, Iowa being truly a top 10 program over a season's worth of games is *incredibly* rare.

Going back to 1899, Iowa has, per the Massey historical model, been a top 10 team a total of 14 times. Six of those occurrences were under Evy.

1899 - 7th
1900 - 4th
1921 - 6th
1922 - 2nd
1954 - 8th
1956 - 8th
1957 - 6th
1958 - 2nd
1959 - 9th
1960 - 2nd
1985 - 10th
2002 - 8th
2004 - 10th
2020 - 8th

My personal cheat sheet reads like this:

"If you see Iowa with a single digit poll ranking, we're probably overrated."

Enjoy it while it lasts.

This isn't directed at you, Melrose - you're nowhere near my shit list. A lot of you have a *really* inflated opinion of this program. Maybe that's just a fancy way of saying "fan" but, when it crosses the line into deluded expectations, I think you've gone too far.

By the way, the 1939 Ironman team? 30th in the Massey model that year. Great story, but not a great team.

Hayden Fry, who enjoys a (IMO) well deserved reputation as program savior, put together a top 10 team once in 20 seasons.

We have a long, proud, and rich history as a program, but some of you are severely lacking in perspective.

 

[dagdaj]

I cannot say why Iowa is different in terms of its coaching approach, or if just the two coaches are different.

Either way, I'm happy with it. The rarity of ascending the heights of college football by any other than a handful of schools is significant.

As I've watched the Mizzou fans around me start calling for coaches heads...mostly within 2-3 years of a new hire, I just warn them.

Sure KF's first few years were aggravating. But I wouldn't change the sum of the pursuing years.

We're not Alabama/OSU/Oklahoma.

But we're also not Mizzou. Thank God.

 

[InGoodCo]

I get sick of winning football too guys, but what are ya gonna do ya know? I mean, winning 70% of your games and shit gets old and I know we all could use a break

 

[Northside Hawk]

Absolutely. That top 10 class - 05 or 06, can't remember - it really looked like the program was about to go super sonic.

I don't know if it was bad luck, a culture misfit, or something else (maybe a combo), but it just didn't pan out.

Jobs at Wisconsin, Illinois and Notre Dame were all open that year and Iowa took advantage by cleaning up the midwest.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

Honestly, it's because we often play over our head and, due to the abject insanity of how top 25 polls work, we find ourselves overrated. When we get into that rarified top 10 air and finally lose, the pollsters tend to drop us like a hot potato because, like everyone else, they knew we were overrated all along but, due to the unwritten top 25 poll laws, were unable to rank us more objectively until we lost.

If you look at the historical Massey data, Iowa being truly a top 10 program over a season's worth of games is *incredibly* rare.

Going back to 1899, Iowa has, per the Massey historical model, been a top 10 team a total of 14 times. Six of those occurrences were under Evy.

1899 - 7th
1900 - 4th
1921 - 6th
1922 - 2nd
1954 - 8th
1956 - 8th
1957 - 6th
1958 - 2nd
1959 - 9th
1960 - 2nd
1985 - 10th
2002 - 8th
2004 - 10th
2020 - 8th

My personal cheat sheet reads like this:

"If you see Iowa with a single digit poll ranking, we're probably overrated."

Enjoy it while it lasts.

This isn't directed at you, Melrose - you're nowhere near my shit list. A lot of you have a *really* inflated opinion of this program. Maybe that's just a fancy way of saying "fan" but, when it crosses the line into deluded expectations, I think you've gone too far.

By the way, the 1939 Ironman team? 30th in the Massey model that year. Great story, but not a great team.

Hayden Fry, who enjoys a (IMO) well deserved reputation as program savior, put together a top 10 team once in 20 seasons.

We have a long, proud, and rich history as a program, but some of you are severely lacking in perspective.

No problem. I'm pretty parallel to your thinking, and why I posted that they rarely hold a top ranking during the season. They aren't great when they are the hunted and other teams have them in their cross hairs for being highly ranked. I think the 1985 team may have had the best stretch (several weeks at #1) in the modern era, but that is once in 36 years!

 

[MelroseHawkins]

I cannot say why Iowa is different in terms of its coaching approach, or if just the two coaches are different.

Either way, I'm happy with it. The rarity of ascending the heights of college football by any other than a handful of schools is significant.

As I've watched the Mizzou fans around me start calling for coaches heads...mostly within 2-3 years of a new hire, I just warn them.

Sure KF's first few years were aggravating. But I wouldn't change the sum of the pursuing years.

We're not Alabama/OSU/Oklahoma.

But we're also not Mizzou. Thank God.

I never viewed his first few years as aggravating because he didn't have a lot of talent on that team when he took it over. The team made progress and gained wins each year and got a win in the Alamo Bowl just prior to the historic 2002 team. This is the way a program is built and he did it correctly. I think most fans appreciate the progress he made those early years. That is exactly the expected progression, especially for a developmental team like Iowa. Remember, there was no college "free agency" back then.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

I get sick of winning football too guys, but what are ya gonna do ya know? I mean, winning 70% of your games and shit gets old and I know we all could use a break

And remember, 70% of those games include 3 what should be mow your lawn on Saturday games. A real look at an effective coach is looking at the conference %, IMO. Also, games against top 20 teams, maybe.

 

[ChosenChildren]

Kirk Ferentz is a very intelligent person. Extremely intelligent, in my opinion.

Like a lot of coaches, he is a victim of his own success. Expectations from fans go up when you start beating ranked teams on national television, which he has done numerous times. They want more. It is simply human nature.

I'm excited by the fact that Iowa is in the hunt this year in November for the West. It could end Saturday against Minnesota, but I'm going to enjoy it, win or lose. And I am very excited to see Iowa in another bowl game this year. We are certainly in the hunt for a New Year's Day game.