In Defense of Rob

[Hawkfnntn]

If anything I think the DJK thing has hurt more than helped the players' cause. He's such an unreliable and shifty character that it's taken the focus from finding out what's going on to arguing whether he's taking advantage of the situation.

The conspiracy thing and the unsubstantiated "We're gonna get you" threat were over the top and I think if his numerous past flip flops and inconsistencies were put out there at the same time people would have taken it for what it is. That's not a defense of Ferentz by me, it's me saying this whole thing doesn't help the cause of players that I think have legitimate, 100% problems with how they are and have been treated.

Like I mentioned before, we all probably know that both DJK and Ferentz are vindictive when they don't get their way.

DJK is his own entirely separate thing... I mean the only truth we know is that DJK has gone back and forth multiple times. The trash can thing had teammates witness it so it happened. But some of the other things and his accusing KF of sending the cops to his house... Come on.

I could have lived without Howe reaching out to DJK for that just fine. But I'm not gonna shoot the messenger either. He reached out to Iowa for comment and they of course left it alone. So if folks would just take it for what it is and leave it alone and not let it draw any further opinion on things that'd be ideal. But some are easily riled up and Howe is an easy target. It's not his first rodeo he can take the arrows.

 

[Fryowa]

See, but I find that more forgivable from a 21 year old misguided young man who had troubles and I find it kind of F'd up behavior from the head coach at Iowa.

I agree. I'm actually not in defense of Kirk here. A lot of these issues of "toeing the Iowa line" probably weren't intended to be racially discriminatory (except for Doyle, if he did what he's accused of that's a whole different level), but because they don't mesh with black culture, hair styles, fashion, it ends up making it a racial thing. That's 100% Kirk's fault for trying to slam black players into a mold they don't want or need to fit into, even if he wasn't doing it because they were black.

Throughout this whole ordeal I just keep thinking to myself, "Imagine how fucking dominant this team would have been if guys like Johnson, Daniels, DJK, Lomax, etc. would have been truly happy and built up instead" Imagine what Kallenberger might have accomplished if Seth Wallace had made him feel like a guy who could overcome ADHD instead of telling him how stupid he was for 2 years.

As the parent of a kid with the exact same learning disorder and knowing what it takes to successfully help them, I wanted to strangle Wallace.

What the F does all the shit they're accused of accomplish anyway?

 

[Fryowa]

DJK is his own entirely separate thing... I mean the only truth we know is that DJK has gone back and forth multiple times. The trash can thing had teammates witness it so it happened. But some of the other things and his accusing KF of sending the cops to his house... Come on.

I could have lived without Howe reaching out to DJK for that just fine. But I'm not gonna shoot the messenger either. He reached out to Iowa for comment and they of course left it alone. So if folks would just take it for what it is and leave it alone and not let it draw any further opinion on things that'd be ideal. But some are easily riled up and Howe is an easy target. It's not his first rodeo he can take the arrows.

Yeah. I do want people to know I'm not blaming Rob. But there's definitely a reason he's getting flak. He was in a no win situation. If he didn't publish the statement people sympathetic to the players would have been just as outraged as the ones who are sympathetic to Ferentz.

Where I think it went sideways was not pointing out in the same article DJK's huge issues with credibility and being very specific about it. The evidence is out there in interviews and captured deleted tweets. At that point both sides could make their own judgement and no messenger would get shot.

 

[InGoodCo]

Is it possible that me, myself... I.....growing up in a state that is 93% white. Being around mostly white people my entire life, might have cultural biased views without even knowing it? Even if I am against them? Even if I say I don't? Cause I was raised differently? Probably. I grew up where racism was very real. It was very prominent in my up bringing and the weird thing, is there were literally no people of color in my town.

I remember when I was about 8 or 9 - we went as a legion team down to watch a KC Royals game. After the game, we waited for the team to come out to try and meet Bo Jackson. When he came out, he went straight for the bus and disappointed all of us kids waiting for an autograph or a chance to meet Bo. As he went passed and ignored us and after my coach thought he was all the way on the bus he yelled "F'n N word" at Bo. Bo got off the bus and had to be restrained from coming at our coach.

It was eye opening. That story was told to everyone. The parents didn't care.

It wasn't until I was completely out of small town Iowa that I got out into the world and saw that it wasn't all like that. That it didn't have to be like that. In my opinion, people denying that these kids faced some sort of racism at the U of Iowa has gotta be some kind of a joke. Of course they do, I have almost no doubt about that. I was unaware that it was coming from the staff that I assumed was in place to help protect the kid.

 

[InGoodCo]

Also, I experience racism on a weekly basis in my current employment. I work in OTR trucking. It's rampant in this industry and culture. We have black drivers. I respect them. My boss has said the N word to me repeatedly thru the years. I need this job. I have to have it to survive. If I go to another trucking company, I will experience the same culture, at least here, I know the person I am working for. If I speak out against my superiors about it I'll likely be fired or at the very least, looked upon as a trouble maker and probably get weeded out. Which I don't want. Now, you're telling me this kind of thing couldn't happen at Iowa? Or it is just disgruntled kids making it up? GTFO with that. It's unfortunate and the last thing I want to do is tear down the company I work for - I love my job, besides some of that extra crap I gotta deal with.

 

[okeefe4prez]

As he went passed and ignored us and after my coach thought he was all the way on the bus he yelled "F'n N word" at Bo. Bo got off the bus and had to be restrained from coming at our coach.

Jesus, your coach is absolutely retarded. He's lucky Bo got held back. I'm laughing my ass off picturing this scene.

You have literally the second most popular athlete of the era walking past, the guy gets inundated for autographs and shit all the time and has to blow off thousands of fans everyday. Then some fat, balding middle age schlub from bumbleshit Iowa decides to drop the N bomb. I don't know your coach, but I can see the look in his eyes when Bo heard it and turned around.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

Yeah. I do want people to know I'm not blaming Rob. But there's definitely a reason he's getting flak. He was in a no win situation. If he didn't publish the statement people sympathetic to the players would have been just as outraged as the ones who are sympathetic to Ferentz.

Where I think it went sideways was not pointing out in the same article DJK's huge issues with credibility and being very specific about it. The evidence is out there in interviews and captured deleted tweets. At that point both sides could make their own judgement and no messenger would get shot.

Yeah he coulda pointed that out for sure. If you were new to that whole story and didn't know the history/context of it all it'd have just wrapped it up in a bow. So yeah wish he'd have done that. Wish others wouldn't go all nuclear on Rob for it though it's hardly the punishment that fits the crime.

 

[InGoodCo]

Jesus, your coach is absolutely retarded. He's lucky Bo got held back. I'm laughing my ass off picturing this scene.

You have literally the second most popular athlete of the era walking past, the guy gets inundated for autographs and shit all the time and has to blow off thousands of fans everyday. Then some fat, balding middle age schlub from bumbleshit Iowa decides to drop the N bomb. I don't know your coach, but I can see the look in his eyes when Bo heard it and turned around.

It was something. I still talk about it with my friends to this day. Coach has long since passed. He thought he was a goner, everyone thought he was a goner that night. Some of our parents witnessed it as well. This was in the late 80's.

 

[okeefe4prez]

Where I think it went sideways was not pointing out in the same article DJK's huge issues with credibility and being very specific about it. The evidence is out there in interviews and captured deleted tweets. At that point both sides could make their own judgement and no messenger would get shot.

I vehemently disagree. Rob knows his audience. He knows his audience knows DJK's reputation and can weigh the veracity of the article for themselves. A HUGE problem with media today is that they editorialize and selectively edit every god damned thing they produce rather than just reporting. Rob reports. People need to give the man credit for that. I respect the shit out of that style.

 

[SteveGarvey1]

Rob was just doing his job. I have no problem with that.

As for DJK, accusing Kirk of arranging the police raid without any evidence is weak, it smears Kirk because people will believe it's true anyway, despite the lack of evidence.

But I have to say, I have a much lesser opinion of Kirk that I did a week or two ago. Which is probably unfair because it seems the only ex-player who has stated Kirk was a terrible person is DJK-after 21 years of Kirk coaching here.

 

[InGoodCo]

Rob was just doing his job. I have no problem with that.

As for DJK, accusing Kirk of arranging the police raid without any evidence is weak, it smears Kirk because people will believe it's true anyway, despite the lack of evidence.

But I have to say, I have a much lesser opinion of Kirk that I did a week or two ago. Which is probably unfair because it seems the only ex-player who has stated Kirk was a terrible person is DJK-after 21 years of Kirk coaching here.

I have a way different opinion today. I still believe that KF is a good man, a good leader of men and had well intentions. I can think that, but I can also recognize a few other things. When people say "How could Joe Pa not have known?" .... or "How could Rick Pitino not have known?" .... I now have to say "How could KF not have known?" - over 50 allegations of mistreatment under his watch? He doesn't "remember" certain cases that were brought to him? I'm not expecting perfection, but I am expecting better then that. Not to mention how awful the suppression of information we get from the program (twitter ban, limited access to the players, no freshman (they need to conform to the Iowa way) etc) looks in hind site.

 

[PCHawk]

Rob was just doing his job. I have no problem with that.

As for DJK, accusing Kirk of arranging the police raid without any evidence is weak, it smears Kirk because people will believe it's true anyway, despite the lack of evidence.

But I have to say, I have a much lesser opinion of Kirk that I did a week or two ago. Which is probably unfair because it seems the only ex-player who has stated Kirk was a terrible person is DJK-after 21 years of Kirk coaching here.

I'm not sure much has changed in my mind over the last week, because I already assumed it was happening. There are too many examples of Kirk playing one type of personality over another. I already assumed Doyle was an asshole to the team. Really the only surprise to me is he isn't a PC asshole.

 

[tweeterhawk]

Over at CryFan they’re speculating it was the university that forced Rob to pull the DJK story and that for licensing and other contractual obligations with the U Rob’s position and even this message board are in jeopardy.

 

[okeefe4prez]

Over at CryFan they’re speculating it was the university that forced Rob to pull the DJK story and that for licensing and other contractual obligations with the U Rob’s position and even this message board are in jeopardy.

I don't think the board has any license issues and the school would never be so direct in a threat for fear of a First Amendment lawsuit. But as I noted in my "In Defense of Rob" thread yesterday, some schools (and I'm not saying Iowa does this) will absolutely take a completely passive aggressive approach to any reporter who dares not to toe the party line.

People simply do not understand the risks Rob has taken. Agree with him or not, the guy has definitely put his ass on the line.

 

[tweeterhawk]

I don't think the board has any license issues and the school would never be so direct in a threat for fear of a First Amendment lawsuit. But as I noted in my "In Defense of Rob" thread yesterday, some schools (and I'm not saying Iowa does this) will absolutely take a completely passive aggressive approach to any reporter who dares not to toe the party line.

People simply do not understand the risks Rob has taken. Agree with him or not, the guy has definitely put his ass on the line.

“passive aggressive approach”

Hmmm. Never thought of that in regard to Kirk Ferentz and Iowa Football.

Interesting take.

 

[HawkGold]

I have a way different opinion today. I still believe that KF is a good man, a good leader of men and had well intentions. I can think that, but I can also recognize a few other things. When people say "How could Joe Pa not have known?" .... or "How could Rick Pitino not have known?" .... I now have to say "How could KF not have known?" - over 50 allegations of mistreatment under his watch? He doesn't "remember" certain cases that were brought to him? I'm not expecting perfection, but I am expecting better then that. Not to mention how awful the suppression of information we get from the program (twitter ban, limited access to the players, no freshman (they need to conform to the Iowa way) etc) looks in hind site.

Let me make a comparison. Navy Capt of a carrier is told to port at a country next to a pandemic. That neighbor is basically an adversary which has reasons to put a carrier out of service for 6 months. The visit is strictly political feel good. Sailors are interacting with local women.

Who is the good leader

1. One who refuses to go to port to protect his men and the ship

2. One who puts his men and ship at risk and then chastises leader ship for not caring about sick sailors and gives away intelligence to the adversary?

The good leader would be 1.

LF is making changes after the fact. A better man would have been on top of things.

These are not gray area accusations.

 

[okeefe4prez]

Let me make a comparison. Navy Capt of a carrier is told to port at a country next to a pandemic. That neighbor is basically an adversary which has reasons to put a carrier out of service for 6 months. The visit is strictly political feel good. Sailors are interacting with local women.

Who is the good leader

1. One who refuses to go to port to protect his men and the ship

2. One who puts his men and ship at risk and then chastises leader ship for not caring about sick sailors and gives away intelligence to the adversary?

The good leader would be 1.

LF is making changes after the fact. A better man would have been on top of things.

These are not gray area accusations.

What in the hell are you talking about? Watch this documentary about the Navy. In this clip at around the 35 second mark, that guy gets it. "We don't make policy..." #1 refusing an order is not a good leader. He's insubordinate.

 

[HawkGold]

What in the hell are you talking about? Watch this documentary about the Navy. In this clip at around the 35 second mark, that guy gets it. "We don't make policy..." #1 refusing an order is not a good leader. He's insubordinate.

Top Gun?

 

[HawkGold]

What in the hell are you talking about? Watch this documentary about the Navy. In this clip at around the 35 second mark, that guy gets it. "We don't make policy..." #1 refusing an order is not a good leader. He's insubordinate.

The officer likes lippy subordinates. Not kf

 

[SteveGarvey1]

The officer likes lippy subordinates. Not kf

Maverick = not Kirk's kind of guy.