How many teams and thoughts of Big 10 expansion

HawkeyeMike23 said:
There is no way the Big Ten goes to 16 teams without including Texas or Notre Dame. One interesting scenario I saw was the Big Ten adding two teams first, possibly Rutgers and Missouri, schools that would open up new markets for the B10 network, allow for a conference championship game and also start a chain reaction in the other conferences. As teams start to reevaluate their conference situation, schools, like Notre Dame, might realize that there are going to be some major changes coming and now's there best chance to get into the B10.
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This would be a really bad idea. The other leagues are already working behind the scenes in negotiation. You want to be able to be the one that dictates the terms, which means you want as many choices as possible. If the Big Ten adds 2, then waits, other leagues are going to snatch up other teams, limiting the Big Ten's negotiating power.

However, if it was up to me and I was running the Big Ten I would go to 18 teams and add Rutgers, Nebby, ND, Mizzou, Syracuse, Pitt, and Kansas. Each league would play 8 games in their half of the conference and then play a ninth game based on final conference play standings. The game between the top two teams would be played at a neutral site and all the other games would rotate each with one conference hosting games one year and vice versa.

So If Iowa won the west and OSU won the east they would play at say Soldier Field. Then if Nebby was second in the west and UM was second in the east they would play at the home field of either school, based on the rotation.

The West would be
Nebby
ND
Wisky
Iowa
Minnesota
Kansas
Missouri
Illinois
NW

The East would be

UM
OSU
PSU
Syracuse
Rutgers
Pitt
Indiana
Purdue
MSU

While the football match-ups would be compelling, (Come on, would you really be that bummed about switching Nebby and ND for OSU and Michigan- particularly if you had a chance to play one of these teams at the end of the season?) the basketball match-ups could be just as good. The Big Ten Basketball tournament would be epic!
 
CAARHawk said:
This would be a really bad idea. The other leagues are already working behind the scenes in negotiation. You want to be able to be the one that dictates the terms, which means you want as many choices as possible. If the Big Ten adds 2, then waits, other leagues are going to snatch up other teams, limiting the Big Ten's negotiating power.

However, if it was up to me and I was running the Big Ten I would go to 18 teams and add Rutgers, Nebby, ND, Mizzou, Syracuse, Pitt, and Kansas. Each league would play 8 games in their half of the conference and then play a ninth game based on final conference play standings. The game between the top two teams would be played at a neutral site and all the other games would rotate each with one conference hosting games one year and vice versa.

So If Iowa won the west and OSU won the east they would play at say Soldier Field. Then if Nebby was second in the west and UM was second in the east they would play at the home field of either school, based on the rotation.

The West would be
Nebby
ND
Wisky
Iowa
Minnesota
Kansas
Missouri
Illinois
NW

The East would be

UM
OSU
PSU
Syracuse
Rutgers
Pitt
Indiana
Purdue
MSU

While the football match-ups would be compelling, (Come on, would you really be that bummed about switching Nebby and ND for OSU and Michigan- particularly if you had a chance to play one of these teams at the end of the season?) the basketball match-ups could be just as good. The Big Ten Basketball tournament would be epic!
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How would adding two teams now limit the B10's negotiating power? If anything it would increase it, they would now have access to the NYC and STL and KC markets, a larger network footprint for the B10 network and the Big East and B12 would now be weaker. The B10 wouldn't stop negotiating with other teams, they would just be forcing their hand even more.
 
Lots of noise about footprint- while important, I believe the B10 is more likely to choose teams that have a larger following over footprint. Expanded markets being what they are- you can't tell me that a Rutgers vs Iowa game is going to have more national appeal than a Nebraska vs Iowa game just because it's in the NYC market. Well you CAN tell me, but that will be your opinion vs mine.
 
PlanoHawk said:
Lots of noise about footprint- while important, I believe the B10 is more likely to choose teams that have a larger following over footprint. Expanded markets being what they are- you can't tell me that a Rutgers vs Iowa game is going to have more national appeal than a Nebraska vs Iowa game just because it's in the NYC market. Well you CAN tell me, but that will be your opinion vs mine.
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If teams that matter start going to Rutgers, the NYC media will notice. NYC loves sports period, and when Ohio State, Michigan, and Penn St. start going to Jersey, the NYC media will notice.
 
GhostofBTT said:
If teams that matter start going to Rutgers, the NYC media will notice. NYC loves sports period, and when Ohio State, Michigan, and Penn St. start going to Jersey, the NYC media will notice.
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You don't know NYC very well, they (not the media) could care less about college football.
 
HawkeyeMike23 said:
How would adding two teams now limit the B10's negotiating power? If anything it would increase it, they would now have access to the NYC and STL and KC markets, a larger network footprint for the B10 network and the Big East and B12 would now be weaker. The B10 wouldn't stop negotiating with other teams, they would just be forcing their hand even more.
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The reason it would limit the Big Ten's negotiating power is that the SEC, ACC, and PAC Ten would then jump the Big Ten in number of teams. The Big Ten gave them the idea and they all love it. The other power leagues have visions of television networks, etc. However, no other league is strong enough yet to start it's own network. The SEC, outside Florida, has one city in the top 30 in viewing population, Nashville. They need to raise that number. If you leave teams on the table in more populated areas, they would jump on them, same goes for the ACC. Say you leave Pitt on the table. What is to stop the ACC from making a run and Pitt, WVU, and Syracuse? That would make that league number one in the North/Mid East and would significantly limit their claim to the North East market.
 
Going to 16 teams (or even 18 teams) would be atrocious with the 2 division, round-robin system. In the 18 team scenario on this thread, Iowa would have no guaranteed games with OSU, Michigan or PSU. Iowa could go ten or even twenty years without playing those teams. I'm pretty sure a lot of Western Division universities would prevent this from happening due to losing these guaranteed games. Even going to 16 teams with 2 divisions of 8 teams would be a mess, since 8 conference games would guarantee a game with OSU or Michigan (if they were in the other division) only every 8 years and going to 9 conference games only every 4 years. I think if the Big Ten goes to 16+ teams they will have to get a more creative than the 2 division system.
 
CAARHawk said:
The reason it would limit the Big Ten's negotiating power is that the SEC, ACC, and PAC Ten would then jump the Big Ten in number of teams. The Big Ten gave them the idea and they all love it. The other power leagues have visions of television networks, etc. However, no other league is strong enough yet to start it's own network. The SEC, outside Florida, has one city in the top 30 in viewing population, Nashville. They need to raise that number. If you leave teams on the table in more populated areas, they would jump on them, same goes for the ACC. Say you leave Pitt on the table. What is to stop the ACC from making a run and Pitt, WVU, and Syracuse? That would make that league number one in the North/Mid East and would significantly limit their claim to the North East market.
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Why would teams quickly jump to other conferences if they knew the Big Ten was still looking to add more teams? These other conferences can not offer a revenue stream like the B10 can, no one is going to be quickly jumping to the ACC to make half the money they could in the Big Ten. And who would the SEC take that the B10 wants? Texas? There's no way Texas would join the SEC because of their academics. Every team would want to wait to see if they could get into the B10 before jumping to another conference.
 
PJHawk said:
You don't know NYC very well, they (not the media) could care less about college football.
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NYC pulls in HUGE numbers for college football. The interest is definately there. There is no argument to be made that NYC love CFB.

However, look at the teams that go through Rutgers. Cincy, Syracuse, Pitt, South Florida? Do you think the NYC media cares about that?

Now, imagine if Ohio State, Penn St., and Michigan were to travel into the metro NY area. Do you think they would pay attention? Obviously they would. If Rutgers starts playing teams that people care about, Rutgers will get more attention.
 
Which expansion scenario would be best for Iowa? 12, 14, or 16 teams? Increased BTN $$$ vs. Iowa ever seeing a BCS game again?
 
CAARHawk said:
However, if it was up to me and I was running the Big Ten I would go to 18 teams and add Rutgers, Nebby, ND, Mizzou, Syracuse, Pitt, and Kansas. Each league would play 8 games in their half of the conference and then play a ninth game based on final conference play standings. The game between the top two teams would be played at a neutral site and all the other games would rotate each with one conference hosting games one year and vice versa.


The West would be
Nebby
ND
Wisky
Iowa
Minnesota
Kansas
Missouri
Illinois
NW

The East would be

UM
OSU
PSU
Syracuse
Rutgers
Pitt
Indiana
Purdue
MSU
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I like this idea of going to 18 teams. I would break it up a bit differently though. I would say keep the "original Big 10 as best you can"

Old School Division:
Iowa
Michigan
Ohio St
Wisconsin
Minnesota
Illinois
Michigan St.
Purdue
Indiana

New School Division:
Penn St.
Notre Dame
Nebraska
Kansas
Missouri
Syracuse
Rutgers
Pitt
Northwestern (one team would have to move...)
 
Ghost, what are these huge numbers for ColFB that you speak of in the NYC area? Are you... just generalizing or do you know some huge ratings numbers that you're referring back to? Not trying to call you out, but I question that they are better or even in line with other professional sports.

NYC is an attractive market for footprint, but I still think Nebraska is one of the first teams added based on their football following and pedigree.
 
deanvogs said:
I like this idea of going to 18 teams. I would break it up a bit differently though. I would say keep the "original Big 10 as best you can"

Old School Division:
Iowa
Michigan
Ohio St
Wisconsin
Minnesota
Illinois
Michigan St.
Purdue
Indiana

New School Division:
Penn St.
Notre Dame
Nebraska
Kansas
Missouri
Syracuse
Rutgers
Pitt
Northwestern (one team would have to move...)
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Yeah, I agree. This is a WAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYY better option. Also, it would get freaking NU off the schedule. I hate those pesky ****y cats.

Wouldn't this be an awesome set-up? Both divisions would have huge games. Both would have good East/West travel, as well as close rivalries. Also, both divisions are fairly well-balanced.

Finally, I could see NU going for it as they have a bunch of Wall Street based alumni and would definitely see an affinity with ND.

COME ON DELANEY! GET IT DONE!
 
deanvogs said:
I like this idea of going to 18 teams. I would break it up a bit differently though. I would say keep the "original Big 10 as best you can"

Old School Division:
Iowa
Michigan
Ohio St
Wisconsin
Minnesota
Illinois
Michigan St.
Purdue
Indiana

New School Division:
Penn St.
Notre Dame
Nebraska
Kansas
Missouri
Syracuse
Rutgers
Pitt
Northwestern (one team would have to move...)
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Bad idea. New vs. Old would mean Iowa would hardly ever play against Nebraska, Notre Dame, or Missouri.
 
GhostofBTT said:
NYC pulls in HUGE numbers for college football. The interest is definately there. There is no argument to be made that NYC love CFB.
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It's one thing to post that as part of your contrarian jack@ss routine but if you actually believe that you are effin nuts. No one has ever considered NYC a college sports town by any stretch of the imagination.

NYC has always been a baseball town and the most popular teams in the NYC metro are the Yanks and Mets, the NFL follows close behind then a fairly large drop to the NBA, ditto for the NHL with men’s college sports a distant last.
 
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PJHawk said:
It's one thing to post that as part of your contrarian jack@ss routine but if you actually believe that you are effin nuts. No one has ever considered NYC a college sports town by any stretch of the imagination.

NYC has always been a baseball town and the most popular teams in the NYC metro are the Yanks and Mets, the NFL follows close behind then a fairly large drop to the NBA, ditto for the NHL with men’s college sports a distant last.
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I never said that college football will be the most popular game in town. No one thinks that. However, people in New York love sports. That is indisputable.

Let me ask you this. Just because you love college football, does that make you want to watch another sport less? Does being a fan of the Iowa Hawkeyes prevent you from being a NFL or MLB fan? Of course not. Just because New York loves the Yankees and Giants doesn't mean they don't care about CFB. The ratings in the NY metro area are just as large for ABC and ESPN CFB as anywhere else.

Unfortunately, I cannot link that info, since my source is subscription based, but I'm sure you take my word for it;).


Further more, ratings for CFB have simply exploded nationally for all networks broadcasting it. CFB is the second largest sport in the country, and football is a national game (unlike baseball which is regional, and pro basketball which is primarily popular in cities). CFB has national appeal, and the NY metro has the largest audience (20 million).
 
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