Hawks better off in NIT this year

[hawkeyebob62]

Look, I "get" that we are enjoying a nice NIT run. I "get" that it means more games, experience, etc. But, PLEASE, let's not let an NIT "run" lull us into thinking it is EVER preferrable to an NCAA bid. Ever.

 

[ssckelley]

Look, I "get" that we are enjoying a nice NIT run. I "get" that it means more games, experience, etc. But, PLEASE, let's not let an NIT "run" lull us into thinking it is EVER preferrable to an NCAA bid. Ever.

uhhhh no, after this season none of us will be to happy to get NIT invitations unless it is for the preseason NIT.

 

[tm3308]

Look, I "get" that we are enjoying a nice NIT run. I "get" that it means more games, experience, etc. But, PLEASE, let's not let an NIT "run" lull us into thinking it is EVER preferrable to an NCAA bid. Ever.

There ARE times when it's more beneficial for them to play in the NIT. For a young team that has struggled closing out close games, an NIT berth was going to give them a better chance to improve than a first or second round loss (which is the most likely outcome of an NCAA berth for this team) would have.

 

[hawkeyebob62]

uhhhh no, after this season none of us will be to happy to get NIT invitations unless it is for the preseason NIT.

<<uhhhh no,...>>

Really? Look at the thread title. Witness the circle jerk going on between the OP and several of the Pavlov's Dogs roaming the boards today.

An NIT run is fun to watch, but it NEVER beats an NCAA appearance, whether one-and-done or Sweet Sixteen and beyond. "Better off in the NIT" is akin to saying, "Who cares if so-and-so transferred? We didn't want him, anyway!"

 

[1hawkeye1]

I wrote this opinion piece after the game, and it's in today's paper. I was a little upset on Selection Sunday, but after taking a step back, it's clear that we're better off in the NIT this year.

Commentary: Men?s hoops getting important lesson in NIT - The Daily Iowan

Glad to see more and more people appreciating my viewpoint.

 

[1hawkeye1]

"Me" as recruit? Oh I'm going to Iowa, baby!

"General" recruit? Many more variables to consider but I tend to still land with Iowa.

1) As "historically challenged" as I think many kids are these days, I think Wisky's 1-n-done, this year, has a bigger impression than the "series of NCAA runs".
Without looking it up, did you know Wisky lost in sweet-16 last 2 years? I didn't. 3 & 4 years ago they lost in 2nd round, again, didn't know that until looked it up. You have to go back to 2005 as the last time they cracked the elite-8 (lost). That's pre-puberty to a current recruit.
Point is, the NCAA is exciting every year, while it's being played out. After that, unless it's "your team" (in which case, that's where you're going to commit, anyway) most people have no clue about NCAA success beyond "name brands". Once it's over, it loses most of it's relevance until the following March.

2) I think "general recruit" looks at style of play (Iowa, hands down), program upside (Iowa, hands down), returning players / opportunity to play (Iowa is stacked but, as crazy deep as Fran goes in his rotations, if I'm a confident recruit, I'm thinking I can crack the top-10) and geography (a push), more than NCAA history.

Admittedly biased but it's not a quantum leap to choose Iowa over Wisky.

Don't forget, NIKE camo uniforms. Those seem to be big with recruits these days.

 

[SpiderRico]

<<uhhhh no,...>>

Really? Look at the thread title. Witness the circle jerk going on between the OP and several of the Pavlov's Dogs roaming the boards today.

An NIT run is fun to watch, but it NEVER beats an NCAA appearance, whether one-and-done or Sweet Sixteen and beyond. "Better off in the NIT" is akin to saying, "Who cares if so-and-so transferred? We didn't want him, anyway!"

I think you need to put this in context to what's been happening with Iowa basketball since the miracle shot by NW St in the 2006 tourney. This season doesn't just stand alone in a vacuum. If we were talking about a "typical" Iowa team pre-Alford, then yes, an NIT berth is a disappointment....no doubt. But given what this program has gone through over the last 14 years, I don't think there's anything wrong with fans being excited about an NIT run and thinking that, possibly, because of the youth on this team and the issues with the program simply needing to learn how to win again, that a deep run in the NIT is probably more beneficial than a one and done in the NCAAs.

Now, next year is a whole different story. We now have 3 years of exponential growth in attendance, talent, wins, etc. A 3rd NIT berth would be completely unacceptable given the talent returning and the trajectory arc of the past 3 years.

Just let the fans have their fun and enjoy the opportunity to watch this fun basketball team with great kids head to MSG with a chance to finally win something of significance rather than just peeing in their cheerios.

 

[okeefe4prez]

Just emailed to me by classless opposing fan:

 

[1hawkeye1]

<<uhhhh no,...>>

Really? Look at the thread title. Witness the circle jerk going on between the OP and several of the Pavlov's Dogs roaming the boards today.

An NIT run is fun to watch, but it NEVER beats an NCAA appearance, whether one-and-done or Sweet Sixteen and beyond. "Better off in the NIT" is akin to saying, "Who cares if so-and-so transferred? We didn't want him, anyway!"

Under most circumstances, you are correct. But not this season, with this team. From the weak non-con schedule to the NIT run. Fran has set this team up for success. The NIT is giving it the experience it needs. Look at the development of Woodbury. Look at the move of RDM to PG. It will all pay off next year.

Want to talk circle jerk? Then look no further than those skeet skeeting all over the NCAA tournament. Would it be great to be invited? Hell yeah! But it wouldn't have given this team the valuable development time it needs for a run next year.

Now next season if we are back to defend our NIT championship, I will agree with you 100%. Not this year, however.

Patience, young grasshopper, patience.

 

[kicker22]

Not saying that I value the NIT over the NCAA, which no one does, but there are 4 NCAA teams that will end the season with a win. Entering the next season, I'd rather look back at season before ending as a tournament champion rather than a first round elimination. Whether it's the desired tournament or not, IMO I've never encountered anyone that one a tournament but later said that they'd of rather lost the first round of another tournament then experienced the feeling of winning one.

I'm not saying that the level of competition is equal, but I think in terms accomplishment, any team would rate winning a tournament over simply being invited to play in one. That said, making a deep NIT run and coming up short may not have that same affect. Maybe it's just me, but I can't think of a scenario where I'd rank losing ahead of winning hardware.

 

[ssckelley]

<<uhhhh no,...>>

Really? Look at the thread title. Witness the circle jerk going on between the OP and several of the Pavlov's Dogs roaming the boards today.

An NIT run is fun to watch, but it NEVER beats an NCAA appearance, whether one-and-done or Sweet Sixteen and beyond. "Better off in the NIT" is akin to saying, "Who cares if so-and-so transferred? We didn't want him, anyway!"

So we should all be hanging our heads in shame? Screw that, I am enjoying this ride but that does not mean I am settling for NIT invites. I wanted the Hawks in the NCAA tournament this season, it did not happen, but instead of crying over it the team is playing with a chip on their shoulder. If next year rolls around and we are back in the NIT with Marble, Basabe, and McCabe as seniors then those "Pavlov's Dogs" will be a small pack.

 

[Seth53]

(I'll preface by saying OK4P and I are somewhat friends, have gone to a few IA/NU BB games together and have tailgated before many Iowa games at Kinnick (although with that said, his mom makes more appearances at Ron's that does OK4P, but I digress))....


For argument sake...

Any bowl game "less" than a BCS bowl game = NIT
Any BCS bowl game = NCAA

Have you not enjoyed watching Iowa play and win in many NIT FB bowl games?
In fact, haven't you even traveled to at least one NIT FB bowl game?
Is our FB program solely defined on how many NCAA BCS bowl games it gets to play in?

If you answered yes, yes and no, then I think you need to cut us some slack for not hating on the NIT BB run this year.

That is all....see you in the Fall!

 

[Hawkfromnorwalk]

Here is my stance on it. If a magical genie appeared and said "you have two choices, Iowa will go to the NCAA tourney and will get beat out in the first round, or Iowa will go to the NIT and make it to Madison Square Garden, which would you choose?" It would be hard to pick. Going to the Big Dance is the ultimate goal of all D1 schools but if you explicitly knew you would go home after day one, would it be worth it? Especially if you knew you would make a deep run in the NIT. It's a hard choice. Now, going into selection Sunday, hell yes, I want nothing but the NCAA.

 

[trj]

I think you need to put this in context to what's been happening with Iowa basketball since the miracle shot by NW St in the 2006 tourney. This season doesn't just stand alone in a vacuum. If we were talking about a "typical" Iowa team pre-Alford, then yes, an NIT berth is a disappointment....no doubt. But given what this program has gone through over the last 14 years, I don't think there's anything wrong with fans being excited about an NIT run and thinking that, possibly, because of the youth on this team and the issues with the program simply needing to learn how to win again, that a deep run in the NIT is probably more beneficial than a one and done in the NCAAs.

Now, next year is a whole different story. We now have 3 years of exponential growth in attendance, talent, wins, etc. A 3rd NIT berth would be completely unacceptable given the talent returning and the trajectory arc of the past 3 years.

Just let the fans have their fun and enjoy the opportunity to watch this fun basketball team with great kids head to MSG with a chance to finally win something of significance rather than just peeing in their cheerios.

He acknowledged that this NIT run has been fun, he just isn't blowing his load over it. If anybody is keeping this in context it is him.

 

[WindsorHawk]

Below is the same post I made in one of the other threads on this topic. Also, recruiting is not going to hurt by this NIT run nor would it have been hurt by an NCAA bid IMO. Both can be positive selling points to potential recruits IMO.



I'm loving the NIT run, the wins and all of the other positives. As the season was winding down I always said I would look forward to the NIT games if it's where we landed and I'm not at all surprised we are making a run. I think we will beat Maryland. Baylor looks very tough but they are a homer team so I don't anticipate the same level of play from them in MSG...may lose before they get to us. If they continue to play at their current level it will be a real battle...assuming we both make it.

Now the other side of the equation...I also said I would always take an NCAA bid over an NIT bid. There's no way of knowing what might have been in the NCAA. There are very few teams I've watched and said "I would not want to be playing that team." There have been several teams I've watched and said "We would beat the sh*t out of these guys." Some of the latter are still playing so Iowa could easily still be playing if an NCAA bid had come our way.

I am totally enjoying the NIT run. I would still opt for this team to be in the NCAA if given the choice...even knowing what I know now (NIT) with no guarantees on what would happen in the NCAA. I do think winning the NIT proves a team belonged in the NCAA...pretty sure we've already proven this. I also think the team is going to carry all of this over to next year...being left out of the NCAA, the tough road losses, the NIT run, etc. I suspect we will be very sharp from the opening tip of game 1 until the season ends. If I were on the outside looking in I would not want to face this Iowa team out of conference or in the Big Ten title chase.

 

[okeefe4prez]

(I'll preface by saying OK4P and I are somewhat friends, have gone to a few IA/NU BB games together and have tailgated before many Iowa games at Kinnick (although with that said, his mom makes more appearances at Ron's that does OK4P, but I digress))....


For argument sake...

Any bowl game "less" than a BCS bowl game = NIT
Any BCS bowl game = NCAA

Have you not enjoyed watching Iowa play and win in many NIT FB bowl games?
In fact, haven't you even traveled to at least one NIT FB bowl game?
Is our FB program solely defined on how many NCAA BCS bowl games it gets to play in?

If you answered yes, yes and no, then I think you need to cut us some slack for not hating on the NIT BB run this year.

That is all....see you in the Fall!

Some of the bowls are more like CBI or CIT. I would honestly be hard pressed to watch us play a MAC team in the Pizza Pizza bowl, for instance, and I wouldn't derive a lot of joy out of the 7-6 season. The Missourrah bowl game was about the only one that was not in January that was decent, and to prove no one even watched that, I think Missourrah lost and didn't even drop in the rankings at the end of the season. Sure, every year I hear about these "added practice" arguments but that practice sure doesn't ever seem to translate 9 months later, because as sure as the sun will set this evening, Kurt will choke in a winnable September game unless we have 15 NFL caliber players on the roster.

 

[kicker22]

Maybe I'm foolish, but I can't understand those that say it would mean more to be invited to a tournament and get pummeled in the first round (not saying we would have) and then use that as a major accomplishment, rather than winning another tournament. IMO an invitation to the Dance is nothing more than an invitation to the dance. While it's a pretty accomplishment, it would mean more to me to win 5 games in another tournament.

I simply don't understand those that bash mid-major programs or lesser known conference teams ( ie...Florida Gulf Coast, Albany, and St. Mary's) and play the "they don't belong in the tourament card" before their first game is even played but then say it would be better to be one and done then go to the NIT. IMO when we belittle teams that get to the dance and then fidn themselves making a first round exit the consensus is they don't belong in the tournament. So whats the difference. No one thinks those teams deserved to be there ahead of time but then suddenly we feel it makes our program relevant to simply be invited? Don't understand the logic. Florida Gulf Coast is getting the credit and recognition they're getting because they earned it, not because they were lucky enough to be invited. I simply don't believe that all of a sudden iowa's program becomes validated at a national level if they get a bid. I think winning any tournament holds more value then being invited to one.

 

[okeefe4prez]

Just let the fans have their fun and enjoy the opportunity to watch this fun basketball team with great kids head to MSG with a chance to finally win something of significance rather than just peeing in their cheerios.

I am happy for the team, good for building on next year, rah rah, but for the love of God, the NIT IS NOT SOMETHING OF SIGNIFICANCE.

 

[okeefe4prez]

I think winning any tournament holds more value then being invited to one.

Sorry, I'd rather get a participation ribbon for the upcoming college football playoff than win the Pizza Pizza bowl.

 

[kicker22]

Some of the bowls are more like CBI or CIT. I would honestly be hard pressed to watch us play a MAC team in the Pizza Pizza bowl, for instance, and I wouldn't derive a lot of joy out of the 7-6 season. The Missourrah bowl game was about the only one that was not in January that was decent, and to prove no one even watched that, I think Missourrah lost and didn't even drop in the rankings at the end of the season. Sure, every year I hear about these "added practice" arguments but that practice sure doesn't ever seem to translate 9 months later, because as sure as the sun will set this evening, Kurt will choke in a winnable September game unless we have 15 NFL caliber players on the roster.

I think there's a fine line between football and basketball, but IMO to a basketball team as young as ours I think it only helps them prepare for the future.