im a little worried...

[SirJamaLot]

What do you think signing marginal players in the Spring is?

When you look back over the past four Hawkeye Basketball seasons, signing some impact players (Cartwright & Baasbe) in the spring is critical to turning this program around. Right now the Hawks need more talent if they are going to compete with the big boys in the big ten. Hopefully some positive news today.

 

[Lonoclone]

When you look back over the past four Hawkeye Basketball seasons, signing some impact players (Cartwright & Baasbe) in the spring is critical to turning this program around. Right now the Hawks need more talent if they are going to compete with the big boys in the big ten. Hopefully some positive news today.

Basabe isn't your typical spring signing, though. He committed to Fran in November of 2009 and followed him to Iowa. Not the same thing as a guy like Cartwright who Fran first showed interest to in the spring.

It's nice to be able to pick up impact players late, and you might do it from time to time, but guys like Cartwright are not the norm.

 

[HawkPhreek]

Over the years the spring period has really changed. So many coaching changes and transfers and kids who decide to sign late. Basketball is a unique sport where adding one or two kids can really change the dynamics of a program. The two players Iowa will add will make the team fast athletic. Iowa will be able to press run and gun. One of many things I like about Fran he is not adding people to add people if they don't help he doesn't recruit.

 

[SirJamaLot]

Basabe isn't your typical spring signing, though. He committed to Fran in November of 2009 and followed him to Iowa. Not the same thing as a guy like Cartwright who Fran first showed interest to in the spring.

It's nice to be able to pick up impact players late, and you might do it from time to time, but guys like Cartwright are not the norm.

When your program hits rock bottom you do whatever it takes (within rules) to improve your talent base. Why does it matter when you get recruits? Majority of true Hawkeye fans just want a better product to watch and Fran and staff are working their tails off recruiting.

 

[Lonoclone]

When your program hits rock bottom you do whatever it takes (within rules) to improve your talent base. Why does it matter when you get recruits? Majority of true Hawkeye fans just want a better product to watch and Fran and staff are working their tails off recruiting.

If they can play, it doesn't matter when you get them, but in the spring the talent pool is a lot shallower, especially for a team who has hit "rock bottom" as you said. Finding a guy like Cartwright is fantastic. He was a great find. However, counting on your coach to find game changers this late in game is not a recipe for success. Can it be done? Sure. But history shows that it's not as likely. And with that said, I think Hubbard could very well be a great find. The issues that have kept him unsigned thusfar are not typical of most spring signees.

 

[HawkPhreek]

Here is the one thing that I find funny. Yes Cartwright was a "good find" does the staff get zero credit for his development ? If you watched Cartwright before big ten season the during big ten season two different guys. Recruiting is just smoke, mirrors and stars. Development, System and Coaching are the true keys.

 

[CAARHawk]

I think we all agree that this year requires spring signings and we all also pretty much understand that this needs to be the last year that spring signing is a major component of the recruiting process.

Spring can be a strong component for top, top programs that get one and done types, because those teams can pick off the top of the heap. But it is a losing long range strategy for everyone else.

 

[HawkPhreek]

I think we all agree that this year requires spring signings and we all also pretty much understand that this needs to be the last year that spring signing is a major component of the recruiting process.

Spring can be a strong component for top, top programs that get one and done types, because those teams can pick off the top of the heap. But it is a losing long range strategy for everyone else.

Sure Ideally if you had three five scholarships open you like to have 3-4 players signed. Then looking to add a late bloomer or a kid who was let of LOI, or something along those lines.

 

[MJSCK]

Fran may have decided to get a pg in next year's class after Washpun chose to go elsewhere. If Washpun had committed, who would have been the better backup at pg, Washpun or Marble? Sure, Marble may not be playing his true position but Marble probably will play as well at the point, if not better, as a soph as Washpunanny would have played as a freshman. Plus, he can then offer a stud and show him the roster making almost certain the freshman walks into a starting job if he proves it.

Just an idea. Who really knows.

 

[JHHawk]

To deny that there a lot of talented players on the market in the spring is to ignore how many players have come on the market the last few weeks alone,simply due to coaching changes. That has changed in recent years. Now, schools release players without a second thought when their coaches move on. And more coaches are let go than ever before because of the huge contracts and all the pressure to win.
So,that makes spring a big factor in recruiting these days,like it or not.

As far as Basabe not being a typical spring recruit due to his commitment to Siena in the fall...no,that is the point, Basabe is exactly the kind of spring recruit that is ever-increasing due to coaching changes. If Basabe had not chosen to be loyal to Fran,he easily could have been playing in the Big East his past season as a late commitment to St Johns,or Seton Hall, ect.

The other factor in spring recruiting is that late bloomers get a second chance,and often 17yr old kids blossom in that senior year..no shock. It is like the NBA wants to have a 2 year rule for early entry...more time to evaluate kids that are still developing physically and mentally. You can avoid a JR Angle type of situation where you offer a kid as a sophmore and he never gets better.

 

[Auggie]

To deny that there a lot of talented players on the market in the spring is to ignore how many players have come on the market the last few weeks alone,simply due to coaching changes. That has changed in recent years. Now, schools release players without a second thought when their coaches move on. And more coaches are let go than ever before because of the huge contracts and all the pressure to win.
So,that makes spring a big factor in recruiting these days,like it or not.

As far as Basabe not being a typical spring recruit due to his commitment to Siena in the fall...no,that is the point, Basabe is exactly the kind of spring recruit that is ever-increasing due to coaching changes. If Basabe had not chosen to be loyal to Fran,he easily could have been playing in the Big East his past season as a late commitment to St Johns,or Seton Hall, ect.

The other factor in spring recruiting is that late bloomers get a second chance,and often 17yr old kids blossom in that senior year..no shock. It is like the NBA wants to have a 2 year rule for early entry...more time to evaluate kids that are still developing physically and mentally. You can avoid a JR Angle type of situation where you offer a kid as a sophmore and he never gets better.

Sort of, I get what your saying, but, Basabe wasn't really on the open market. He had committed to Siena and decided to follow McCaffery to Iowa. If he had not, he wouldn't be playing at a Big East school, he'd be at Siena. However, that is to the detriment of the Big East schools who did not recruit him as obviously there were plenty of them he could have helped.

 

[Auggie]

You mean marginal players like Cartwright and Basabe?
Or Kentucky's Terrance Jones,John Wall and Brandon Knight?

Yea,only marginal players sign in the spring.

Ok, some extreme examples...........I would say there are a handful of guys each year who can considered very good players. But, we both know that you can't count on the Spring signing period to provide the players a program needs.

 

[Auggie]

I think you missed the point. I'm not surprised.

Burky, why so harsh dude? We're talking Hawkeye recruiting.......thats all it is. No need to be snarky.
Or, help me out by using smaller words.

 

[Auggie]

I think we all agree that this year requires spring signings and we all also pretty much understand that this needs to be the last year that spring signing is a major component of the recruiting process.

Spring can be a strong component for top, top programs that get one and done types, because those teams can pick off the top of the heap. But it is a losing long range strategy for everyone else.

This. Couldn't agree more.

 

[sportstalent]

Here is the one thing that I find funny. Yes Cartwright was a "good find" does the staff get zero credit for his development ? If you watched Cartwright before big ten season the during big ten season two different guys. Recruiting is just smoke, mirrors and stars. Development, System and Coaching are the true keys.

You hit it on the head here, Cartwright and Basabe both looked out of place prior to the Big Ten season. Cartwright was a turnover in waiting and Basabe looked lost.

Development is far overlooked in a lot of cases, but it can't be at Iowa, if there is not player development going on, Iowa gets blown out of many games. Iowa is in a good position right now with the three new players coming in compared to the one going out and I was one of Cole's biggest fans, what he endured at Iowa until his Senior year shows character.
If Iowa can bring in one or two more quality players as they already have, they will be in an even better position. OSU and Michigan are the only two proven teams coming back next year, there will be opportunity to move up in a big way.

 

[JHHawk]

Sort of, I get what your saying, but, Basabe wasn't really on the open market. He had committed to Siena and decided to follow McCaffery to Iowa. If he had not, he wouldn't be playing at a Big East school, he'd be at Siena. However, that is to the detriment of the Big East schools who did not recruit him as obviously there were plenty of them he could have helped.

Look at the schools whose coaches leave:
Tenn- Ware bailed
Dayton- 2 recruits bailed
Providence- 2 recruits bailed
Ga Tech- recruits bailing

Anymore, it is an upset if a kid stays with the school they signed the LOI with in the fall if the coach is sent packing in the spring.
Basabe might very well have gone on the open market last spring if he had not followed Fran to Iowa.

I am not saying you make a regular living with spring recruits,but certainly there are talented recruits out there every spring anymore. Just because the often end up at KU or Ky does not mean that Iowa could not nab one here and there.
Plus,jucos are often grabbed in the spring to plug a hole,and I expect that to continue to happen at Iowa occasionally.

 

[jacknicholson]

Just my two cents:
Recruiting and winning is not something that can be improved overnight especially in the positon Iowa basketball was in last year. Recruiting and winning are like the egg and chicken scenario and you have to build both of them simultaneously to succeed. McCaffery and staff are trying to build a program that kids will want to come to. For kids to want to come to Iowa they have to see that they can win. The first step McCaffery and staff needed to do is keep the current team stable and limit the exodus of players with McCafferey experience. For the most part they did that. Without another player added the current team experience and development that should automatically make for a better team next year. The second thing he needed to do is at least start getting Iowa to be considered by some highly sought after recruits and land some guys that can make the team better. He has done that by being highly considered by Guerror and Katenda and landing White, Oglesby and possibly Hubbard. We did not get Guerro and probably not Katenda but by being considered he has shown that he is making progress with recruiting. If the current team and recruits are better next year than this year, then instead of missing on both Guerro and Katenda we may get one of them. Then the year after that when our team is even better then we may get 2 players with that ability. When that happens then we start seeing expotential improvement in the wins/losses and tournament participation. Fran knows what he is doing by not just signing players to fill scholarships. When you sign a player you are basically committing that scholarship for 4 years. By signing someone who does not improve the team that could undermine his delicate balance of team improvement year over year and thus derail his improvement in wins and recruiting. With this philosophy, which in my mind is a very smart way to build a sustainable program, the win/loss progress will be slow early (year 1 and 2) but gain expotentially as we land higher quality recruits, develop players and execute Fran's entire system. Always remember when you start questioning Fran and staff (which is a very natural thing to do) that he has done this same process 3 times before and has learned and refined his strategy every time.

Keep the faith Hawkeye fans!!! Here is my future prediction for the program. I think when Basabe, McCabe and Marble are juniors this team will surprise some folks by being a top 5 Big Ten team and go to the NCAA. Then when they are seniors we will be back in the national spotlight vying for a Big Ten title and a Top 15 team nationally..... Then the program will start rolling with even bigger things ahead!!

I like it. Very good optimistic post. I happen to feel the same way. It is probably a good thing not to just fill a scholarship because one is available. Fran is filling scholarships with the recruits who can play the game his way with athleticism and ability.

 

[SirJamaLot]

You hit it on the head here, Cartwright and Basabe both looked out of place prior to the Big Ten season. Cartwright was a turnover in waiting and Basabe looked lost.

Development is far overlooked in a lot of cases, but it can't be at Iowa, if there is not player development going on, Iowa gets blown out of many games. Iowa is in a good position right now with the three new players coming in compared to the one going out and I was one of Cole's biggest fans, what he endured at Iowa until his Senior year shows character.
If Iowa can bring in one or two more quality players as they already have, they will be in an even better position. OSU and Michigan are the only two proven teams coming back next year, there will be opportunity to move up in a big way.

agreed, nobody develops football players better than Ferentz's staff, hopefully Fran will have the same reputation if he doesn't already!

 

[SirJamaLot]

This. Couldn't agree more.

I think the spring signing will continue to grow in importance because there is very little job security for coaches and today's players are very impulsive, plus too many kids jump to the NBA too early and leave some big voids.

Look at Texas and Kansas this spring, they are both scrambling to fill their scholarships, Lets say Hubbard is better than advertised and decides to go pro after 1 yr, again that would leave us scrambling in the spring to fill a scholarship.

Another factor is immediate playing time, look at Cully, no way was he going to settle for backup point guard, he preferred the Horizen League over coming off the bench.

Actually spring recruiting gives the fans something to follow during the off season.

 

[burky247]

Burky, why so harsh dude? We're talking Hawkeye recruiting.......thats all it is. No need to be snarky.
Or, help me out by using smaller words.

Ha. I wasn't taking a shot at you. I was taking one at myself for not expanding on my original post. That's why I went into more depth on the second one.

We good Auggie...we good.