High School Officials

[HawkGold]

This kid would make a good official.

 

[Fryowa]

I may have posted this previously, but this happened at the Iowa State Soccer Tournament this past summer.

Whoa, I never saw that. I’m surprised it didn’t get protested or something, it was a great move but I don’t think the ref could’ve enforced it. Can you imagine if someone did that at a football game?

 

[westender]

Your ump stories remind me of an umpire in Eastern Iowa oh wow...45-50 years ago. His name was Joe Stires (SP). About 5'6", 110 lbs, my guess maybe 70 years old. No lie his glasses were about 3" thick. Most distinctive strike call...lol great memories. He had a big chest protector, you could hardly see him.

He was the proprietor of Joe's Pool Hall in Winthrop, Iowa. Pretty sure that is the dude of who you speak.

 

[westender]

Your ump stories remind me of an umpire in Eastern Iowa oh wow...45-50 years ago. His name was Joe Stires (SP). About 5'6", 110 lbs, my guess maybe 70 years old. No lie his glasses were about 3" thick. Most distinctive strike call...lol great memories. He had a big chest protector, you could hardly see him.

he was an old dude.

https://wcfcourier.com/news/top_new...cle_6eb133ae-b4ea-5982-a2df-1a72cf83ce46.html

 

[Robowe]

Whoa, I never saw that. I’m surprised it didn’t get protested or something, it was a great move but I don’t think the ref could’ve enforced it. Can you imagine if someone did that at a football game?

No, I can't imagine. Here's a link to the WHO TV story with video ... and I was wrong, this was just substate. Marshalltown ended up winning anyway when the backup goalie makes a save in the shootout (after starter was yellow carded).

https://whotv.com/2019/05/25/refere...fanbase-during-wild-finish-in-substate-final/

 

[Robowe]

How about this youth umpire ... lady jokes about his height and he says goodbye ...

 

[Fryowa]

How about this youth umpire ... lady jokes about his height and he says goodbye ...

Lol, F those parents.

At first I was wondering why his partner wasn’t Johnny on the spot but that dude was flying solo. He was already doing them a favor by working single.

This is why you ALWAYS get your check before setting foot on the field, and avoid non sanctioned games like Legion or USSSA where you have literally no one in your corner.

Sibley-Ocheyedan's former AD (the one they have now is a super great guy) was a real motherfucker, and he used to make you come find him for checks after games so he could get in your face and blast you before you left. He thought he was tough shit and liked to tell sports officials what he thought of 'em. For those of you who don't officiate the standard is to give officials checks before games so they can get the hell out and don't have to interact with pissed off coaches or ADs.

When I was a kid I always wondered why refs and umps almost sprinted off the field after games and didn't stick around to talk or shake hands.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

It isn't, but the situation is actually worse in central Iowa comparatively. Several times a week the IAHSAA sends out emails with 40 or 50 schools needing umps that same night and the vast majority are down there. The bigger population obviously has a lot to do with it...

Are you finding basketball games getting a crew of two referees or is it to the point where a HS game might only have one refereeing a game?

 

[MelroseHawkins]

Be a great gig for college kids to get in on part time. But nobody wants to cut out their free time for it regardless of age. Your talking about games starting at 6 usually running till 9 or 10 or 1030 before your on your way home. The dudes in their mid 20s to 40 all have families and chasing their own around. Older folks then that are just saying it's not worth it to them with all the backlash you mentioned etc. Which I have no clue how to fix. To me it's common sense how to conduct yourself at such things and for those that don't have it how can you instill it?

Man, it would be a great gig and great pay for young people. I'm going to recommend to my boys when they are old enough to do it. One can pick and choose tournaments or games to do, one can do as many as they want, there is always a shortage so enough work. Doing something you like and still being around the games, etc..

 

[MelroseHawkins]

It'd be huge for college kids. If you hit it hard you could easily clear 5 grand in a couple months. On top of that you could have a day job, or at least not have to work so much during the day.

That's part of the drawback. We lose a lot of guys to softball because of it. In Iowa JV games generally start at 5:30, Varsity first pitch is 7:30. 9:30 you're usually heading to your car, 20 minutes to get changed and review the game with your partner, and usually a half hour drive home. Then laundry for the next night's games.

Usually the softball umps are heading home during the 4th inning of the baseball game and sometimes earlier.

They definitely need to get tougher on coaches. There are a couple long-term basketball refs in the system (I don't do basketball) petitioning for coaches to be required to sit on the bench at all times. In baseball there's a push for coach ejections to result in an immediate forfeit (not helpful if they're losing anyway) and a 5 contest suspension. But, good luck with that because every official has a different level of shit they're willing to take. As far as the crowd, they need to bite the bullet and follow other states' examples and allow officials to toss spectators. In Iowa you're forbidden to address the crowd whatsoever; you're supposed to go find the school rep and have them handle it.

The problem comes when the rep is the one dishing out the abuse. I'm gonna go ahead and lay this out because, well, eff this guy--but Tim Snyder (Brandon Snyder's dad) is West Lyon's elementary principal and the biggest, most insufferable douche rocket you'll ever come across in NW Iowa. We've all seen the type...knows all sports better than every official, yadda yadda. He camps out under the basket every home game and counts out loud to 10 every time the visitors inbound, and then every time West Lyon is on the D end he's yelling "FOUR ONE THOUSAND, FIVE ONE THOUSAND..." One of my coworkers walked by him at the end of a game last year and thanked him for keeping track of the backcourt time and Snyder chased his ass down like Fran. Then no one had the key to the locker room so they had to stand there and listen to him flip out. My buddy should have kept his mouth shut, but at the same time how do you toss the guy who's supposed to be keeping order? It's a no win situation.

Side note, Brandon coached WL freshman baseball last year, and I've got a few stories about that dude too. Let's just say that apple landed right at the bottom of the tree.

All in all though it's 99% parents. People can deal with long hours and low pay if they love the sport, but when some soccer mom painting her nails who's never played a sport in her life starts telling you what a piece of shit you are because Kayden looked at three fastballs in a row, it wears on ya a little.

Is it different with USSSA baseball? I've been to a few games where spectators were tossed. Yea, the shitick you all have to put up with is horrible.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

We had two freshman games get canceled up here last season. Which sucks because not all teams can even put a freshman team together anymore. When they get enough kids it's a shame to cancel on em.

I've done single ump before and have no problem doing that for freshman stuff. It's actually kind of nice calling balls and strikes from behind the mound.

This punishes the players. Just to make sure the players get the game in, can't the coaches step in to officiate the game, even if kind of treating like an organized scrimmage?

 

[MelroseHawkins]

I'm gonna sound like an asshole for this, but as a HS coach, if you do put your name in for this:

KNOW THE GAME

The amount of farcical calls I witnessed this season was insane. I realize that it is a volunteer job, but when it gets to the point that the kids' experience is being hindered every week, it's extremely frustrating. There's a ref in our area that loves to be the center of attention, and as such will make ticky-tack calls all game against both teams.

You know you made me google "farcical" azzhole!


To your point. This absolutely drives me nuts. The proverbial official who just because they have a whistle in their mouth thinks they have to blow it. Manufactured calls or not leaning on the side of NOT calling something if on the fence or not obvious. The very best officials are not noticed, kind of like offensive linemen. If fans know their names, that's not good.

Officials need to NOT be part of the game.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

Lol, F those parents.

At first I was wondering why his partner wasn’t Johnny on the spot but that dude was flying solo. He was already doing them a favor by working single.

This is why you ALWAYS get your check before setting foot on the field, and avoid non sanctioned games like Legion or USSSA where you have literally no one in your corner.

Sibley-Ocheyedan's former AD (the one they have now is a super great guy) was a real motherfucker, and he used to make you come find him for checks after games so he could get in your face and blast you before you left. He thought he was tough shit and liked to tell sports officials what he thought of 'em. For those of you who don't officiate the standard is to give officials checks before games so they can get the hell out and don't have to interact with pissed off coaches or ADs.

When I was a kid I always wondered why refs and umps almost sprinted off the field after games and didn't stick around to talk or shake hands.

Find and dandy until refs and umps stopped doing Sibley-Ocheyedan's games. Then what does the school do? Should go back on the AD.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

You guys won't believe this but I've actually never said a word to a spectator. I let it roll off; I apparently have whatever gene it is that makes me not care if someone is mad at me (unless I deserve it)

I've had coaches lose their minds over calls before, but generally when you give them a warning they back off. It's when officials let it keep going that it gets bad. You have to nicely jump on it right away.

If I get a screamer coach, I generally call time out and walk over to him. When you're 60 feet apart and both have to yell at each other to be heard, two things happen...

1) You don't hear what the other is saying and it leads to more of a shit show than you started with, and

2) When you're conversing at a distance the crowd can hear you and those idiots are like a school of piranhas. Whatever you do keep the crowd out of it and don't yell back because they can hear you and they know you can't kick them out.

I usually say something to the effect of, "Mike/Bill/Tom (never call them "Coach"), you can be mad at me if you want, but we're not going to do this right now. Neither one of us has time for it." I'll explain the call if I can (under no circumstances ever throw your partner under the bus), and then I start walking away. If he follows and keeps ranting I let him know that it's going to be an ejection, and if that doesn't do it or he says something insulting I do the heave ho. I think I've ejected coaches maybe four times in my life, the vast majority let it rest after they blow a little steam off. Either way I try not to let it go more than 30-40 seconds for the whole exchange. After that you look unprofessional and look like you're not in control of the game.

Players it happens more and obviously your tolerance for BS is way lower. High school boys are hormoned up, and after watching pro athletes argue on TV they get funny ideas. Last year the only kid I tossed was a freshman first baseman, he didn't like a safe call, told my partner "That was bullshit," and got tossed. On his way out he turned around to my partner and goes, "Whatever man, that's fine." If it were my son he'd be done playing sports for the rest of his high school career, but that's just me.

Again, I know you guys won't believe it, but there are officials who toss a hell of a lot more people than me. Some are thin skinned, and some don't know how to deescalate.

This is because it pents up and you take it out on us!

 

[MelroseHawkins]

That's an outstanding idea.

I do 3rd-6th grade rec games in our town (non travel ball stuff) to help out when I'm free, I might just take it upon myself to do that next time before a game. Our rec director might shit a brick, but whatever...

I do know one local youth tournament around here every summer they have a rule that umpires can kick spectators out, and they don't start the game again until said fan is at least three blocks away. They even have a map showing the boundaries of how far away you have to go before they continue.

Oh yea, you end up getting the proverbial pear-assed dad or fan who gets kicked out that does the trolling of the R field fence line to the outfield thinking if they go off by their self it is fine. It's always funny because the ump will follow them and keep pointing yelling "Nope, you need to go out there farther, out of the park".

 

[Fryowa]

Is it different with USSSA baseball? I've been to a few games where spectators were tossed. Yea, the shitick you all have to put up with is horrible.

In American Legion and USSSA ball yoiu can remove spectators, but the problem (at least what I've seen in the rural Midwest) is that parents are typically the only ones in the crowd, and a lot of them are involved with the the league itself as volunteers, etc. So, if you're in a BFE South Dakota town with a crowd of say, 75 home team parents...

If a couple of them start getting obnoxious and won't cool it, 1) There aren't usually other level-headed parents there to keep the bad ones in check because they're all friends, and 2) what can you do if you eject someone and they refuse to leave? Technically the American Legion rules say you can, but good luck. You're not a cop or landowner or whatever, so now you just ejected someone in front of their buddies and you look like an idiot because they'll call your bluff and ride you harder. That's where the guy in the tweet above just said, "F this, I'm outta here."

Which is why I stick to Iowa high school balk as much as possible.

Players who get ejected in IAHSAA schools have to at least face some consequences--they get a suspension, have to sit through a sportsmanship video, and they get more consequences as it happens again. I know my town's school goes beyond the state minimums; players get in deep shit for being tossed. Coaches too. They have an AD and school board to answer to, and some of the shit I've heard legion and USSSA coaches say would get them fired from a school in a heartbeat.

 

[Fryowa]

Are you finding basketball games getting a crew of two referees or is it to the point where a HS game might only have one refereeing a game?

Basketball doesn't seem to be too bad around here, but NW Iowa is a basketball-first area. The real problems are baseball and football.

We're an hour away from the nearest AAU program, so we don't lose refs to that stuff typically, or at least not enough to be a problem. Most schools have basketball refs booked a couple years out and I've heard it can be tough to get games since a lot of crews stick together.

 

[okeefe4prez]

How about this youth umpire ... lady jokes about his height and he says goodbye ...

My old lady's parents in Japan live less than 100m away from a middle school that houses a field they use for baseball. Probably 12-14 year old kids. Whenever I visit, I have jet lag and am up super early. Every morning other than Sunday the kids who play baseball are out in the neighborhood picking up trash and sweeping the streets near the school at 6 AM sharp. When they have games, the only discernible speech from parents and the kids watching is the Japanese word for "come on, let's go." Nothing else. No one, absolutely no one, would question the authority of the guy umping the game.

The utter lack of respect some of these shitbirds in this video show is just unreal. I don't know how in the hell our country has turned into such monsters. My boy's gonna spend his summers in Japan and I hope some of their respect rubs off on him because if he grows up to be like any of the assholes in that video, I will consider myself a colossal failure.

 

[MelroseHawkins]

I've been on both sides of this issue. I have done a lot of umping in baseball and softball and officiating in basketball. I have also been a coach in both.

In basketball, the game moves SO fast anymore - and I never even once got the benefit of officiating as a part of the (now standard) 3-man crew. Mine were always two, and half the time in the early days, my co-official was such a bozo, he didn't remember to blow his whistle if there was a foul. I finally found a fantastic partner, and we worked well together. I retired when he moved to southern Illinois.

But we took charge of the games, and called them close - especially in the early minutes of the game (it always paid dividends later on). I only had trouble with one coach, and I handled it just the way FryIowa did. I also only ever had trouble with one spectator - and I had to inform my wife that if she ever did that again, I would instruct the other official to have her removed (true story).

As for baseball/softball, know the rules - and for crying out loud, PAY ATTENTION. The one time I went nearly postal as a base coach was when my team was in a major rally, and we were going ahead on a fly ball that the center fielder tried to field but dropped - it went behind him a couple of steps, where he then picked up the ball and threw it back into the infield.

That is until both of my runners were called out. The one umpire said that neither of my players had tagged up. I was so dumb-founded at what he said that he started to try to explain the rule to me - when I informed him that was only when the player catches the ball. Somehow, NEITHER UMPIRE saw that the ball had been dropped, even though he had to walk behind him to pick it up.

Close plays are close plays - and you learn the techniques for how to best manage those. But to this day (that was a LONG time ago), I do not know what I was to have done differently in something that was SO obvious, akin to calling a home run when someone strikes out. But aside from that, I let umpires be umpires - and usually they do a good job - and I try to.

Ah, you had to helicopter dad coach your girl and boy thru youth sports, because nobody else can do it better. Yea, I luv you #uckers!!

 

[Fryowa]

I'm gonna sound like an asshole for this, but as a HS coach, if you do put your name in for this:

KNOW THE GAME

The amount of farcical calls I witnessed this season was insane. I realize that it is a volunteer job, but when it gets to the point that the kids' experience is being hindered every week, it's extremely frustrating. There's a ref in our area that loves to be the center of attention, and as such will make ticky-tack calls all game against both teams.

Obviously don't want to get in a pissing match, but it goes both ways for sure. There are just as many hack coaches as umpires (or any officials). I've coached varsity ball, and I always tell people (and still believe) that to be hired as a high chool coach, the person should have to pass the rules test and officiate a minimum of 15 varsity level contests in that sport. There are states that are considering that.

Coaches can get a certificate and get hired to coach a sport with zero knowledge of the rules, yet we hold moonlighting officials with full-time jobs to the fire...there's a double standard there.

I will also go on record as saying I will--for free--set a prospective coach up with enough gear to ump for a year and even get them games. And not bare minimum, either. You will look like Joe fuckin' West out there.

That's how strongly I feel about it.