Great Win

[99topdawg]

Fran had a stompin' good time!

 

[ssckelley]

Jordan shot 4-8 on two pointers last night. That was the most two point attempts he had in a game all year long. So, I would say he actually drove past his guy and to the hoop more often than any game we have seen so far. A couple of the drives occurred when he was off the ball and Williams was playing the PG position, but Jordan was as aggressive as he has been all year last night.

JB plays very aggressive, he has all year. Yes he made some nice layups last night, I don't remember them being off the dribble but I could be wrong. I remember Cook made a nice pass to JB for an easy layup. But, honestly, JB is not good at driving to the hoop.

Jordan also had 11 assists (career high). He also had at least 3 other passes to Pemsl and Cook that resulted in fouls on missed hoops that would have been assists if the shot had been converted. I would say that qualifies as better than a decent passer.

In using the word "decent" I was trying to say that passing is a strength of JB. No need to get bent out of shape for using the word "decent" the last time I checked that word is a positive one.

Finally, Dickerson was driving by defenders (including Bohannon) in the 1st half. He scored 10 points and was a tough matchup. In the 2nd half, when Iowa went to zone, he basically disappeared. He ended up 3-8 from the field. He had done nothing in the 2nd half (0-3 shooting, 2 turnovers) until he unfortunately was hurt on the drive to the hoop in the 2nd half with 8:16 to go. Iowa adjusted and was able to take away the drives from the top that were hurting them in the 1st half.

Yes, they switched to the zone for all the reasons I listed earlier.

Damn, some of you guys JB cannot do any wrong and you get overly defensive when someone is trying to have a rationale-honest viewpoint.

 

[DDThompson]

JB only committed 1 turnover because he struggled just to get open so he could even get the ball. A big reason why those front court players were bringing the ball down is because JB couldn't shake the guy guarding him. How many times did we see Uhl bring the ball into the front court? Do you see how many screens he needs to shake the guy guarding him just so he can get the ball? Watch him in the front court some time when he doesn't have the ball.

I think all of your observations are pretty spot on.

I think the bold above is true of just about any player getting over-played by the opposing team. I've seen Jok all season needing multiple screens just so he can get the ball.

 

[ssckelley]

I think all of your observations are pretty spot on.

I think the bold above is true of just about any player getting over-played by the opposing team. I've seen Jok all season needing multiple screens just so he can get the ball.

True but Jok isn't very quick either. But you do make a good point on JB being over played, he is starting to attract more attention and it's nice to see he his handling it well and still finding ways to score.

JB is why I'm not worried about losing Jok next year. I see him picking up a lot of the scoring and our post play might be the best in the Big Ten next year.

 

[Robowe]

JB plays very aggressive, he has all year. Yes he made some nice layups last night, I don't remember them being off the dribble but I could be wrong. I remember Cook made a nice pass to JB for an easy layup. But, honestly, JB is not good at driving to the hoop.



In using the word "decent" I was trying to say that passing is a strength of JB. No need to get bent out of shape for using the word "decent" the last time I checked that word is a positive one.



Yes, they switched to the zone for all the reasons I listed earlier.

Damn, some of you guys JB cannot do any wrong and you get overly defensive when someone is trying to have a rationale-honest viewpoint.

Actually, nothing defensive at all. You mentioned to a previous poster about rewatching the game because they may have missed all the times Dickerson drive by defenders. I thought I would point out the Bohannon actually went to the hoop and shot in the lane more often than any other game this year. Just an observation backed up by stats.

I wasn't bent out of shape by 'decent'. I just thought 11 assists with 3 or more missed because layups were missed was worth more than a 'decent'. It's all good.

Jok, Baer, and Pemsl (I believe) got two fouls in the 1st half. I assume Iowa switched to the zone to stop the penetration in the 2nd half. They did that most of the year in the Big 10. Their defense on the perimeter is a weakness currently, but the zone helps with that. Again, good adjustment to try and cover up a weakness. Nice job, coaches.

Dean outlined Jordan's strengths and weaknesses in another post (in another thread, I believe). No need to rehash here. I find it amusing after two games where he combined for 43 points and 21 assists that some posters still feel the need to point them out. Some of the weaknesses will never go away, but good players/teams/coaches know how to take advantage of strengths and hide weaknesses. Hopefully, that will happen in the next 3 years.

 

[NikeHawk21]

JB only committed 1 turnover because he struggled just to get open so he could even get the ball. A big reason why those front court players were bringing the ball down is because JB couldn't shake the guy guarding him. How many times did we see Uhl bring the ball into the front court? Do you see how many screens he needs to shake the guy guarding him just so he can get the ball? Watch him in the front court some time when he doesn't have the ball.

No need to get all defensive on JB, I think he is one heck of a player but a lot of people on here refuse to acknowledge his weaknesses. I've been very clear on here that I think Iowa needs a true PG. JB is one heck of a shooter and is a decent passer but he doesn't have the quickness necessary for a point to go to drive to the basket or guard the opposing PG.

If you didn't see how easily Trey was able to blow by JB then perhaps you should watch the game again. Our guards (not just JB) cannot defend anyone on the perimeter in man to man, the opposing guards blow by their defender and it leads to easy points in the paint when our post player moves over to help.

I agree JBo has a tough time freeing himself from pressure. Those were not the turnovers I remember.

Does JBo have a tough time keeping quicker players in front of him? Sure.

I acknowledge his weaknesses but in my opinion the strengths far outweigh them. Every player on our team has weaknesses. The goal is for the strengths to outweigh the weaknesses. For JBo I think they absolutely do and I'll gladly take him as my PG.

I'm so sick of the "True PG" narrative. I'll argue against that all day.

 

[ssckelley]

I agree JBo has a tough time freeing himself from pressure. Those were not the turnovers I remember.

Does JBo have a tough time keeping quicker players in front of him? Sure.

I acknowledge his weaknesses but in my opinion the strengths far outweigh them. Every player on our team has weaknesses. The goal is for the strengths to outweigh the weaknesses. For JBo I think they absolutely do and I'll gladly take him as my PG.

I'm so sick of the "True PG" narrative. I'll argue against that all day.

Sure JB only got credited with 1 TO but a couple of those TO's were because he was being denied the ball.

Absolutely, JB's strengths far outweigh his weaknesses but I still think he makes a better 2. I think Fran keeps him at the point because he's a much better shooter than CW and right now our best 5 is with him on the court along side Jok.

It sucks that 5656 was allowed to troll so much on here because I think he is the reason why so many people get so defensive when trying to have an honest conversation about JB. I love JB's shot and I was saying this back when JB was struggling and 5656 was accusing him of being a volume scorer.

 

[ssckelley]

Dean outlined Jordan's strengths and weaknesses in another post (in another thread, I believe). No need to rehash here. I find it amusing after two games where he combined for 43 points and 21 assists that some posters still feel the need to point them out. Some of the weaknesses will never go away, but good players/teams/coaches know how to take advantage of strengths and hide weaknesses. Hopefully, that will happen in the next 3 years.

But it's going to keep coming up as long as JB is the point. Unfortunately his weaknesses is not something that can improve much with experience. But he does have a very high basketball IQ, which helps him over come some of them.

Didn't quote the rest because I either agree or all valid points. I'll tell you like I just told Nike I think some of the constant troll job by 5656.

 

[NikeHawk21]

Sure JB only got credited with 1 TO but a couple of those TO's were because he was being denied the ball.

Absolutely, JB's strengths far outweigh his weaknesses but I still think he makes a better 2. I think Fran keeps him at the point because he's a much better shooter than CW and right now our best 5 is with him on the court along side Jok.

It sucks that 5656 was allowed to troll so much on here because I think he is the reason why so many people get so defensive when trying to have an honest conversation about JB. I love JB's shot and I was saying this back when JB was struggling and 5656 was accusing him of being a volume scorer.

I again firmly disagree with the assertion that he is better suited at the 2. Why would you take the ball out of his hands? He averages almost 5 assists per game. If you move him to 2 and get a "True PG" wouldn't we still be in trouble because he'd have to try and guard a bigger guard? I'm sorry he's a point guard whether you like it or not.

17.8 PPG / 7.2 Assists / 2.8 TOPG
Over the last 5 games and we need a new PG?

Again why do you insist on talking about JBo's weaknesses all the time? Every player on our team has weaknesses but we don't beat those to death.

 

[Robowe]

But it's going to keep coming up as long as JB is the point. Unfortunately his weaknesses is not something that can improve much with experience. But he does have a very high basketball IQ, which helps him over come some of them.

Didn't quote the rest because I either agree or all valid points. I'll tell you like I just told Nike I think some of the constant troll job by 5656.

It was nice to see JBo play the 2 for a portion of the game last night. Unfortunately, Williams struggled last night at the 1 when that happened. He got the ball stolen and there was a shot clock violation during that time. Unless Connor can come in and play some PG, or they are able to find another PG if other spots open up, Jordan will be the PG for most of the minutes on this team.

I disagree with the notion that his weaknesses can't be improved upon with experience. I think his defense has improved (slightly) during this year. However, I think Iowa will continue to play a lot of zone due to overall weaknesses in its defense.

 

[ssckelley]

I again firmly disagree with the assertion that he is better suited at the 2. Why would you take the ball out of his hands? He averages almost 5 assists per game. If you move him to 2 and get a "True PG" wouldn't we still be in trouble because he'd have to try and guard a bigger guard? I'm sorry he's a point guard whether you like it or not.

17.8 PPG / 7.2 Assists / 2.8 TOPG
Over the last 5 games and we need a new PG?

Again why do you insist on talking about JBo's weaknesses all the time? Every player on our team has weaknesses but we don't beat those to death.

Damn, you're as bad as 5656 by burying your head in the sand using numbers. Do you not watch the games? All of those numbers will still count if he is playing in the 2 spot. If JB does wind up back at the PG spot next year I won't be crying about it.

If talking about someone's weaknesses is upsetting to you then perhaps an online forum is not a good place for you. The discussions on here are not always lollipops and rainbows.

It was nice to see JBo play the 2 for a portion of the game last night. Unfortunately, Williams struggled last night at the 1 when that happened. He got the ball stolen and there was a shot clock violation during that time. Unless Connor can come in and play some PG, or they are able to find another PG if other spots open up, Jordan will be the PG for most of the minutes on this team.

I disagree with the notion that his weaknesses can't be improved upon with experience. I think his defense has improved (slightly) during this year. However, I think Iowa will continue to play a lot of zone due to overall weaknesses in its defense.

You are probably right, we will probably see JB a lot at the point again next season. The problems with CW is he has no perimeter shot so his opponents play off which stop any dribble penetration. Hopefully he works on that during the off season.

I did use the word "improved much" there are ways of overcoming some of the quickness but not all. You are right, the zone defenses do help.

 

[NikeHawk21]

Damn, you're as bad as 5656 by burying your head in the sand using numbers. Do you not watch the games? All of those numbers will still count if he is playing in the 2 spot. If JB does wind up back at the PG spot next year I won't be crying about it.

If talking about someone's weaknesses is upsetting to you then perhaps an online forum is not a good place for you. The discussions on here are not always lollipops and rainbows.

I watch all of the games. I actually rewatch many a second time.

If you move JBo to the 2 off the ball his assists will certainly go down. That's why I said why would you want to take the ball out of his hands? Do you need me to explain that further?

Secondly, IMO one of JBo's greatest strengths is his ability to shoot off the dribble. As the primarily ball handler that makes him lethal because the defense is always worried about coming out to him. As a 2, without the ball in his hands, he's basically a catch and shoot guy. IMO at the 2 he's basically Brady Ellingson. At the 1 he's a 1st Team All B1G freshman.

Btw, if you want to keep bringing up 5656, the "JBo is a 2" troll was started by him.

I'm not against talking about players weaknesses, but we've talked about JBo's at length around here. Let's talk about his strengths. Maybe I'm just a positive person.

 

[ibahawkeye]

Fran had a stompin' good time!

I saw this when it happened live. Moss had the ball on a bit of a transition and Pete was wide open on the wing and Moss didn't see him. Fran and Pete were both frustrated.

 

[ssckelley]

I watch all of the games. I actually rewatch many a second time.

If you move JBo to the 2 off the ball his assists will certainly go down. That's why I said why would you want to take the ball out of his hands? Do you need me to explain that further?

Secondly, IMO one of JBo's greatest strengths is his ability to shoot off the dribble. As the primarily ball handler that makes him lethal because the defense is always worried about coming out to him. As a 2, without the ball in his hands, he's basically a catch and shoot guy. IMO at the 2 he's basically Brady Ellingson. At the 1 he's a 1st Team All B1G freshman.

Btw, if you want to keep bringing up 5656, the "JBo is a 2" troll was started by him.

I'm not against talking about players weaknesses, but we've talked about JBo's at length around here. Let's talk about his strengths. Maybe I'm just a positive person.

None of this is true, it's very rare JB brings the ball up the court and fires it up. He would still have the ball in his hands quite a bit, just like they do with Jok now at the 2. Ellingson does not just stand and shoot, Fran uses a motion offense and I'm sure JB would look to create his own shot just like he does now along with Jok. His assists could go down anyway since JB will be looking to score a lot more without Jok to throw the ball too.

I don't give a crap if 5656 did start it, I've been saying it all along and I don't use PER or whatever other stats he used to back me up.

 

[docholihawk]

JB plays very aggressive, he has all year. Yes he made some nice layups last night, I don't remember them being off the dribble but I could be wrong. I remember Cook made a nice pass to JB for an easy layup. But, honestly, JB is not good at driving to the hoop.



In using the word "decent" I was trying to say that passing is a strength of JB. No need to get bent out of shape for using the word "decent" the last time I checked that word is a positive one.



Yes, they switched to the zone for all the reasons I listed earlier.

Damn, some of you guys JB cannot do any wrong and you get overly defensive when someone is trying to have a rationale-honest viewpoint.

And vice-versa.

 

[NikeHawk21]

None of this is true, it's very rare JB brings the ball up the court and fires it up. He would still have the ball in his hands quite a bit, just like they do with Jok now at the 2. Ellingson does not just stand and shoot, Fran uses a motion offense and I'm sure JB would look to create his own shot just like he does now along with Jok. His assists could go down anyway since JB will be looking to score a lot more without Jok to throw the ball too.

I don't give a crap if 5656 did start it, I've been saying it all along and I don't use PER or whatever other stats he used to back me up.

Jordan Bohannon shoots at least a couple threes a game off the dribble. Maybe it's you who doesn't watch Iowa games.

Ask yourself this. If his weaknesses are he lacks lateral quickness to defend and also to get by people what does putting him at Shooting Guard do to change that?

If you did watch the game last night there was an interesting discussion by the announcers. They said Fran raves about JBo's ability to run the team. That may be where he was really overlooked in this process. "Run the team." Sounds like a PG to me.

JBo has made the argument for himself. The coaches, the pundits, our coach, and the stats agree. JBo is a good POINT GUARD.

If you want to agree with 5656, be my guest. Just know he's been mostly wrong about everything.

 

[PCHawk]

When the announcers say Iowa could be one of the best teams in the country over the next few years, it's not hyperbole... it's widely considered that by many national basketball peeps.

Jordan Bohannon shoots at least a couple threes a game off the dribble. Maybe it's you who doesn't watch Iowa games.

Ask yourself this. If his weaknesses are he lacks lateral quickness to defend and also to get by people what does putting him at Shooting Guard do to change that?

If you did watch the game last night there was an interesting discussion by the announcers. They said Fran raves about JBo's ability to run the team. That may be where he was really overlooked in this process. "Run the team." Sounds like a PG to me.

JBo has made the argument for himself. The coaches, the pundits, our coach, and the stats agree. JBo is a good POINT GUARD.

If you want to agree with 5656, be my guest. Just know he's been mostly wrong about everything.

I've seen people ask how JB moving to the 2 will mask his weaknesses quite a bit on here but I've never seen anyone respond to it. If he moves to the 2, it won't change his weaknesses one bit, but it will change his strengths for the worse.

 

[trj]

Jeeze you guys. A win is a win. No worse than clobbering some directional school in the pre-conference.

Let's be happy with a win and not a BTTesque flameout.

Jordan Bohannon shoots at least a couple threes a game off the dribble. Maybe it's you who doesn't watch Iowa games.

Ask yourself this. If his weaknesses are he lacks lateral quickness to defend and also to get by people what does putting him at Shooting Guard do to change that?

If you did watch the game last night there was an interesting discussion by the announcers. They said Fran raves about JBo's ability to run the team. That may be where he was really overlooked in this process. "Run the team." Sounds like a PG to me.

JBo has made the argument for himself. The coaches, the pundits, our coach, and the stats agree. JBo is a good POINT GUARD.

If you want to agree with 5656, be my guest. Just know he's been mostly wrong about everything.

At this point some people are only convinced you can play point guard a certain way. Just let it play out you are not going to change their mind.

 

[trj]

I've seen people ask how JB moving to the 2 will mask his weaknesses quite a bit on here but I've never seen anyone respond to it. If he moves to the 2, it won't change his weaknesses one bit, but it will change his strengths for the worse.

When you get a legit answer to that, let me know.

 

[PCHawk]

At this point some people are only convinced you can play point guard a certain way. Just let it play out you are not going to change their mind.

What's weird is no one ever accused Jok of not being a true shooting guard because he can't defend other shooting guards.